5% Tuition Jump Just a Start

[CloneIce]

Iowa public University's are a bargain --- it's about time the students started to really ante-up.

Its been going on for quite some time if you were paying attention. They have been anteing up more year after year. From the time my brother started in '96, to the time I graduated in '05, the cost of tuition and fees basically doubled.

[IcSyU]

Iowa public University's are a bargain --- it's about time the students started to really ante-up.

Oh really? This disagrees:



Iowa's public Universities are among the crappiest in terms of financial aid vs cost of attendance.

[brianhos]

This is sad. Student needs seem to be an afterthought these days.

This is what I tell the Iowa St foundation every time they call me asking for money. You treated me like a number while I was in school, and did not give a crap whether or not I graduated, and NOW you want my money?

[Tornado man]

Its true. The State does not support its Universities the same way it used to (and this is true for many other states as well). Education is not the priority it once was.

And an Iowa taxpayer might ask:
1. Why do we need duplicate sets of administration, like presidents and all those VP's, at all three regents universities?
2. Why do we need duplicate colleges/departments like business, engineering, etc. at both ISU and U of I?

People don't want to make hard decisions about our universities' duplication; instead, the just protect their own campuses like kingdoms - this doesn't lend itself to credibility with the public.

[IcSyU]

And an Iowa taxpayer might ask:
1. Why do we need duplicate sets of administration, like presidents and all those VP's, at all three regents universities?
2. Why do we need duplicate colleges/departments like business, engineering, etc. at both ISU and U of I?

People don't want to make hard decisions about our universities' duplication; instead, the just protect their own campuses like kingdoms - this doesn't lend itself to credibility with the public.

I have a better question...why do we need the Regents?

I can understand each school having their own President. Its not like Illinois, Bradley, Illinois State, etc. all have one President.

And now they're so far in the game they don't have the infrastructure at a single university to allow for all of the (for example) business departments to merge. I'm still trying to figure out why UNI exists for anything but teachers. You can lump their business crap in with Iowa and Iowa State, and the same with all the liberal arts stuff.

Iowa State isn't any better within the institution with duplication. For example, why can't marketing and advertising be one major? They finally got supply chain management figured out. Why does Iowa State carry majors that graduate single digits of people each year? Why does each college need a separate career services offices? Why does the College of Business for example need a communications lab? Do we not have an English department?

[alarson]

And an Iowa taxpayer might ask:
1. Why do we need duplicate sets of administration, like presidents and all those VP's, at all three regents universities?
2. Why do we need duplicate colleges/departments like business, engineering, etc. at both ISU and U of I?

People don't want to make hard decisions about our universities' duplication; instead, the just protect their own campuses like kingdoms - this doesn't lend itself to credibility with the public.

For major public universities its good for both to have a business college, especially since that becomes a 'fallback major' for a lot of students. There'd be a lot of transferring between schools that would be forced if you eliminated all duplication, especially of major colleges like business, which isnt very good for students. Not to mention i doubt either school has the means to meet the demand for both schools combined business colleges.

[SalzundPfeffer]

And an Iowa taxpayer might ask:
1. Why do we need duplicate sets of administration, like presidents and all those VP's, at all three regents universities?
2. Why do we need duplicate colleges/departments like business, engineering, etc. at both ISU and U of I?

People don't want to make hard decisions about our universities' duplication; instead, the just protect their own campuses like kingdoms - this doesn't lend itself to credibility with the public.

You hit the nail squarely on the head.

Just wondering if their logic would be the same if, for example, engineering students didn't make more, on average, than the typical four/five year student when they graduated. For some reason I believe deep down the universities think these students should share more of the burden. I feel like its almost punishment and may make prospective students think otherwise about these majors...

I've thought alot about duplication in our state university system. After all, they are administered by one entity, The State of Iowa. I think it’s redundant that both ISU and Iowa offer engineering programs. It would be completely different if the two schools were private. Is it a fair assumption that the main reason you choose Iowa over ISU for engineering is a student’s allegiance to black&gold? There really is no logic behind that decision. Its a completely emotional decision. Maybe there is a biomedical engineering appeal, but that could be absorbed into the medical program as graduate study.

This goes both ways. ISU could sacrifice certain programs to UNI and Iowa and vise versa. This already exists for vetmed, medicine and law.

[IcSyU]

Engineering and business have differential tuition to make class sizes smaller because people ******* classes were too big and it was a tougher learning environment. Instead of telling those students to start at DMACC and transfer in, Iowa State just decided to drill the students with a ton higher tuition (which students had no say in) to hire more instructors to cut down on huge lectures.

[JBone84]

Engineering and business have differential tuition to make class sizes smaller because people ******* classes were too big and it was a tougher learning environment. Instead of telling those students to start at DMACC and transfer in, Iowa State just decided to drill the students with a ton higher tuition (which students had no say in) to hire more instructors to cut down on huge lectures.

