QB competition. Whats your Opinion?

[snowcraig2.0]

AA was much better when throwing downfield as opposed to the dink and dunk.

[DarkStar]

AA was much better when throwing downfield as opposed to the dink and dunk.

AA was much better when he wasn't throwing interceptions or fumbling the football.

Which sadly was as likely to happen as him leading a touchdown drive....

[Rural]

I'm just hoping to have an offense that isn't painful to watch.
I've loved reading about the "5 to 7 yards" passes. If that were true the offense would have worked. Half the time those passes were incomplete or went for 2 to negative 2 yards.

[Al_4_State]

I disagree. I think the most accurate QB who can also hit some deep passes will in the job. It sounds like all three QB's can run, so that part shouldn't be a problem. I see us throwing a lot of quick passes and letting the quick twitch type guys our staff has been recruiting get yards after the catch. That is why we need the QB who can hit them in stride. And since we(I'm assuming) will mostly be a rushing/short passing team our QB needs to also be able to hit the occasional deep ball when its called to keep the D honest. I see our offense being all about handing it off, slants, screens, and QB sneaks.

If you read the rest of my post you would have seen that I said it would be a factor only if "passing abilities are a wash".

[AlleyAddict]

AA seemed to be a liability almost as often as he was an asset.

But Chizik was the best coach in ISU history, right?

[clonedude]

In McFarland's final year, we threw for 2,981 yds and averaged 386.8 yds of total offense per game.

In Herman's first year, we threw for 2,401 yds and averaged 364.7 yds of total offense per game.

That's not such a big difference, but there was a small drop off, mostly due to a new system, etc.

My problem is what happened from Herman's first year to his second year.

Herman's second year we threw for 2,091 yds (drop off of over 300 yds), and averaged 317.4 yds of total offense per game (a drop off of nearly 50 yds per game).

This offense under Herman has done nothing but get worse since he's been here. But we've won more games under Herman's reign, but I credit that with much improved defense mostly.

AA threw for over 400 yds in a game against UNLV in his sophomore season under McFarland. AA had the capability to be a pretty prolific passer here in his final two seasons IMO. AA's passing yds went from 2,981 yds under McFarland to 2,091 in Herman's system last year. 900 yds less of passing.

I would not put this all on AA. AA had a really good sophomore season, but did nothing but get worse in his last two seasons. I do think we ran the ball better these last two years, but still... total offense has still gone down every year since McFarland left.

If you don't think Tom Herman deserves some criticism, then I don't know how you are supposed to judge him? By wins only? That has a LOT to do with defense and turnovers created I'm afraid. Our offense has stunk so far under Herman. There's no other way to look at it IMO. It's not only bad, it's painful to even watch.

BUT, I'm willing to cut him some slack. He's only been here two years and he deserves another year or two to show something. But for those who argue that AA just didn't fit Herman's system, that is not AA's fault. Rhoads knew when he got here that AA was most likely going to be our QB for two years. AA had just come off a really good sophomore season. So why did we go and get an OC that didn't fit what AA could do, or that couldn't adjust his offense to fit the QB's abilities?

I feel for AA. I truly believe that Tom Herman made him a worse QB these last two years. AA would have been better off transferring to a better system, but he's too good of a guy to do that to the Cyclones.

I just wonder how many QB's we'll need to go through before we find one that fits Herman's amazing "system"?

[RedBlooded]

In McFarland's final year, we threw for 2,981 yds and averaged 386.8 yds of total offense per game.

In Herman's first year, we threw for 2,401 yds and averaged 364.7 yds of total offense per game.

That's not such a big difference, but there was a small drop off, mostly due to a new system, etc.

My problem is what happened from Herman's first year to his second year.

Herman's second year we threw for 2,091 yds (drop off of over 300 yds), and averaged 317.4 yds of total offense per game (a drop off of nearly 50 yds per game).

This offense under Herman has done nothing but get worse since he's been here. But we've won more games under Herman's reign, but I credit that with much improved defense mostly.

AA threw for over 400 yds in a game against UNLV in his sophomore season under McFarland. AA had the capability to be a pretty prolific passer here in his final two seasons IMO. AA's passing yds went from 2,981 yds under McFarland to 2,091 in Herman's system last year. 900 yds less of passing.

I would not put this all on AA. AA had a really good sophomore season, but did nothing but get worse in his last two seasons. I do think we ran the ball better these last two years, but still... total offense has still gone down every year since McFarland left.

If you don't think Tom Herman deserves some criticism, then I don't know how you are supposed to judge him? By wins only? That has a LOT to do with defense and turnovers created I'm afraid. Our offense has stunk so far under Herman. There's no other way to look at it IMO. It's not only bad, it's painful to even watch.

BUT, I'm willing to cut him some slack. He's only been here two years and he deserves another year or two to show something. But for those who argue that AA just didn't fit Herman's system, that is not AA's fault. Rhoads knew when he got here that AA was most likely going to be our QB for two years. AA had just come off a really good sophomore season. So why did we go and get an OC that didn't fit what AA could do, or that couldn't adjust his offense to fit the QB's abilities?

I feel for AA. I truly believe that Tom Herman made him a worse QB these last two years. AA would have been better off transferring to a better system, but he's too good of a guy to do that to the Cyclones.

I just wonder how many QB's we'll need to go through before we find one that fits Herman's amazing "system"?

