Disagree with our receivers being "average"

[tm3308]

Last year, Jordan Wynn (QB at Utah) and the Utes were averaging 45 points per game. In the Air Force game, Wynn injured his shoulder. He could no longer make the long and mid-range throws. In Utah's last 5 games, they averaged less than 14 points. Receiving corp was the same all season long.

Having a QB that can not make all the throws does make a difference.

That's not even remotely comparable. Receivers not posting numbers because of an injured QB is to be expected. Not posting numbers because of dropped passes (and also average QB play) is completely different.

[CyValley]

We did not hit players in stride and the long passes were infrequent for a reason. ISU needs an accurate QB to find out just what our receivers can do.

(Groan) anyone recall the last couple minutes of the KSU game, the pass to A-Rob? An all-too obvious example. . . .

[CYKOFAN]

I wouldn't count out the Manatee, Florida receiver (Brundage I think) from being a factor this year. His senior highlight tape was amazing.

[Drive4cy]

It's probably a combination of both. If we had a good or elite QB you could do damage with average WRs. Look at what Peyton Manning does in Indy. Seems like anyone you plug in works. Same with Tom Brady. Seneca made guys like Lance Young and Jack Whitiver look better than they really were. Cam Newton didn't have any big time receivers, etc.

I tend to blame the QB more than the WRs when the offense fails but it's definitely a two way street. Herman also deserves blame. Too many times last year we didn't stretch the field at all. It's pretty easy to defend an offense when you don't have to respect the deep ball at all. Safeties and corners probably loved playing against us in certain games.

[jdoggivjc]

If only 75% of your passes are balls that should have been caught, you suck. The best QBs in college football throw about 97% and their actual completion percentage is around 65% or 70% if they're in a spread offense.

BUT, there is a difference between "should have been caught" and "catchable"

What percentage of AA's passes were catchable? Id say 70%

Really? What happens if that 25% of balls thrown are simply "throw aways" due to receivers not getting open and/or offensive line not sustaining blocks? In other words, your assertion that missing 25% of the time is straight up sucking is misinformation at best.

And, by the way, I'd say Arnaud had to throw away for various reasons about 20% of the time, Arnaud misfired about 10% of the time, and the receivers dropped catchable balls about 10% of the time.

But of course, you'd be one of those that prefers to take the cop-out option by leaving all the blame at Arnaud's feet...

[RustShack]

I think we have some guys that can be good for us.. But it might be another year before they start being utilized.

[Aclone]

And, by the way, I'd say Arnaud had to throw away for various reasons about 20% of the time, Arnaud misfired about 10% of the time, and the receivers dropped catchable balls about 10% of the time.

What he said. I'm not sure about the percentages, but it's clear that offensive failure (or success) is an interdependent, team effort.

In another thread, someone claimed that Arnaud would have been better had he had Stanzi's receivers. That's not necessarily true. Stanzi often had time to stand (or float) in the pocket and eat a hot dog while patterns developed--complete with selecting condiments. How often did AA have that luxury?

[copenhagen]

i think this fall a couple of the receivers will make the next step up, and a new one will make a big impact.

[jaretac]

If anything we were below average and not above. Some might blame it on AA, but Arnaud was not the reason for the thousands of dropped passes. The WR were below average. AA wasn't the greatest QB ever, but he wasn't the reason for all the offenses woes either.

[RustShack]

It's not really an excuse at this level, but it's possible for QBs to hit the receiver but it's still a hard ball to catch.

[ISUAlum2002]

It's not really an excuse at this level, but it's possible for QBs to hit the receiver but it's still a hard ball to catch.

That was a big time knock on AA's game throughout his career. He would throw the fast ball on a 5 yard crossing route across the middle when a toss with some touch on it would suffice. Unfortunately, those fast balls would be dropped a lot, and sometimes worse, as they would get deflected by the receiver up into the air for an easy pick by the safety roaming the middle.

[Frak]

It's not Arnaud's fault that he's not a spread-type quarterback. He was recruited to run a pro-style offense. The offensive line was recruited for the same thing.

I think we will see drastic improvement, especially from the OLine, when we have the style of player we need for the system. Hopefully, whoever wins the QB job is the type of QB that Herman needs for his offense.

This offense will be ten times better is the QB is just a little bit more efficient throwing the ball and has the ability to make the occasional deep throw. In order to do that, the receivers must learn to get off the line and create separation.

And this is why Tiller is not going to be the starter. Herman was kind of stuck playing Arnaud. He inherited a player that not only was a returning starter, but also a team leader and local boy. No way does Herman sit AA. But after two years, Herman has lost his "wonderkind/genius" image and honestly, his seat is starting to warm up. You can't win with an offense that's the worst in the conference 3-4 straight years. So, does anyone really believe that if Herman is going down, he's going down with a QB that doesn't fit his offense? He might have been stuck starting Arnaud (not that there was anyone better on the roster), but should he have any loyalty to Tiller? I think that after two years, he's going to go to war with HIS guy in there, not Chizik's.

For WRs, I think that they've been well below the average for a Big 12 group. The WR group has steadily went downhill since Blythe and Davis graduated. Worse every year. My concern is that this staff does not do a good job of evaluating WRs. No CPR-recruited WR has caught a single pass at ISU! And this is a position that was not only lacking in talent, but one where true freshmen that are talented can see the field right away. Still, they can't recruit over what is an average at best group. The projected starters at WR and TE this season? Four Chizik recruits. On top of that, either Wells did a bad job of coaching the WRs on the roster or couldn't get through to them. So, I'll apologize to "The City", but it's time to quit the hype with this group and actually do something on the field.

[RustShack]

I have a hard time believing Rhoads receivers won't be better than the Chiz ones. I think we have some talented guys that Chiz did recruit, and I'm interested to see if they have more success with a different QB.

[ISUFan22]

(Groan) anyone recall the last couple minutes of the KSU game, the pass to A-Rob? An all-too obvious example. . . .

You mean when there was a very quick rush right up the middle that wasn't picked up? And the QB was forced to throw prematurely? Yes, that did happen a lot.

I wouldn't expect a "ball watcher" to notice, though.

[jdoggivjc]

You mean when there was a very quick rush right up the middle that wasn't picked up? And the QB was forced to throw prematurely? Yes, that did happen a lot.

I wouldn't expect a "ball watcher" to notice, though.

If it wasn't for the fact that it meant the ballgame I would have been more impressed that he got that particular throw as close as he did.