*****The Super, Mega, Huge Big 12 Expansion Thread*****

[Rogue52]

I don't understand the love for the Big East on this board. Sure, it's a great fall-back option, but if the Big XII can find stability, it's really a no-brainer.

And don't tell me, "Stability in the Big XII is impossible, so let's go to the Big East anyway." That conference is less stable than ours, it's just no one's first choice for the pickings.

Go take a look at Big East bowl tie-ins and get back to me. Big East should be an implosion option ONLY.

[Cyclonick182]

That Tigerboard post was good IMO. Everyone starting to call Texas' bluff.......

Where it will lead ISU and the Big XII, I don't know any better than anyone else however, Im glad to see teams standing up to Texas. They need a serious reality check.

[el tornado]

Some day teams will realize that superconferences s*** and there will be a push back to 8-team conferences where it is much easier to win a title. And you wouldn't have to fly half way around the country for half of your conference games.

[BCClone]

I don't understand the love for the Big East on this board. Sure, it's a great fall-back option, but if the Big XII can find stability, it's really a no-brainer.

And don't tell me stability is impossible, so let's go to the Big East anyway. That conference is likely less stable than ours. It's just no one from that conference is anyone's first choice for the pickings.

Go take a look at Big East bowl tie-ins and get back to me. Big East should be an implosion option ONLY.

I think it's a belief that we wouldn't have UT and OU riding our rears. We would also be a bigger fish in a smaller pond so the thoughts are we would have a higher winning percentage. What I've gleaned from this.

[bosco]

If OU goes to Pac-12 OSU may want to rethink about following big brother. I think the B12 can still be viable without OU if OSU stays. OSU still gets to recruit Texas. They instantly become a legitimate yearly threat to win the conference. The TV money can still be there since OSU would retain TV sets In Oklahoma.

[cyman05]

I don't understand the love for the Big East on this board. Sure, it's a great fall-back option, but if the Big XII can find stability, it's really a no-brainer.

And don't tell me, "Stability in the Big XII is impossible, so let's go to the Big East anyway." That conference is less stable than ours, it's just no one's first choice for the pickings.

Go take a look at Big East bowl tie-ins and get back to me. Big East should be an implosion option ONLY.

Agreed. I wouldn't mind the idea of ISU in a 12 team big east (minus West Virginia), but it's only a matter of time before the current big east is reduced to Cincinnati, Louisville, South Florida, and TCU. If the Big 12 survives this latest round, you can bet legal assurances will be in it for a fixed number of years. So why join the Big East and play for 3-4 years and go through all this again in 2015 when the Big 10 is saying behind closed doors that they'll set off the next round of musical chairs. If the Big 12 survives this time, you can be assured nobody is leaving for 10 years.

[Cyclonick182]

Agreed. I wouldn't mind the idea of ISU in a 12 team big east (minus West Virginia), but it's only a matter of time before the current big east is reduced to Cincinnati, Louisville, South Florida, and TCU. If the Big 12 survives this latest round, you can bet legal assurances will be in it for a fixed number of years. So why join the Big East and play for 3-4 years and go through all this again in 2015 when the Big 10 is saying behind closed doors that they'll set off the next round of musical chairs. If the Big 12 survives this time, you can be assured nobody is leaving for 10 years.

Id love to believe that but we all thought that was the case after last summer when everyone claimed to be committed to the Big XII and yet here we are. If Tammy is willing to wipe their *** with their committment to the Big XII that fast then I just don't see how OU or UT wouldnt do the same once their best window of opportunity arrives be it next year or 5 years from now.

[InCytful]

Is Mondo Dan Beebe's half brother?

I think Mondo is TT Chancellor Hance and TTRaider is Football Coach Tommie Tubberville. This is as close as it gets to "Who Shot JR" from "Dallas" years ago. The Big XII soap opera goes on...

