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**ChrisMWilliams** · 11-21-2012, 09:15 AM

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**Clone5** · 11-21-2012, 09:16 AM

Great column but I'm surprised you don't consider Klein and Knott superstars. They are two of the top ten players we've had this decade.

**atlantacyclone** · 11-21-2012, 09:21 AM

Is Iowa State really below 90 in total defense?

**brentblum** · 11-21-2012, 09:21 AM

Originally Posted by Clone5

Great column but I'm surprised you don't consider Klein and Knott superstars. They are two of the top ten players we've had this decade.

I agree they are big-time players, but AJ and Jake definitely don't seek the spot-light and are more comfortable being just one of many. Point being it is hard to single out one person for the success this season.

**bawbie** · 11-21-2012, 09:21 AM

I don't disagree with the fundamental principle of the article, but I think this is just wrong:

This team has no Sage Rosenfels, no Reggie Hayward, no Seneca Wallace, no Ellis Hobbs, no Tim Dobbins, no Bret Meyer and no Austen Arnaud to lean on in rough times

Jake Knott and AJ Klein are every bit the leader of those previous Cyclones, if not more. The ability of the team to overcome losing one of those leaders is key, but I think it discounts the contribution and leadership of those two stalwarts to say they don't compare to previous Cyclone leaders.

**brentblum** · 11-21-2012, 09:21 AM

Originally Posted by atlantacyclone

Is Iowa State really below 90 in total defense?

Yes, 93rd. But that is based on yardage, not points of course.

**brentblum** · 11-21-2012, 09:24 AM

Originally Posted by bawbie

I don't disagree with the fundamental principle of the article, but I think this is just wrong:

Jake Knott and AJ Klein are every bit the leader of those previous Cyclones, if not more. The ability of the team to overcome losing one of those leaders is key, but I think it discounts the contribution and leadership of those two stalwarts to say they don't compare to previous Cyclone leaders.

Not saying that at all. Just that they have a bunch of help.

**Bader** · 11-21-2012, 09:25 AM

Originally Posted by atlantacyclone

Is Iowa State really below 90 in total defense?

Total Defense - NCAA.com

93.
But if you look at the Opponent's Offensive TDs column you'll see Iowa State's number is far lower than the surrounding teams

**MJ271** · 11-21-2012, 09:51 AM

We are 93rd for total defense (yds allowed) but are 30th for scoring defense. Also, some more interesting stats, we are 18th for fewest penalty yds per game. We are 30th for redzone defense. We are 47th for turnover margin.

**khaal53** · 11-21-2012, 09:57 AM

Side topic, but the fact that "total defense" is figured by yards per game is completely asinine.

**Bader** · 11-21-2012, 10:07 AM

Originally Posted by khaal53

Side topic, but the fact that "total defense" is figured by yards per game is completely asinine.

Total offense is measured in YPG as well, makes no sense. Case in point, Troy has the #12 "total offense", but scored less than 4 TDs per game

**Stormin** · 11-21-2012, 10:19 AM

I attended ISU during the glory days of Earle Bruce. The program that Rhoads is building is similar to Bruce. A multitude of very, very good players that would have equated ultimate "Star" status during leaner times. Tom Boskey, Chris Boskey, Dexter Green, Mike Stensrud, Tom Randall, Luther Blue, Wayne Stanley, Buddy Hardeman, Dick Cuvelier, etc., etc. We had studs throughout the lineup during those glory years of the late '70's.

And like Earle Bruce, Rhoads has now redshirted the entire freshman class. Earle Bruce had redshirted his entire freshman class when Woody Hayes punched a Clemson player and changed the future of ISU football. The thing is now, that Rhoads will likely stay and continue to build this program.

Knott and Klein are 2 of the best linebackers ever at ISU. No doubt about it. In the past they would be the only decent players that could play for other Big XII teams. So they would get ALL the recognition. That is beginning to no longer be the case. We are beginning to close the gap a bit on the level of talent.

**CTTB78** · 11-21-2012, 10:37 AM

Originally Posted by Clone5

Great column but I'm surprised you don't consider Klein and Knott superstars. They are two of the top ten players we've had this decade.

Agree. They are every bit as good as Tim Dobbins.

**cyatheart** · 11-21-2012, 03:44 PM

Originally Posted by ChrisMWilliams

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Yeah, agree. This was one of the more enjoyable seasons I can remember. Not exactly sure why, maybe because I looked forward to every game, thinking our guys had a chance. Even after the losses I never had the feeling of despair that I had in prior years.

I think I just like the way ISU plays now and I think as long as PR is here our guys will have a shot. Defense is just so physical compared to what we have seen before. Offense definelty frustrating at times but still a fun year from my persepctive.

Would be nice to get this last win, go to a good bowl, get everyone healthy for one last game.

**bawbie** · 11-21-2012, 03:50 PM

Originally Posted by CTTB78

Agree. They are every bit as good as Tim Dobbins.

I actually don't really think Dobbin's belonged on that list, at least I don't recall him being a clear leader of the team. He was good, no doubt, but as a 2-year player I never say him as the face of the team.