Actually, there were two open forums for student comment, as I recall. I attended the first one, in which there were about 20 people, approximately four were current students. We (the students) voiced our concern and Dean Kushner basically said that it was going to happen anyway, so deal with it. The line they kept repeating was that it would only equate to approximately two weeks of our first job's salary, so its not a big deal but a "fair" fee. However, when I voiced the opinion that College of Engineering faculty sacrifice two weeks of their salary each year as a show of solidarity and "fairness", there were no volunteers. I also suggested that they start charging the kids who got better grades more money, since they would be earning more than their counterparts after graduation and that would be a logical next step of "fairness".

Also, the differential tuition was not to cut down on huge lectures, it was presented as necessary because it costs more to educate engineers.

That was awfully nice of Dean Kushner to bail on the College of Engineering just a few short years after coming in new to ISU as Dean.

[IcSyU]

Actually, there were two open forums for student comment, as I recall. I attended the first one, in which there were about 20 people, approximately four were current students. We (the students) voiced our concern and Dean Kushner basically said that it was going to happen anyway, so deal with it. The line they kept repeating was that it would only equate to approximately two weeks of our first job's salary, so its not a big deal but a "fair" fee. However, when I voiced the opinion that College of Engineering faculty sacrifice two weeks of their salary each year as a show of solidarity and "fairness", there were no volunteers. I also suggested that they start charging the kids who got better grades more money, since they would be earning more than their counterparts after graduation and that would be a logical next step of "fairness".

Also, the differential tuition was not to cut down on huge lectures, it was presented as necessary because it costs more to educate engineers.

That was awfully nice of Dean Kushner to bail on the College of Engineering just a few short years after coming in new to ISU as Dean.

Sorry, I forgot to mention I was talking on the CoB side since I know that one up close and personal. It should start with engineering and business have differential tuition and then go into my minor rant.

I don't recall the CoB mentioning more than maybe an e-mail saying, "Oh by the way, our feedback says students don't like huge lectures so we're doing this to get rid of them." I have a feeling I could get a **** load of students to provide feedback that they'd love a full bar in Gerdin, but I don't see them acting on making that happen anytime in the near future.

[JBone84]

Sorry, I forgot to mention I was talking on the CoB side since I know that one up close and personal. It should start with engineering and business have differential tuition and then go into my minor rant.

I don't recall the CoB mentioning more than maybe an e-mail saying, "Oh by the way, our feedback says students don't like huge lectures so we're doing this to get rid of them." I have a feeling I could get a **** load of students to provide feedback that they'd love a full bar in Gerdin, but I don't see them acting on making that happen anytime in the near future.

I see - sorry for the misunderstanding. My knowledge of the subject is limited to the CoE, since I graduated after only enduring one sodomizing semester of differential tuition.

[BryceC]

This is an excellent comparison, and will be the next crisis IMO. You had people taking on loans they couldn't afford for houses that were very overpriced. You are going to start seeing students taking on loans that they will have to default on for education that was far overpriced.

Can't discharge most student loans through bankruptcy. I think we're just going to see a generation of people paying off student loans that they never should have taken in the first place, and it being a huge economic burden on them for decades or more.

[Tornado man]

I've thought alot about duplication in our state university system. After all, they are administered by one entity, The State of Iowa. I think it’s redundant that both ISU and Iowa offer engineering programs. It would be completely different if the two schools were private. Is it a fair assumption that the main reason you choose Iowa over ISU for engineering is a student’s allegiance to black&gold? There really is no logic behind that decision. Its a completely emotional decision. Maybe there is a biomedical engineering appeal, but that could be absorbed into the medical program as graduate study.

This goes both ways. ISU could sacrifice certain programs to UNI and Iowa and vise versa. This already exists for vetmed, medicine and law.

I've heard from more than one ISU engineering prof wondering why the Iowa taxpayer pays to fund competing, high-powered engineering programs at Iowa; I imagine the same questions are asked in Iowa City about our business college or some humanities departments.
But that's all they are: whispers or guarded conversations. No one wants to bring it up in the open.

[alarson]

I've heard from more than one ISU engineering prof wondering why the Iowa taxpayer pays to fund competing, high-powered engineering programs at Iowa; I imagine the same questions are asked in Iowa City about our business college or some humanities departments.
But that's all they are: whispers or guarded conversations. No one wants to bring it up in the open.

I would agree about engineering, a specialized field. I would not agree about business where there is more than enough demand for both to have it.

[IcSyU]

Can't discharge most student loans through bankruptcy. I think we're just going to see a generation of people paying off student loans that they never should have taken in the first place, and it being a huge economic burden on them for decades or more.

People that rack up $50,000 in student loan debt to get a degree where they can only expect $35,000/year in salary will never make sense to me. Sure, a degree from Iowa State sounds cool and all, but if you could've gotten the same degree from a community college at a fraction of the cost, you screwed up (accounting would actually be a decent example...everyone who doesn't have LPA/CPA/etc. designation is just another person with an accounting degree. A Masters degree doesn't separate you from anything because you just look like someone who couldn't hack it on the CPA exam).

I know I have a friend at Iowa State and he just wants to be a police officer. He's taking on loans to pay for his apartment as well as tuition for his criminal justice degree that he could've gotten for a fraction of the cost by going to Iowa Central or NIACC.