LickLiter takes a jab at the hawk fans

DaddyMac · 12-10-2007, 09:36 AM

Originally Posted by cyfanatic

Living in Cedar Rapids (the middle of Hawkville), I don't know a single Iowa fan who isn't happy that TL is their coach and they understand it was going to take time. They will be there...but the entire Alford debacle is still fresh in their memories. Any coach other that StevieBoy would have made them happy!

Yeah - I'd be happy with TL over SA as well - knowing what we know now.

Question is, how many hawk fans weren't THRILLED when SA was hired?

Anyone? Anyone?

Most were making Final Four reservations for the upcoming season....

cyfanatic · 12-10-2007, 09:41 AM

Originally Posted by rd4isu

What's their excuse now? Before it was "well I don't support Steve Alford". I'm constantly trying to engage my Hawk coworkers in their basketball team but the standard response I get is "I don't really follow basketball, I'm a football guy".

I hear that a lot too. But a few years of apathy can do that to a program! I have not been to Hilton yet this season but I have heard from people on this board that Hilton "Magic" is dead and so on (maybe that is just frustration after a tough game). I am not trying to be a Hawk-apologist (that job would take more than a lifetime of work) but just being realistic. Alford KILLED that program...which I really enjoyed and I kind of miss him because of that. TL has to do more than rebuild the team...he has to rebuild the entire program. He certainly knows basketball (based on his record of success)...but does he have the personality to create excitement throughout the fanbase? We will see...

cyfanatic · 12-10-2007, 09:42 AM

Originally Posted by DaddyMac

Yeah - I'd be happy with TL over SA as well - knowing what we know now.

Question is, how many hawk fans weren't THRILLED when SA was hired?

Anyone? Anyone?

Most were making Final Four reservations for the upcoming season....

That is so true! OMG...it was like they had hired the next John Wooden...wait...if you would have asked SA he would have told you they did hire the next John Wooden!

I really do miss him in IC...

iceclone · 12-10-2007, 09:43 AM

Originally Posted by cyfanatic

There is a reason he took the Iowa job...1.2 million of them! Wasn't he making in the $200,000 range at Butler? He can take the Iowa job for 5 years and if it doesn't work out then he could easily get a job similar to the Butler job.

As much as I hate the Hawks...that isn't a bad job to take. The question for him is going to be the same as GMac's...can each of them recruit the types of kids that fit their system and will allow them to be competitive in their leagues? We don't know yet...GMac has done alright so far...but he has a long way to go too! And I am THRILLED that GMac is our coach...but honestly, isn't the jury still out on him?

The fact that they had to pay that much for a coach from the Horizon league seems to indicate it was perceived to be a bad job to take. Either that or their AD just really, really bad at negotiating.

I do think Lickliter is a very good coach, and that he'll be successful at Iowa. He just won't be successful enough to live up to the unrealistic expectations of Iowa fans.

cyfanatic · 12-10-2007, 09:47 AM

Originally Posted by iceclone

The fact that they had to pay that much for a coach from the Horizon league seems to indicate it was perceived to be a bad job to take. Either that or their AD just really, really bad at negotiating.

I do think Lickliter is a very good coach, and that he'll be successful at Iowa. He just won't be successful enough to live up to the unrealistic expectations of Iowa fans.

I argue with Iowa fans about that very same thing! There were ZERO public reports of TL interviewing with other programs or that any other program was going to chase TL. So who was Iowa negotiating against...themselves? How did it end up at $1.2 million? Minnesota gave Tubby Smith about $2.5 million around that time so maybe that influenced it a bit? No matter what it makes me feel "cheap" that GMac does't approach the $1 million mark (he doesn't does he?). That said...if GMac wins and builds a strong program JP will pay him for sure!

iceclone · 12-10-2007, 10:04 AM

Originally Posted by cyfanatic

I argue with Iowa fans about that very same thing! There were ZERO public reports of TL interviewing with other programs or that any other program was going to chase TL. So who was Iowa negotiating against...themselves? How did it end up at $1.2 million? Minnesota gave Tubby Smith about $2.5 million around that time so maybe that influenced it a bit? No matter what it makes me feel "cheap" that GMac does't approach the $1 million mark (he doesn't does he?). That said...if GMac wins and builds a strong program JLP will pay him for sure!

The normal procedure for coaches moving up from a lower level conference is that they are guaranteed relatively little, have large incentives based on success, but must prove themselves at the higher level before receiving large guaranteed contracts. If he lives up to Jamie's expectations (we all hope), GMac will have a much more guaranteed money in 3 years or so.

Tubby is a different case since he had already won at the higher level.

The only logical reason I can come up with for Lickliter's contract, is that Iowa had difficulty attracting a coach, and were forced to use guaranteed money to lure someone to accept the position.