[cyman05]

Letter: College football fact sheet » Abilene Reporter-News

Let's look at the facts, and learn the truth.
1. Who has made the most money from TV in the Big 12? OU.
2. Who had the idea of unequal revenue distribution? Colorado, A&M and Nebraska.
3. Who consistently voted against equal sharing? UT, Nebraska, OU and A&M.
4. Who lead the charge for a "conference" network in 2006-2007? UT.
5. Why did Nebraska and Colorado leave the Big 12? Not because they were afraid of a network.
6. Nebraska would have started their own network? Yes.
7. Who cried about the PAC-16 deal and ultimately led to it's demise? A&M.
8. Who acted like a petulant child demanding money they didn't deserve last summer? A&M threatened the conference that if they didn't get the $20 million, they were gone. Why did A&M deserve more than Tech, OSU and Kansas?
9. Who disagreed with having an individual school network last year? No one.
10. Who wants their own school network? Everyone.
12. Does the SEC share all TV money equally? No.
13. Do SEC schools control their Tier 3 rights? Yes.
14. Do UF, UA, AU and LSU share their Tier 3 money with the rest of the conference? No.
15. Who signed a TV contract agreement and commitment to the conference while negotiating to go elsewhere? "An Aggie does not lie, cheat or steal, or tolerate those who do." Right.
Now that the truth has set you free, lay the blame where it belongs.

[FDWxMan]

I don't understand the love for the Big East on this board. Sure, it's a great fall-back option, but if the Big XII can find stability, it's really a no-brainer.

And don't tell me, "Stability in the Big XII is impossible, so let's go to the Big East anyway." That conference is less stable than ours, it's just no one's first choice for the pickings.

Go take a look at Big East bowl tie-ins and get back to me. Big East should be an implosion option ONLY.

Yup. If it does happen, ISU better win and win right away.

Assume the money drop-off is only slight, and not significant. Ok fine.

But what happens if ISU doesn't win right away. Everyone just assumes ISU will waltz in and just kick *** to 8 wins a year or whatever.

Recruiting WILL take a dip...at least short term. It will be harder to recruit Texas. It will be harder to recruit kids to play the Big East teams (which the Big East proponents here have already implied are a step down) rather than a Texas or OU.

So you assume there's a recruiting dip in the short term just from the change.

Now you've got to develop new recruiting pipelines east. And, well, if you aren't winning right away...would ISU recruit better struggling in the Big XII with access to Texas, or recruit better struggling in the Big East, locked out of Texas?

So yeah...ISU could go to the Big East and automatically be better...or they could go to the Big East, fall on their face right away, and be in just as deep of a hole with less money and fewer established recruiting pipelines.

[InCytful]

Yup. If it does happen, ISU better win and win right away.

Assume the money drop-off is only slight, and not significant. Ok fine.

But what happens if ISU doesn't win right away. Everyone just assumes ISU will waltz in and just kick *** to 8 wins a year or whatever.

Recruiting WILL take a dip...at least short term. It will be harder to recruit Texas. It will be harder to recruit kids to play the Big East teams (which the Big East proponents here have already implied are a step down) rather than a Texas or OU.

So you assume there's a recruiting dip in the short term just from the change.

Now you've got to develop new recruiting pipelines east. And, well, if you aren't winning right away...would ISU recruit better struggling in the Big XII with access to Texas, or recruit better struggling in the Big East, locked out of Texas?

So yeah...ISU could go to the Big East and automatically be better...or they could go to the Big East, fall on their face right away, and be in just as deep of a hole with less money and fewer established recruiting pipelines.

Haven't followed your whole discussion, but doesn't the Big East have TCU coming in soon? There would still be some access to Texas. We also recruit a few players from FL and CA and we don't have any conference teams there. The recruiting of Texas would be more difficult, for sure, but wouldn't be "locked out". I'm for keeping the Big XII together, but don't think we have to do it to keep access to TX open for recruiting.

[ThatllDoCy]

Yup. If it does happen, ISU better win and win right away.

Assume the money drop-off is only slight, and not significant. Ok fine.

But what happens if ISU doesn't win right away. Everyone just assumes ISU will waltz in and just kick *** to 8 wins a year or whatever.

Recruiting WILL take a dip...at least short term. It will be harder to recruit Texas. It will be harder to recruit kids to play the Big East teams (which the Big East proponents here have already implied are a step down) rather than a Texas or OU.

So you assume there's a recruiting dip in the short term just from the change.

Now you've got to develop new recruiting pipelines east. And, well, if you aren't winning right away...would ISU recruit better struggling in the Big XII with access to Texas, or recruit better struggling in the Big East, locked out of Texas?

So yeah...ISU could go to the Big East and automatically be better...or they could go to the Big East, fall on their face right away, and be in just as deep of a hole with less money and fewer established recruiting pipelines.

We are at a significant disadvantage currently recruiting Texas. What changes? We don't play in Florida but we get some good Florida Recruits. It's a challenge to recruit for everyone.

[cyman05]

This is a must read from the Miss St. prez...I took out a few parts...

