Jay Leno Asks Why - OT

[Kyle]

What do you think we should be doing?

Now that we are in the quagmire in Iraq I think our options are a lot more limited. I personally like Senator Biden's plan about as well as anything.

Plan For Iraq

Otherwise though, I think it would be useful to spend much of that money on buying friends and intelligence. Information is our best weapon at this point. We also need to demonstrate as a country that we are likeable. Whether we like it or not, people will hate us because of our wealth. We have less than 10% of the world's population and over 50% of its wealth. We can afford to be a little generous. Just look at how well it works for Chavez in Venezuela. When you buy people things they like you.

[Kyle]

So when we get attacked on our own soil, what are we supposed to do? Nothing because we don't want the possibility of a soldier losing his life?

Only invade countries that had something to do with the attack?

[Knownothing]

There are not as many troops in either Iraq or Afganistan as were/are necessary to get the job done.

How do you know

[cycloneworld]

Only invade countries that had something to do with the attack?

For about the 5th time, our intelligence showed Iraq had weapons of mass destruction and almost NO ONE disagreed! And I'm pretty safe in saying that there are just a few Al-Queda factions in Iraq...and they did attack us.

[cycloneworld]

How do you know

He watches the news.

[Kyle]

How do you know

Most of my opinion on that stems from talking with people that gave presentations at the union whose names I've forgotten. One was a lady that spent quite a bit of time in Iraq. The other was a member of CENTCOM.

[Kyle]

For about the 5th time, our intelligence showed Iraq had weapons of mass destruction and almost NO ONE disagreed! And I'm pretty safe in saying that there are just a few Al-Queda factions in Iraq...and they did attack us.

Now there is plenty of Al-Queda in Iraq. They didn't have much of a presence there before the war. The only WMD's Iraq had were the ones we gave them in the 80's. I can't necessarily defend all the people that voted for the war at the time, but to be fair, few people outside the administration were privy to all of the intelligence.

I find it funny no one mentions Saudi Arabia, where just about all of the hijackers came from and where Sunni fundamentalism is at its highest. Iran also had absolutely nothing to do with 9/11.

[Kyle]

He watches the news.

Thanks. You are clearly qualified to speak as to where I get my information from. Where do you get yours from?

[Wesley]

Another small factor - world production of oil has peaked in 2006. It will be the Chinese, Koreans,US fighting over a smaller oil pot. In fact, the Iranian and other oil fields are slipping dramatically. Having to rely on Venezuala, Nigeria and other dictator like countries is not a pleasant thought.
Chrysler (with GM) is coming out with a fuel conservative hemi for its largest vehicles - just in tiume 18 and 22 mpg for use by the guzzler group. Gas should reach $4 a gallon by end of summer. Big winners are expected to be schlumberger and Halliburton providing more oil drilling services.

[Cyphor]

Leno took quite a jump with those poles. I doubt they were asking, “Are you glad you have electricity and running water and live in non-archaic environment?”

If all presidencies were judged on these criteria I’m sure the approval ratings would be around 100% (minus New Orleans and the Gulf Coast…and parts of Hawkeye country).

I agree that we should remember how blessed we are as a nation, but we should always be serious about the direction we are going. I’m sure these pulls were focusing on environmental responsibility, foreign affairs etc., things the President can directly affect.
Leno is effectively saying, “so what if we are screwing over other countries and the environment and our lower and middle classes; you have water and clothes and drive-thrus, isn’t that enough?”

That’s kind of shallow and irresponsible.

[cycloneworld]

Thanks. You are clearly qualified to speak as to where I get my information from. Where do you get yours from?

I'm not the one who claimed they knew troops levels were not adequate. I don't know much about the war, only what is available to the public which I'm guessing is about 1% of everything. And unless you are privy to classified information, you have the same information that everyone else does.

It's so easy to throw out phrases like "war for oil", "3,000 lives lost", "underprotected troops"...everyone has heard that because that's what is on the news...

Where is the "women now have civil rights", "we have built a record number of schools", etc. coverage?

[Cyphor]

I find it funny no one mentions Saudi Arabia, where just about all of the hijackers came from and where Sunni fundamentalism is at its highest. Iran also had absolutely nothing to do with 9/11.

That's a really great observation! the War on Terror extands to a lot of non-terrorist related activities. It requires a leap of faith. "if Iran gets nukes, they'll sell them to terrorists who have the technology to put them in suit cases and set them off in the US and Europe."

It's definitly somthing to worry about. But it is a HUGE speculative leap to make for going to war (See Iraq).

[cycloneworld]

I find it funny no one mentions Saudi Arabia, where just about all of the hijackers came from and where Sunni fundamentalism is at its highest. Iran also had absolutely nothing to do with 9/11.

Lots of people mention Saudi Arabia. And yes, there are threats within that country. However, we are alies with SA and their government helps control terrorism within their own borders unlike Iraq/Afganistan whose governments will AID terrorists with attacks against us.

[Cyphor]

It's so easy to throw out phrases like "war for oil", "3,000 lives lost", "underprotected troops"...everyone has heard that because that's what is on the news...

Where is the "women now have civil rights", "we have built a record number of schools", etc. coverage?

You're right, we do always dwell on the negatives and never seem to celebrate the posatives. That isn't however any excuse to ingore the negatives. At you job, for instance, you probebly do much more problem solving than sitting around thinking about all the things your company has achieved over the last 50 years.

I don't think this is what your are suggesting, but I've heard it from others, and it scares me.

[Knownothing]

The troops in Afghanistan are fine with the numbers they have. The troops in Iraq is the concern right now. Are there to many or not enough. That is the real question. You may have heard by now that we are spread to thin. That troops are being called back into service. Well guess what guys. This has happened since America first became a country. Over 300,000 died in WW2 and over 75k in Vietnam. 3k while it sucks, still does not represent a huge number for a war. I was in New Mexico at the Bataan Death March Tribute and the older guys were literally laughing at us. Saying how WW2 and Korea would not have been won if that country reacted the same way toward those wars as this war. The NEW America would not have been able to handle 300,000 deaths in order to win a war. Oh well I could write a book on this so I am done for a while.