Of course, none of that means Lickliter isn’t a quality coach. It is just a reflection of how the Iowa basketball program was perceived by other coaches.

copenhagen · 12-10-2007, 10:13 AM

of the rich yuppies like Bowelsby did. Iowa screwed over the avg fan in fb and bb with their money grubing now their phony new base doesnt show. Pollard better watch out hes starting to do the same, one or two no improvement bad fb yrs and you will see all the 'golden circle' crowd and trophy wifes will split. I too heard Lickliter say with sarcasm and quite disbelief the puny pathetic crowds at Carver and said we been to many away games now and seen decent loud crowds. You could tell in his voice he was really hurt and embaressed by the crowds so far.

cyfanatic · 12-10-2007, 10:18 AM

Originally Posted by iceclone

Tubby is a different case since he had already won at the higher level.

The Tubby situation will be interesting to watch. They will expect some serious winning up north for that kind of cash. I always thought Tubby was a great coach but the past couple of years seemed different? Maybe I let all the harping and huge expectations taint my opinion of him...but if the Gophers were going to quickly get back on the scene of MBB that was the type of hire that might do that. But it could also implode!

wonkadog · 12-10-2007, 11:00 AM

You've been listening to Vitale too much if you think Tubby is a really good coach. Seems to be a great recruiter for sure though. I'm actually kind of joking, he could be the best coach in the country for all I know but I grew to hate him and Kentucky just as much as Duke recently.

SouthernHawk · 12-10-2007, 03:21 PM

Originally Posted by bostinelosd

I get that alot too. But I bet if the Hawk BBall team was conference champion with hopes for NCAA championships, they would be all bball.

Kinda like how before this season, ISU averaged only 30,000 or so fans per game for football? ISU is a "basketball school", but how quickly would that change if all of the sudden the football program started winning championships and the basketball team fell into the abyss?

ISUFan22 · 12-10-2007, 03:23 PM

Originally Posted by SouthernHawk

Kinda like how before this season, ISU averaged only 30,000 or so fans per game for football? ISU is a "basketball school", but how quickly would that change if all of the sudden the football program started winning championships and the basketball team fell into the abyss?

We were absolutely horrible last year and this year - fans showed up in droves this season. ISU is supporting their new coach in both football and basketball.

Iowa fans are not doing that right now - not even close.

cyfanatic · 12-10-2007, 03:25 PM

Originally Posted by wonkadog

You've been listening to Vitale too much if you think Tubby is a really good coach. Seems to be a great recruiter for sure though. I'm actually kind of joking, he could be the best coach in the country for all I know but I grew to hate him and Kentucky just as much as Duke recently.

I guess I wasn't clear...I agree with you about whether or not he is a great coach during the games. That is why I just feel like the Tubby/Minnesota marriage could be a disaster. I am not sure why I feel this way...but I could see it happening.

Minnesota has had a strange calendar year for sure...

bostinelosd · 12-10-2007, 03:25 PM

Originally Posted by SouthernHawk

Kinda like how before this season, ISU averaged only 30,000 or so fans per game for football? ISU is a "basketball school", but how quickly would that change if all of the sudden the football program started winning championships and the basketball team fell into the abyss?

I hope to God that doesnt happen. I want all sports to excel. I think most ISU fans support both fairly well. There are a few fairweather fans out there, but we have become so accustomed to teams that struggle we support them no matter what. With UI bball I dont see the support at all. It just seems if they dont win right away noone supports them.

SouthernHawk · 12-10-2007, 03:28 PM

Originally Posted by ISUFan22

We were absolutely horrible last year and this year - fans showed up in droves this season. ISU is supporting their new coach in both football and basketball.

Iowa fans are not doing that right now - not even close.

'm not going to argue that JP is a marketing genius. He really got things going with fan support and all that. Plus, there were times that football tickets in JTS cost less than a weeknight basketball ticket in CHA. I'm not sure which I would rather do - spend 10 bucks to watch ISU play Colorado (which wasn't a sell out), or spend $25.00 on a weeknight at 8:00 and watch Iowa play Northern Colorado.

My point isn't that ISU can't support their football team - it's that when ISU had a very similar marketing scheme to Barta's, the situations were very similar. The better the team on the field, the more people in the stands.

cyfanatic · 12-10-2007, 03:29 PM

Originally Posted by SouthernHawk

Kinda like how before this season, ISU averaged only 30,000 or so fans per game for football? ISU is a "basketball school", but how quickly would that change if all of the sudden the football program started winning championships and the basketball team fell into the abyss?

Hawk fans would know! Hayden's last year was ugly at Kinnick! The place looked empty! Even KF's first two years tickets were more than available. Iowa even sold half-priced tickets to games at the end of those seasons. Then the "magic" happened and the place was always sold out. One more 6-6 season and that might all happen again.