Sounds like Miami has said they would come to Big 12 if invitation was made and that

[swarthmoreCY]

TCU and WV and the grant of rights that came from that scramble are what are allowing us to have a realistic shot at the Florida schools now. We were literally days from destruction and had to make some quick tough calls that are looking like they might pay off.

Again, that panic and mindset of the Big 12 leaders is part of my point. No one ever forced a Big 12 member to look elsewhere- the Big 12 schools and leaders that had a straying eye (or left) are the Big 12. If you think TCU straight-up added more value long-term than UL, fine, but the Big 12 was holding its own hand to the fire and TCU was not selected in regards to growing the brand of the conference.

[everyyard]

Again, that panic and mindset of the Big 12 leaders is part of my point. No one ever forced a Big 12 member to look elsewhere- the Big 12 schools and leaders that had a straying eye (or left) are the Big 12. If you think TCU straight-up added more value long-term than UL, fine, but the Big 12 was holding its own hand to the fire and TCU was not selected in regards to growing the brand of the conference.

I guess I don't see your point. It was unfortunate the BigXII almost fell apart. TCU was what was available. L-ville would have done nothing for us and still won't. I would have loved to add FSU back then but that wasn't going to happen until we fixed our ****. so...

[swarthmoreCY]

I guess I don't see your point. It was unfortunate the BigXII almost fell apart. TCU was what was available. L-ville would have done nothing for us and still won't. I would have loved to add FSU back then but that wasn't going to happen until we fixed our ****. so...

My point is UL would have done more for the conference than TCU, and thus it was a poor job in looking out for the best interest of the Big 12 by Big 12 leaders for them to want (or think they needed) TCU over UL in 2011.

[everyyard]

My point is UL would have done more for the conference than TCU, and thus it was a poor job in looking out for the best interest of the Big 12 by Big 12 leaders for them to want (or think they needed) TCU over UL in 2011.

Ok. If that is your point then I think we can just agree to disagree. I have no special love or hate for either school but I clearly see the benefits TCU gave us over UL.

[swarthmoreCY]

Ok. If that is your point then I think we can just agree to disagree. I have no special love or hate for either school but I clearly see the benefits TCU gave us over UL.

Yes, I suppose we must agree to disagree, as TCU's benefits were based on emotion, not what is good for the conference. For merely a short-term ISU-centric view, TCU was preferred. Non-existent basketball program with no support and another winnable game in Texas against a non-power with less fan support than ISU. East division here we come.

[cyatheart]

The WV "insiders" are jerk offs but they can be entertaining. Would be fun to see Miami roll into Ames, Ia in early November for a night game and have it be about 20 degrees. Can't imagine that ever happening though.

[acgclone]

Ok. If that is your point then I think we can just agree to disagree. I have no special love or hate for either school but I clearly see the benefits TCU gave us over UL.

You can't really think that TCU brings more added value than Louisville can you?

[BooneCy]

I think Louisville's potential doesn't have as high of a ceiling as TCU might do to their location.

[SyracuseCyclone]

If the Big 12 flips Miami... they'll end up getting someone better than Miami when they add 5 more ACC schools to make 16. Only 4 spots left in B1G and SEC. Big 12 is guaranteed one of UVA, GT, UNC, Clemson, FSU if the ACC implodes.

I would just hope the Big 12 does the right thing and takes my Orangemen over Pitt and their empty *** Heinz Field to get to 16 should it happen.


Big 12 is toast once OU/OSU go to the Big Ten or ND commits to the ACC full time b/c of the playoff and likely brings Texas with them.

Flipping Miami is probaby the best chance of avoiding that. UVA, UNC, Clemson, FSU, GT will all 100% say no to the Big 12. Miami might say yes.

HOWEVER...when Miami left the Big East they made a huge point about academics and how they wanted to be part of the ACC for that reason. So the academics might be enough to make them turn down a Big 12 bid.

If Miami left and uconn got a ACC invite that would seal the fate as most ACC schools refuse to be in a conference with that joke of a school and would be setting up bids to other leagues immediately. If Miami leaves ACC is forced to stay at 13 teams.

[everyyard]

You can't really think that TCU brings more added value than Louisville can you?