Scout.com: A Q&A With MSU President Mark Keenum

What is the current situation in regard to Texas A&M joining the Southeastern Conference?
"Last night, we (the SEC presidents) were called to Atlanta by (SEC) Commissioner Slive to discuss the possibility of accepting the application that had been submitted to the conference by Texas A&M to join the SEC. We were to arrive at 6 pm. As the different presidents and chancellors arrived we gathered together and the commissioner came in and said we have had a late-breaking development. He said we have heard from one of the Big 12 member schools, one of the presidents of one of their schools called and said he would no longer support his earlier agreement to give Texas A&M complete legal waiver to leave the Big 12. He had changed his position and would pursue legal actions against the Southeastern Conference if we were to extend an invitation to Texas A&M. We also heard from the commissioner of the Big 12 and he basically reiterated that a member school had withdrawn their earlier support and he anticipated legal action from that particular school. "So, that was the situation as we entered the meeting last night. It was a complete surprise to all of us because we had received a letter from Dan Beebe, the Commissioner of the Big 12, last Friday, September 2nd, that clearly spelled out that their league had unanimously voted to give Texas A&M complete legal waiver from any potential legal action, allowing them to leave the Big 12 conference. That's what prompted the formal meeting of all the presidents coming to Atlanta and making a decision as to whether or not we wanted to accept Texas A&M as a member of the SEC. Texas A&M had submitted a formal application for admittance to the SEC. But due to the latest development we weren't able to extend that invitation.
"However, we did vote last night. And I believe we sent a very strong message in our action last night. We had a unanimous vote to, basically, say that we would be willing to invite Texas A&M to be a member of the SEC pending a resolution of the legal issues that are still outstanding between them and the Big 12.
"We, basically, said the letter we received (from the Big 12) needs to be reaffirmed by their league. Once that is the case, then we will extend an invitation. But it has to be to our satisfaction that we feel satisfied that we won't be encumbered by lawsuits that will be tied up in courts for years.
"Once the attorneys for the SEC assure all the members (of the SEC) that Texas A&M is legally free and clear to leave their conference we would welcome them into the SEC."

You mentioned it was a unanimous vote by the SEC presidents. What advantage does it give to the SEC and Mississippi State to have Texas A&M join the SEC? I'm guessing it's the prestige of Texas A&M but I also have to assume the money it will generate for the SEC is also a significant part of it.
"I think what you just described (is correct). First of all, Texas A&M is an outstanding institution, academically and athletically. It's a member of the prestigious American Association of Universities, the AAU, which speaks volumes for the quality of its academic programs. And it is obviously a major powerhouse when it comes to collegiate athletics. They've won numerous national NCAA championships in various sports. They are a university that is rich in history and tradition with a huge supportive fanbase. It's a land-grant institution, which is something that I personally like about Texas A&M. Their mission is the same as ours. So, there are a lot of similarities as well as relationships that we already have due to research between our two institutions.


"I also think that it will enhance the value of the conference which will result in additional revenues for the conference and all of its members. I think they bring a tremendous amount of value to the SEC."


When did Texas A&M first contact the SEC about joining the SEC?
"During the spring of 2010 there was talk about this at that time. They contacted us back then about the possibility of joining the SEC. There were discussions between our commissioner and their president at that time. There was also talk about Texas going to the PAC-12 and Oklahoma possibly going to the PAC-12 to form a 16-team league. So, Texas A&M reached out to us at that time. During the course of the summer the Big 12 got together and said they would stay together. This was after Nebraska and Colorado left. The remaining teams got together and decided they would stick together. They then signed a tv deal with FOXSports. That was the end of it until probably sometime during the summer when Texas A&M reached out to our commissioner and told him they wanted to leave the Big 12. They asked him if the SEC would be interested in them if they decided to leave the Big 12. That started the process for us as a league."


Do you feel like their leaving will have a domino affect on other leagues?
"I think it clearly will. I don't think there is any question about that."
Why do you believe that?
"I think there is a high degree of probability that you will see further shifting. Again, the way I understand it, Texas A&M is leaving the Big 12. So, they are either going to the SEC, the PAC-12 or somewhere or they will be an independent. Texas A&M has made it very clear that they don't want to be a member of the Big 12 any longer. That in itself will have a major impact on major college conferences."

[InCytful]

This is a must read from the Miss St. prez...I took out a few parts...

