Be proud for the person, not what he looks like

darts180 · 01-22-2007, 09:07 PM

The thing is that there are so many stories with this Super Bowl, that I hope that the media will let this go. It isn't anything that needs glorification by the media. These are two excellent coaches, that's all. Instead we here that these are two excellent "black" coaches. I know that is the story for the media, but Lovie Smith and Tony Dungy have paid their dues, they deserve better.

We are now seeing the so-called "minority" coach getting second chances. Denny Green, and Art Shell were fired, and there was no uprising about it, the results spoke for themselves. The Pittsburgh Steelers hire was monumental.

There is still a long ways to go, but it is getting better. Let the two coaches prepare their teams, and be the role models that they are. Focus on the game.

Michael Lastuvka · 01-22-2007, 09:44 PM

Not so long ago, African Americans weren't a very educated people. Today, the numbers of college educated African Americans are growing by leaps and bounds because they now have a much better opportunity to further themselves. This topic obviously transcends football.

As far as football though, I think it is a big deal. The reporters that asked the two coaches how they felt about it were caucasions and probably curious if it meant anything to Dungy and Smith. Both coaches took the classy PC route and said no. But I get the hunch that it'd be very hard NOT to be proud. If I had been oppressed or had seen my parents oppressed 40 or 50 years ago, and had gotten to the point in my life where I was respected in an occupation where that wouldn't be the case not too long ago, I'd at least be thinking about it.

I think race will always be an issue of discussion. At least until a million years or so from now when everybody's mixed with everybody and we're all the same color-wise.

madcityCY · 01-22-2007, 09:56 PM

Leave it to media to take the emphasis away from where it should be. Achievement, plain and simple.

Stormin · 01-22-2007, 10:06 PM

I personally think it is a great thing and will go a long way in overcoming stereotypes. I remember back years ago when there were no black quarterbacks. And so on. Neat thing is that Smith and Dungy are pretty doggone good coaches and even better people according to those who know them best. Should be a great game.

kurimski · 01-22-2007, 10:29 PM

I really don't think there is much of a "race" issue in today's world. If people would just quit talking about it and thinking about it there wouldn't be one. The talking about it and thinking about it makes people think there is still an issue. I've never really experienced any kind of race issues or seen or heard of around where i live.
I'm very happy for coach Dungy and coach Smith. I think it's great they made it to the superbowl and i'm thrilled for the both of them. Has anyone noticed the "race" issue is only in football? Do they talk about it in baseball? basketball? hockey? soccer? No! none of them. I think that it's rather rediculous and tired of hearing about it. This is not meant to offend anyone and it's my opinion and hope it doesn't rub anyone the wrong way. If it does you can send me a message.

ISUFan22 · 01-22-2007, 10:29 PM

At my coaches meeting tonight a few of us were talking about the Super Bowl match-up. One of the coaches, whom I've coached with the past two years, is black.

Without anyone else mentioning anything about this topic, he said...

"I just wish the media and everyone else would let this race topic with Lovie and Tony go. It takes away from why they're in the Super Bowl and their team's accomplishments."

I just thought I'd share this - I couldn't agree more with him.

kurimski · 01-22-2007, 10:33 PM

At my coaches meeting tonight a few of us were talking about the Super Bowl match-up. One of the coaches, whom I've coached with the past two years, is black.

Without anyone else mentioning anything about this topic, he said...

"I just wish the media and everyone else would let this race topic with Lovie and Tony go. It takes away from why they're in the Super Bowl and their team's accomplishments."

I just thought I'd share this - I couldn't agree more with him.

Couldn't be put any better!!!! It takes away from their teams and their accomplishments.

herbiedoobie · 01-23-2007, 02:08 AM

I spent a bit of time working with a Hawaiian organization made up exclusively of Hawaiians. They spoke Hawaiian and either intentionally or unintentionally excluded me from meetings, memos, etc..

That experience changed my mindset significantly about discrimination and minorities. But I still don't accept the "victim stance". You have to keep trying.

Nick · 01-23-2007, 04:37 AM

Long post (sorry, it's an issue that's important to me)...

