Freshmen making an impact?

[clonedude]

I just think that a 6'7" 250 pound DE would be something that our team has absolutely 0 of right now. The best way to get playing time early is to bring something that the team doesn't have.

I also think it is much easier as a freshmen to learn to play the position effectively enough to play a few snaps a game and give some breathers than it is to put on the 30 or so pounds that he outweighs the rest of our DEs by.

It doesn't work that way I'm afraid. If you have that kind of size, combined with some athletic ability, you can get a scholarship offer based off of potential alone... which I believe is the case here.

But once you get to Big 12 football, you better bring more to the table than size and some athleticism. You better KNOW how to play the position. There is a lot of technique to learn. A lot to learn about "staying home" and not always getting sucked in on the speed rush, etc.

Irving will most likely need a year to learn the ropes. Hope I'm wrong, but all indications seem to point in that direction.

Sorry to burst your bubble.

[Yes13]

Yeah, I think they want to keep me at defensive end. I can play defensive tackle but I prefer defensive end. I’ll be going out there in June or July to get started which is important because they said they want to beef me up before next season. That will be key because they said I could challenge for playing time as a freshman and I really want to make a big impact at Iowa State

This is from David Irving in August. I wonder if they said he could challenge for playing time just to get him committed, or if they actually believe it. Knowing Rhoads I doubt he lied to him. We have Lattimer, Maggitt, Nelson, Neal, and Scott at end. Nelson is said to be just a pass rusher, Neal is not very good, Scott is fast, but we can't be sure if he can hold up. I could see Irving being better than those three. However, I wouldn't put money on him being better and a redshirt might be better for him.

[clonesalltheway]

I hope all of our recruits challenge for playing time, and make the team better. Now if their bodies are ready for it physically and mentally ready is another question.

[Lifer]

Irving may be the most physically gifted athlete in the class. He's massive, fast and can leap like crazy, but he's raw and young for the class (if I remember right, he won't even be 18 until sometime in August). If I was going to bet on it, I'd put my money on a RS.

At least I hope thats the case, a year of practice and collegiate weight room experience could do wonders for him.

The thing about Irving is that if we r/s him I think he's gone after his junior year(early draft entry). I think his talent is that great, so why not try to get him going by playing him some. I don't see as a waste of a year, I see it as prepping him for a starting role next year. He will learn way more by playing few snaps a game rather than r/s IMO.

[swarthmoreCY]

The thing about Irving is that if we r/s him I think he's gone after his junior year(early draft entry). I think his talent is that great, so why not try to get him going by playing him some. I don't see as a waste of a year, I see it as prepping him for a starting role next year. He will learn way more by playing few snaps a game rather than r/s IMO.

I am fanatical as they come, but worrying about a guy leaving early seems odd in a discussion about redshirts. If he is as good as you say, he won't need charity playing time like you describe.

[Rhoadhoused]

It doesn't work that way I'm afraid. If you have that kind of size, combined with some athletic ability, you can get a scholarship offer based off of potential alone... which I believe is the case here.

But once you get to Big 12 football, you better bring more to the table than size and some athleticism. You better KNOW how to play the position. There is a lot of technique to learn. A lot to learn about "staying home" and not always getting sucked in on the speed rush, etc.

Irving will most likely need a year to learn the ropes. Hope I'm wrong, but all indications seem to point in that direction.

Sorry to burst your bubble.

Well one could also say that it doesn't matter how good your technique is, you can't play in the Big 12 without having a fair amount of size. You could be the smartest DE in the country but if you are only 200 pounds you are going to be innefective.

Give me size over technique as a freshman because guess what, you can't teach size.

Sorry to burst your bubble.

[Tre4ISU]

The thing about Irving is that if we r/s him I think he's gone after his junior year(early draft entry). I think his talent is that great, so why not try to get him going by playing him some. I don't see as a waste of a year, I see it as prepping him for a starting role next year. He will learn way more by playing few snaps a game rather than r/s IMO.

If we have a D-end where our worry is that he leaves early, I can live with that. It also shouldn't factor in to whether you RS him or not. His ability to contribute is the only thing that should be looked at.

[Lifer]

I am fanatical as they come, but worrying about a guy leaving early seems odd in a discussion about redshirts. If he is as good as you say, he won't need charity playing time like you describe.

Lots of early nfl entries don't start right away or even play significant minutes. Look at how many r/s soph are in the draft this year. Don't you think they wish they would have played them as true freshman if they knew they were going to leave after their sophomore year. Plus DE is one of the easiest positions to come in and play right away, and with our lack of size he would play some right away.

[Tre4ISU]

Lots of early nfl entries don't start right away or even play significant minutes. Look at how many r/s soph are in the draft this year. Don't you think they wish they would have played them as true freshman if they knew they were going to leave after their sophomore year. Plus DE is one of the easiest positions to come in and play right away, and with our lack of size he would play some right away.

No, not if they couldn't help the team. It's not about snaps played it's about production.

[swarthmoreCY]

Well one could also say that it doesn't matter how good your technique is, you can't play in the Big 12 without having a fair amount of size. You could be the smartest DE in the country but if you are only 200 pounds you are going to be innefective.

Give me size over technique as a freshman because guess what, you can't teach size.

Sorry to burst your bubble.

At 6-7 250, he will still need good technique.

[Rhoadhoused]

At 6-7 250, his size may not be great enough to overcome technique.

Who do we have that is 6'7" 250? And that is his current weight, he will likely add more by the time fall rolls around.

[Lifer]

If we have a D-end where our worry is that he leaves early, I can live with that. It also shouldn't factor in to whether you RS him or not. His ability to contribute is the only thing that should be looked at.

You are 100% and I think he can contribute. Yes, Wally said he needs a lot of work but so does every single one of the 2011 Cyclones. Plus it's not like Wally hands compliments left and right.

[swarthmoreCY]

Who do we have that is 6'7" 250?

What does that matter?
Another way to put it, his size alone is not advantageous enough for him to be good enough to play. In fact, at his height, technique is just as important as a little guy.

[Rhoadhoused]

I'm not saying he will have perfect technique, or that he is so huge he won't need to have good technique. I am just saying that there is no DE on our roster that even comes close to 6'7" 250 and especially if he comes in at 260 or so that there is no reason that he can't challenge for PT. Because college coaches are paid to coach technique.

If our coaches feel like they need that size, then I think they will not hesitate to play him.

[Istate]

The thing about Irving is that if we r/s him I think he's gone after his junior year(early draft entry). I think his talent is that great, so why not try to get him going by playing him some. I don't see as a waste of a year, I see it as prepping him for a starting role next year. He will learn way more by playing few snaps a game rather than r/s IMO.

So that I'm clear on this one: we are worried about a kid that had no other real football interest besides ISU leaving early for the Pros? I guess Paul Rhoads has really changed the mindset in Ames.

Come on, I hope the kid eventually contributes. You don't see a lot of guys that are 6'7" freaks on the football field. Maybe David can become one, but he is a long way from contributing.