Scout.com: A Q&A With MSU President Mark Keenum

What is the current situation in regard to Texas A&M joining the Southeastern Conference?
"Last night, we (the SEC presidents) were called to Atlanta by (SEC) Commissioner Slive to discuss the possibility of accepting the application that had been submitted to the conference by Texas A&M to join the SEC. We were to arrive at 6 pm. As the different presidents and chancellors arrived we gathered together and the commissioner came in and said we have had a late-breaking development. He said we have heard from one of the Big 12 member schools, one of the presidents of one of their schools called and said he would no longer support his earlier agreement to give Texas A&M complete legal waiver to leave the Big 12. He had changed his position and would pursue legal actions against the Southeastern Conference if we were to extend an invitation to Texas A&M. We also heard from the commissioner of the Big 12 and he basically reiterated that a member school had withdrawn their earlier support and he anticipated legal action from that particular school. "So, that was the situation as we entered the meeting last night. It was a complete surprise to all of us because we had received a letter from Dan Beebe, the Commissioner of the Big 12, last Friday, September 2nd, that clearly spelled out that their league had unanimously voted to give Texas A&M complete legal waiver from any potential legal action, allowing them to leave the Big 12 conference. That's what prompted the formal meeting of all the presidents coming to Atlanta and making a decision as to whether or not we wanted to accept Texas A&M as a member of the SEC. Texas A&M had submitted a formal application for admittance to the SEC. But due to the latest development we weren't able to extend that invitation.
"However, we did vote last night. And I believe we sent a very strong message in our action last night. We had a unanimous vote to, basically, say that we would be willing to invite Texas A&M to be a member of the SEC pending a resolution of the legal issues that are still outstanding between them and the Big 12.
"We, basically, said the letter we received (from the Big 12) needs to be reaffirmed by their league. Once that is the case, then we will extend an invitation. But it has to be to our satisfaction that we feel satisfied that we won't be encumbered by lawsuits that will be tied up in courts for years.
"Once the attorneys for the SEC assure all the members (of the SEC) that Texas A&M is legally free and clear to leave their conference we would welcome them into the SEC."

You mentioned it was a unanimous vote by the SEC presidents. What advantage does it give to the SEC and Mississippi State to have Texas A&M join the SEC? I'm guessing it's the prestige of Texas A&M but I also have to assume the money it will generate for the SEC is also a significant part of it.
"I think what you just described (is correct). First of all, Texas A&M is an outstanding institution, academically and athletically. It's a member of the prestigious American Association of Universities, the AAU, which speaks volumes for the quality of its academic programs. And it is obviously a major powerhouse when it comes to collegiate athletics. They've won numerous national NCAA championships in various sports. They are a university that is rich in history and tradition with a huge supportive fanbase. It's a land-grant institution, which is something that I personally like about Texas A&M. Their mission is the same as ours. So, there are a lot of similarities as well as relationships that we already have due to research between our two institutions.


"I also think that it will enhance the value of the conference which will result in additional revenues for the conference and all of its members. I think they bring a tremendous amount of value to the SEC."


When did Texas A&M first contact the SEC about joining the SEC?
"During the spring of 2010 there was talk about this at that time. They contacted us back then about the possibility of joining the SEC. There were discussions between our commissioner and their president at that time. There was also talk about Texas going to the PAC-12 and Oklahoma possibly going to the PAC-12 to form a 16-team league. So, Texas A&M reached out to us at that time. During the course of the summer the Big 12 got together and said they would stay together. This was after Nebraska and Colorado left. The remaining teams got together and decided they would stick together. They then signed a tv deal with FOXSports. That was the end of it until probably sometime during the summer when Texas A&M reached out to our commissioner and told him they wanted to leave the Big 12. They asked him if the SEC would be interested in them if they decided to leave the Big 12. That started the process for us as a league."


Do you feel like their leaving will have a domino affect on other leagues?
"I think it clearly will. I don't think there is any question about that."
Why do you believe that?
"I think there is a high degree of probability that you will see further shifting. Again, the way I understand it, Texas A&M is leaving the Big 12. So, they are either going to the SEC, the PAC-12 or somewhere or they will be an independent. Texas A&M has made it very clear that they don't want to be a member of the Big 12 any longer. That in itself will have a major impact on major college conferences."

Interesting that he mentions A&M going anywhere but the Big XII. Independent? That is interesting but I don't see how they make that work. PAC-12 has never mentioned adding them, and would have the same qualms as the SEC does.

[kilgore_trout]

why is it a must read? is it pretend day?

[quote=cyman05;2380147]This is a must read from the Miss St. prez...I took out a few parts...

Scout.com: A Q&A With MSU President Mark Keenum