You can't blame Herman for Arnauds lack of production. I'm not sure if he got worse over the years or just never improved. But so far Ive heard O-line get blamed for his lack of production, the WRs for not being able to go down field, and its the "bad" system to blame. Quit kidding your self, How long will you blame everyone else?

AA is not a QB. He was a just a kid who ran hard. He would not have been better off transferring, he would have been better off switching to fullback or TE.

We will judge Herman by how he does with his guy. Tiller is from Chizik era and Arnaud from the Mc years.

[isuno1fan]

Continuity is key...we've discussed this before. It is very important this staff stays together for as long as possible. That is the fact of the matter.

[dualthreat]

You can't blame Herman for Arnauds lack of production. I'm not sure if he got worse over the years or just never improved. But so far Ive heard O-line get blamed for his lack of production, the WRs for not being able to go down field, and its the "bad" system to blame. Quit kidding your self, How long will you blame everyone else?

AA is not a QB. He was a just a kid who ran hard. He would not have been better off transferring, he would have been better off switching to fullback or TE.

We will judge Herman by how he does with his guy. Tiller is from Chizik era and Arnaud from the Mc years.

I don't know how you can say that after the great 2008 season he had. I didn't like the way he played in 09 or 10 a lot of the time but he was for sure the best QB we had on roster AND he had proven that he was capable of putting up some good numbers.

Enter in Tom herman and things just weren't the same. Were there other factors? Yes, but we can all agree that the guy calling the plays has the biggest influence.

[clonedude]

You can't blame Herman for Arnauds lack of production. I'm not sure if he got worse over the years or just never improved. But so far Ive heard O-line get blamed for his lack of production, the WRs for not being able to go down field, and its the "bad" system to blame. Quit kidding your self, How long will you blame everyone else?

AA is not a QB. He was a just a kid who ran hard. He would not have been better off transferring, he would have been better off switching to fullback or TE.

We will judge Herman by how he does with his guy. Tiller is from Chizik era and Arnaud from the Mc years.

Hmmm... AA isn't a QB huh? Interesting. Strange how a guy that's "not a QB" can throw for over 400 yds in a game as a sophomore, and for nearly 3,000 yds total that season?

I wish we had more "non-QB's" like AA was as a sophomore playing QB for us. Do you think Steele Jantz, Jerome Tiller, or Jared Barnett will throw for 3,000 yds this year?

Seriously, AA is a QB, and could have been a good one too. But he had to suffer through two years of playing in a system that was completely wrong for him, because Tom Herman was either too stubborn to change his system to fit the qualities of his QB.... OR.... he was too stupid to do so? Which is it?

[RustShack]

I wonder if last years lack of yards had anything to do with one of the hardest schedules in the nation, on top of being players who aren't fit for a spread offense.

[clonedude]

Also... Steele Jantz and Jared Barnett are "Herman's guys". So if Tiller wins the job this year, what does that say about Herman's QB's?

Tiller has been pretty ineffective in his chances at QB. If one of Herman's recruits can't beat him out, what does that say?

If Tiller starts this year, it will sure say a lot about Herman's ability to recruit too.

Greg McDermott is a good basketball coach at the Missouri Valley level, but not in the big leagues. Could the same possibly be true of Herman?

I applauded the hiring of Tom Herman, and obvisously he is a very intelligent guy, but this "system" of his has not only not produced any results, but is just painful to watch. I sure hope he can turn it around. I really do.

I want what is best for ISU football. And as I've said, Herman deserves another couple years to show something because it's still too early. But this offense has not progressed from year one to year two under him. It hasn't even stayed the same.... it's gotten worse.

Maybe Steele Jantz will be the savior of our offensive woes? I personally think that is a LOT to expect of an incoming JUCO QB. In year 3 under Herman, shouldn't we have had a couple of young stud QB's fighting it out to be the starter by now? Where are they? Instead, we had to go out and grab a JUCO kid that nobody else really showed much interest in... and he's supposed to save the offense? I hope he does, but it's a lot to stake your job on IMO.

[RustShack]

Rhoads has done a lot of good things in FB for us. Same with Fred in BB. Freds bringing in a lot of talent and its making it real hard not to get more excited than usual about potentially having a good team. Same goes for CPR in football. The good things happening to ISU are making it a little easier to trust the staff that they found us a good QB in Jantz.

[clonedude]

I wonder if last years lack of yards had anything to do with one of the hardest schedules in the nation, on top of being players who aren't fit for a spread offense.

Those are just excuses. More excuses.

I wish I could use those excuses at my job. Hey boss, I could have gotten us better results, but my methods just aren't built for the kind of employees we have here I guess? Plus... this job is SO hard. The competition from our competitors is just too great to overcome.

Does that sound like lame excuses, because it should.

You work with what you have, not with what you wish you had. Truth is, Herman came into a program with a sophomore QB that just had a pretty darn good year, and he made him less productive each consecutive year after that.

Just find a way to move the ball and score some points. That's all.

[nickcyv]

Are people forgetting the season we had in 2008? We lost every single game in conference and got absolutely drubbed most of the time. Of course AA accumulated more yards. ISU was constantly throwing trying to get back in the games.

Further when you are down 28+ points like we constantly were with Chizik, the other team can take out their starters, backups, and put in the water boys. So AA would rack up meaningless stats against the third stringers while they played a soft prevent defense.

Now I know last year we got whacked by OU and Utah but I'll take Herman and CPR's offense and winning over winning 5 games in two years but throwing for 300 more freaking yards a year. Wake up people.