QB competition. Whats your Opinion?

**CyDude16** · 06-25-2011, 01:56 PM

Originally Posted by Rhoadhoused

To be fair I was pretty drunk when I posted this, probably a little harsh.

Drunk CF-ing... classic.

**Erik4Cy** · 06-25-2011, 02:00 PM

**CyCrazy** · 06-25-2011, 02:01 PM

Originally Posted by CyDude16

Drunk CF-ing... classic.

You know a thing or two about that.

**CyDude16** · 06-25-2011, 02:02 PM

Originally Posted by CyCrazy

You know a thing or two about that.

Weather threads are awesome!

**D UP Clones** · 06-25-2011, 04:29 PM

Originally Posted by cycfan1

The Tech game showed me this offense has what it takes if ran effectively.

They don't need to (really can't) produce like that game all the time, however a little consistency would be nice.

Uh, Arnaud threw more than one great long pass in that game. Oops, I forgot he can't throw the long ball. It was nice to actually see some routes run down the field.

**D UP Clones** · 06-25-2011, 04:36 PM

You don't have to have coverage roll behind when no one is running a deep route. That may be the scheme but players aren't stupid and they stay put when no one is running deep.

Safeties play slants and hooks all the time. They just do it from behind the receiver.

Why do you think Iowa seems to play well against Texas Tech? Iowa's safeties play tight. They always have. They want you to keep throwing short routes right at their safeties and linebackers. They don't want you to run someone deep and then run a route underneath. I've never understand the all slant and all hook call. It looks good on paper but so far it has been a cluster under Herman. Run routes at different levels. Quit going to the all slant call on third and short. It rarely works and it is predictable.

And according to Iowa's coach, they play a cover four, not cover 2. Both require two safeties in the middle.

The games Herman has gone away from the all short routes have been the most productive on offense. Texas Tech for example included many more routes down the field.

**D UP Clones** · 06-25-2011, 04:46 PM

Originally Posted by Rhoadhoused

To be fair I was pretty drunk when I posted this, probably a little harsh. But the point stands, Herman knows what his offense takes to be successful and what routes to run. I have no problem with critiquing the offense as a whole or saying that his offense hasn't adjusted well to not having the personnel it really needs to be productive, but when you get into those little nuances and stuff I think fans are out of their league.

I bet that the plays Herman writes up are much more complex than you think and that he accounts for all 12 defenders on the field in every one. I think it is naive to think that he just forgot to include safeties in a play or he forgot to run them off.

Also in general, I believe most offense run off of the belief that you pass short or run to set up the deep pass, and not vice versa. Once our bubble screens and quick slants become more dangerous, safeties will creep up and then you can pass deep. Before that I think the tendency would be to defend the long pass.

One more thing? When did they start putting 12 players on the field? LOL

Maybe that is the problem. Herman is scheming for the ghost safety playing deep. Maybe we should just stick to scheming for the actual 11 on the field.

Oh, and there is nothing difficult to understand about the all slant call or all hook call. That's the point. He runs it too much and it is not difficult to understand or predict. The safeties are already creeping up. That is the point. You are right. He should be smart enough to figure that out.

Rhoads evidently is.

**besserheimerphat** · 06-25-2011, 05:09 PM

You don't have to have coverage roll behind when no one is running a deep route. That may be the scheme but players aren't stupid and they stay put when no one is running deep.

If no one is rolling behind, then I'd hope Herman sees it and adjusts. If a defensive player is supposed to roll and doesn't, he'd better hope the QB doesn't see it and adjust the route because he won't be able to recover.

Why do you think Iowa seems to play well against Texas Tech? Iowa's safeties play tight. They always have.

Iowa and TTech have played twice, with Iowa winning both. Iowa won in 1996 (before Ferentz) 27 - 0, and again in 2001 19 - 16. I didn't see either game to know if Iowa "played them well." Iowa Official Athletic Site - Football

And according to Iowa's coach, they play a cover four, not cover 2. Both require two safeties in the middle.

I didn't think I said Cover 2, just that their safeties typically play back to prevent big plays. So we're kind of in agreement.

The games Herman has gone away from the all short routes have been the most productive on offense. Texas Tech for example included many more routes down the field.