Originally Posted by kurimski

I really don't think there is much of a "race" issue in today's world. If people would just quit talking about it and thinking about it there wouldn't be one. The talking about it and thinking about it makes people think there is still an issue. I've never really experienced any kind of race issues or seen or heard of around where i live.

Ignoring racism does not make it go away. If racism was merely something that come out of our mouths, this might be the case, but the fact is that racism is a lot more than this - it affects people even if a word about it is never spoken.

Sports may actually be some of the most racially influenced institutions in America. In football, why are some positions dominated by blacks, and others by whites? (how many black kickers are there in the NFL??) Why are there so few Asians?

The type of racism in sports is easy to overlook, because it isn't intentional. It isn't caused by people consciously thinking "I only want a kicker who is white" - it probably is the case that the best kickers ARE white - but WHY??

I think a lot of it has to do with the economic situations people grow up in. Why is there such a higher percentage of blacks in sports than in the rest of society? Perhaps it is because there is a much higher percentage of blacks growing up in poor neighborhoods, so they see sports as their only way out. Maybe this isn't the case, but I think I know where I would put my money.

A December Opinion Research Corp poll on racism (found here) shows that 49% of blacks see racism as a serious issue today in the US, whereas only 18% of whites do. There is obviously something that is making black people feel as if racism is still an issue. I personally don't want to overlook their feelings, since I think they are in a better position than I am to recognize and speak on racism.

Ultimately, I do agree that it is important to always FIRST recognize individuals for their efforts and accomplishments as individual human beings without focusing on race. BUT, that does not mean race should not be ignored altogether, because it is still very much a force influencing American society.

wonkadog · 01-23-2007, 11:55 AM

Originally Posted by herbiedoobie

I spent a bit of time working with a Hawaiian organization made up exclusively of Hawaiians. They spoke Hawaiian and either intentionally or unintentionally excluded me from meetings, memos, etc..

That experience changed my mindset significantly about discrimination and minorities. But I still don't accept the "victim stance". You have to keep trying.

Moving to Las Vegas I have come in contact with many, many Hawaiians and trust me, they seem to be the most exclusive, bitter towards everyone else "minority" I have ever been around. They have a huge chip on their shoulder anytime a "mainlander" asks them a question or has a different opinion than them. I had absolutely no idea about their anti-U.S. stance until I got here but I've been learning quickly and definitely have a different opinion of them now (here's a hint, it's not positive).

tigershoops31 · 01-23-2007, 12:04 PM

Originally Posted by wonkadog

Moving to Las Vegas I have come in contact with many, many Hawaiians and trust me, they seem to be the most exclusive, bitter towards everyone else "minority" I have ever been around. They have a huge chip on their shoulder anytime a "mainlander" asks them a question or has a different opinion than them. I had absolutely no idea about their anti-U.S. stance until I got here but I've been learning quickly and definitely have a different opinion of them now (here's a hint, it's not positive).

There are two types of people that I cannot stand...those who don't have tolerance for people of other skin color/nationalities.....and the Dutch!

businesscyman · 01-23-2007, 12:07 PM

Originally Posted by kurimski

I really don't think there is much of a "race" issue in today's world. If people would just quit talking about it and thinking about it there wouldn't be one. The talking about it and thinking about it makes people think there is still an issue. I've never really experienced any kind of race issues or seen or heard of around where i live.

There is not much of a race issue in Iowa but there still is one that we should be on constant gaurd for. If you don't think there is a race issue go to your local mall and watch clerks interact with a white customer, then watch the clerks interact with a black customer. Their body language changes (not everyone's but some).
Another good test is to watch a mixed race couple walk through the mall and look at the people around them. I know personally that peoples looks and ttitudes change based on skin color. Again not everyone's but more than they should.

ISUFan22 · 01-23-2007, 12:10 PM

Originally Posted by businesscyman

There is not much of a race issue in Iowa but there still is one that we should be on constant gaurd for. If you don't think there is a race issue go to your local mall and watch clerks interact with a white customer, then watch the clerks interact with a black customer. Their body language changes (not everyone's but some).
Another good test is to watch a mixed race couple walk through the mall and look at the people around them. I know personally that peoples looks and ttitudes change based on skin color. Again not everyone's but more than they should.

Agreed. Sad yet true.