Yes. I don't care if they have a larger fan base and AD budget. They get the north teams south and the south teams get to stay south. Texas HATES having to come to little Ames and Manhatten and OU does too. They would equally hate going to Louisville. We don't gain anything with UL either. It's not like they are that close. I am sure if you asked coach rhoads would he rather take his team every other year to Texas or Louisville he would say Texas every day of the week. Did we add a media market? Not really. But Louisville wouldn't have added revenue enough to offset them either or we would have asked them too. I can't believe how many people think UL is that great. Great enough that they had to beg their way into an ACC that is falling apart.

[trajanJ]

If the Big 12 flips Miami... they'll end up getting someone better than Miami when they add 5 more ACC schools to make 16. Only 4 spots left in B1G and SEC. Big 12 is guaranteed one of UVA, GT, UNC, Clemson, FSU if the ACC implodes.

I would just hope the Big 12 does the right thing and takes my Orangemen over Pitt and their empty *** Heinz Field to get to 16 should it happen.


Big 12 is toast once OU/OSU go to the Big Ten or ND commits to the ACC full time b/c of the playoff and likely brings Texas with them.

Flipping Miami is probaby the best chance of avoiding that. UVA, UNC, Clemson, FSU, GT will all 100% say no to the Big 12. Miami might say yes.

HOWEVER...when Miami left the Big East they made a huge point about academics and how they wanted to be part of the ACC for that reason. So the academics might be enough to make them turn down a Big 12 bid.

If Miami left and uconn got a ACC invite that would seal the fate as most ACC schools refuse to be in a conference with that joke of a school and would be setting up bids to other leagues immediately. If Miami leaves ACC is forced to stay at 13 teams.

The Big 10 has never been interested in OU/OSU. They don't border any Big 10 schools and they aren't close to AAU.

[swarthmoreCY]

Yes. I don't care if they have a larger fan base and AD budget. They get the north teams south and the south teams get to stay south. Texas HATES having to come to little Ames and Manhatten and OU does too. They would equally hate going to Louisville. We don't gain anything with UL either. It's not like they are that close. I am sure if you asked coach rhoads would he rather take his team every other year to Texas or Louisville he would say Texas every day of the week. Did we add a media market? Not really. But Louisville wouldn't have added revenue enough to offset them either or we would have asked them too. I can't believe how many people think UL is that great. Great enough that they had to beg their way into an ACC that is falling apart.

TCU was begging to get into UL's conference before the Big 12 gave them a hand-out.
What coach Rhoads wants does not equate to what is better for the conference, neither does basing expansion on what a few conference schools want in terms of road trips. Remaining viewed as the little Texoma conference is not good for the Big 12. UL would have continued to expand the Big 12 with a school with more value, success, fans, and money going to athletics than TCU.

[everyyard]

TCU was begging to get into UL's conference before the Big 12 gave them a hand-out.
What coach Rhoads wants does not equate to what is better for the conference, neither does basing expansion on what a few conference schools want in terms of road trips. Remaining viewed as the little Texoma conference is not good for the Big 12. UL would have continued to expand the Big 12 with a school with more value, success, fans, and money than TCU.

if they would add value we would have added them even with TCU and WV. We only have 10 teams and plenty of room for at least 2 teams if they would add more than they take...which UL would not. TCU doesn't either but they gave us other advantages the conference needed at the time...which is why they were added.

[swarthmoreCY]

if they would add value we would have added them even with TCU and WV. We only have 10 teams and plenty of room for at least 2 teams if they would add more than they take...which UL would not. TCU doesn't either but they gave us other advantages the conference needed at the time...which is why they were added.

No, the only question is would they add more value than TCU? Absolutely. They should have gotten TCU's spot. Again, TCU's "other" advantages that the conference needed at the time were emotional and self-inflicted. Almost on the verge of shooting the arrow then painting the target. Now, if TCU really added value, sure keep on going to 11. But, TCU does not add more than they take and has no potential to. Any success they have at growing their brand will come at the expense of the existing Big 12 teams in the area. Compared to UL they are an equal football program with less fans, non-existent basketball program (with no fans), redundant in terms of markets, and did not fit with future eastern expansion.

[IAStubborn]

We need to stop this "shouldnt have taken tcu" crap. Fact is we did and they are now our Big 12 brother. How would you like other members questioning our worthiness. Debate louisville on the merits all you want, we may still end up with them, but dont make it about them vs. TCU.