The Tech game had more completions downfield. I don't have game film to know if it had more routes run downfield than other games over the course of the season.

**FootballinTexas** · 06-25-2011, 09:28 PM

It doesn't matter how a defense plays coverage (1,2,3,4,0, man-free), if you have properly prepared for "what they do", there will always be an open area. Every coverage has an open spot in a 4-wide or empty set because someone in the secondary is always committed to run support. If not, run the damn ball!! The QB has to have time to go through his progression to make the correct read...so OL protection is a major key. You balance the blitz by having a good pass catching RB. If a safety blitzes, that leaves an LB on the RB. Win!! When I coached, the motto was "the defense is always right". We ran and threw the ball in to unoccupied areas. Herman is a very good OC. They are recruiting well and getting guys ready to play. Be patient. I like the QB competition. Like CPR said, in due time someone will emerge. But we all should be excited that all 3 of our candidates are doing good things. And leave AA out of this discussion.

**Rhoadhoused** · 06-25-2011, 09:36 PM

Originally Posted by FootballinTexas

It doesn't matter how a defense plays coverage (1,2,3,4,0, man-free), if you have properly prepared for "what they do", there will always be an open area. Every coverage has an open spot in a 4-wide or empty set because someone in the secondary is always committed to run support. If not, run the damn ball!! The QB has to have time to go through his progression to make the correct read...so OL protection is a major key. You balance the blitz by having a good pass catching RB. If a safety blitzes, that leaves an LB on the RB. Win!! When I coached, the motto was "the defense is always right". We ran and threw the ball in to unoccupied areas. Herman is a very good OC. They are recruiting well and getting guys ready to play. Be patient. I like the QB competition. Like CPR said, in due time someone will emerge. But we all should be excited that all 3 of our candidates are doing good things. And leave AA out of this discussion.

Agreed except I think it is relevant to compare our future QB to what we will have next year. I want to know if our QB will be better or worse next year

Disclaimer: I am drunk again so take my opinions with a grain of salt.

**RedBlooded** · 06-25-2011, 09:37 PM

interesting statistic for ya!

Our QB should be Kirby Van Der Kamp. The punter completed 100% of his passes in 2010.

1 pass for 25 yards.

**FootballinTexas** · 06-25-2011, 09:44 PM

Originally Posted by Rhoadhoused

Agreed except I think it is relevant to compare our future QB to what we will have next year. I want to know if our QB will be better or worse next year.

We want know if our QB play will be better until the season is rolling. So comparing what AA did/did not do to our expectations is unrealistic. The QB play may be better....it may be worse. Either way, it doesn't affect what AA did. Here's what we do know, all 3 guys are working their ***** off.

**RustShack** · 06-25-2011, 10:08 PM

Originally Posted by Al_4_State

If Jantz (or even Barnett) is a superior zone read operator, and the passing abilities are a wash, I think the best ground threat will win the job, and that a given QBs ability to run the read may be the big deciding factor in the end.

I disagree. I think the most accurate QB who can also hit some deep passes will in the job. It sounds like all three QB's can run, so that part shouldn't be a problem. I see us throwing a lot of quick passes and letting the quick twitch type guys our staff has been recruiting get yards after the catch. That is why we need the QB who can hit them in stride. And since we(I'm assuming) will mostly be a rushing/short passing team our QB needs to also be able to hit the occasional deep ball when its called to keep the D honest. I see our offense being all about handing it off, slants, screens, and QB sneaks.

**dualthreat** · 06-25-2011, 11:17 PM

This team could be really fun to watch with a smart, quick-operating gun slinger at QB. I would love to see an Iowa State QB stand in the pocket and zip one out to one of our recievers.. Then look to the sideline and get the play as hes walking to the new LOS and everyone is ready to go again. Herman wants to run an up-tempo offense with some rhythm and consistency. We haven't seen that yet- but when we do- things could really click.

**rebecacy** · 06-25-2011, 11:35 PM

Originally Posted by FootballinTexas

We want know if our QB play will be better until the season is rolling. So comparing what AA did/did not do to our expectations is unrealistic. The QB play may be better....it may be worse. Either way, it doesn't affect what AA did. Here's what we do know, all 3 guys are working their ***** off.

AA seemed to be a liability almost as often as he was an asset.