Arnaud/Bates stats

**djkent01** · 08-18-2008, 10:13 AM

Originally Posted by BigLame

I believe Bates did not fit the profile for 'upper echelon' (sp?) programs in that his is listed at 6'1" - so he's probably stretching to actually be 6'0". I could be wrong if Chiz and the Crew are putting their actual weight and height on the roster, but even if true, at 6'1", Bates doesn't fit the 'height' profile for the 4 to 5 star QB.

This makes sense. I don't recall if Arnaud was getting offers elsewhere. What I do recall is that Chizik has seen firsthand - Vince Young - what happens when you have a QB that can strech the field and hold a defense all by himself. Of course, I'm not saying Bates is a Young, but I do believe that's the style that Chizik ultimately wants to play. He's a defensive guy at heart and he knows as well as anybody what is the hardest to defend.

That said, he'll adapt to whoever gives the team the best chance to win.

**CYdTracked** · 08-18-2008, 10:20 AM

I'll be glad when the game 1 starter is named and we see both these guys out on the field in the first game or 2 so we can finally put this debate to rest based on what we actually can see. None of us here have probably seen the practices so I find all this analysis based off some web articles a bit overboard when it's probably just a small glimpse of what is actually going on in practice.

**Aclone** · 08-18-2008, 10:41 AM

Originally Posted by Nedrick

I believe Bates has the ability to make more plays on the field -- esp. with his legs.

Brad Smith had a lot of playmaking ability--but I hardly would have considered him a great quarterback. I'd take Daniel over him any day.

**djkent01** · 08-18-2008, 10:43 AM

Originally Posted by travman23

I'll be glad when the game 1 starter is named and we see both these guys out on the field in the first game or 2 so we can finally put this debate to rest based on what we actually can see. None of us here have probably seen the practices so I find all this analysis based off some web articles a bit overboard when it's probably just a small glimpse of what is actually going on in practice.

We'll all be glad when that time comes - but it's not here yet. I see this conversation as excitement and anticipation. I've grown almost as weary of the posts telling us that we're trying to make assessment from limited press information as I am the posts about the situation in Iowa City.

Sure. we're not the coaches, we aren't at practices, and we don't know what is going to happen. But it sure is fun to talk about. For that matter, nobody here was in the dorm room in Iowa City, nobody here was in the meeting with the victim - nobody here was involved in any of that, yet the posts are unbelievable.

I, for one, love these anticipatory conversations and these are what draw me to Cyclone Fanatic. And every once in awhile, we get updates and comments from people that truly are close to the team and the players.

I'm as excited for the season to start as anyone, and when the time comes I'm going to be in the stands rooting for the guys on the field. But until then, I'm going to talk about it and I'm going to hear other people's viewpoints. I think that makes me a fan.

**Wesley** · 08-18-2008, 11:01 AM

Can AA play another position if Tiller is getting better?

**StLouisClone** · 08-18-2008, 11:06 AM

Originally Posted by Aclone

Brad Smith had a lot of playmaking ability--but I hardly would have considered him a great quarterback. I'd take Daniel over him any day.

I don't know. Brad Smith didn't seem to have as much talent at WR and TE to work with as Daniel does. So Smith ran the ball a lot out of necessity. Clearly Mizzou is a better overall team now so I don't know if you can fairly compare the two QBs. I think they are both pretty good football players. Brad Smith seems to be doing alright as an NFL WR.

**Aclone** · 08-18-2008, 11:09 AM

Originally Posted by djkent01

Sure. we're not the coaches, we aren't at practices, and we don't know what is going to happen. But it sure is fun to talk about. For that matter, nobody here was in the dorm room in Iowa City, nobody here was in the meeting with the victim - nobody here was involved in any of that, yet the posts are unbelievable.

I'm glad that someone finally made this point.

It's like with the O.J. trial a few years ago. I was talking with a guy, and listened to him rant on for about five minutes (literally)about how O.J. was guilty, on and on, with a great deal of anger. When he finally paused for a breath, I looked him in the eye and asked, Were you there? If you were there that night and saw what happened, you should say something, because I'm pretty sure that the police or the D.A.'s would really really like an eye witness to what actually happened."

Oddly enough, that shut him up.

Originally Posted by Wesley

Can AA play another position if Tiller is getting better?

I'm going to point out that we only have three scholarship quarterbacks...why is everyone so eager for one to play elsewhere?

That's aside from the fact that Tiller could really use a redshirt, if only for another year of separation. I don't think Austen will ever play anywhere else but QB. He's a quarterback, and that's all there is to it.

**jaretac** · 08-18-2008, 11:12 AM

Originally Posted by djkent01

You can all preach about not reading too much into the practice and scrimmage information being posted, but the one thing that strikes me is that Bates has had a lot of long touchdown passes and is also hitting a high percentage of his passes.

I think they are about the same for completion percentage. I didn't figure completion percentage because Cyclone.com is inconsistent in reporting attempts, but from what I saw it looked about the same.

You talked about Bates throwing the deep ball, it could be that part of the reason for the disparity in the stats is because Bates may have trouble with short passes. This is a concern. It seems like Bates either runs the ball or throws it deep- he is not going to get away with that against Big12 opponents.

**Aclone** · 08-18-2008, 11:18 AM

Originally Posted by BigLame

I could be wrong if Chiz and the Crew are putting their actual weight and height on the roster, but even if true, at 6'1", Bates doesn't fit the 'height' profile for the 4 to 5 star QB.

Here are the top six "dual threat" quarterbacks in Rivals' current rankings:

Rivals.com Prospect Rankings

1 Russell Shepard
Houston (TX) Cypress Ridge QB 6-1/179 LSU
2 Tyrik Rollison
Sulphur Springs (TX) Sulphur Springs QB 6-2/185 list
3 Tajh Boyd
Hampton (VA) Phoebus QB 6-0/208 West Virginia
4 Kevin Newsome
Chesapeake (VA) Western Branch QB 6-3/217 Michigan
5 Eugene Smith
Miramar (FL) Miramar QB 6-3/182 list
6 Tate Forcier
San Diego (CA) Scripps Ranch QB 6-0/184 list

All are four or five star players. As you can see, for dual threat QB's like Phillip, height isn't an issue.

**Clonegrad07** · 08-18-2008, 11:40 AM

I think the bigger issue is that we NEED to redshirt Jerome Tiller. That way we seperate him from the crowd a little and get him that help. It helped Bret Meyer, it helped Austin Arnaud... it'll help him. A year of redshirt, let one of these two have 2-3 years of glory and then we still have tiller for two years to start after that.

**jaretac** · 08-18-2008, 11:51 AM

Originally Posted by Clonegrad07

I think the bigger issue is that we NEED to redshirt Jerome Tiller. That way we seperate him from the crowd a little and get him that help. It helped Bret Meyer, it helped Austin Arnaud... it'll help him. A year of redshirt, let one of these two have 2-3 years of glory and then we still have tiller for two years to start after that.

Can I hear the congregation say AMEN!

**mramseyISU** · 08-18-2008, 12:17 PM

I talked with a cousin of mine over the weekend about this. He's a hawk fan through and though but one of 6 of them who isn't a complete ******. We both think Bates is the man when all is said and done. I'm not saying AA is a statue but MacFarland seems to like his QB to have some wheels. From what I read both of them have a howizer. If I'm going to to war and have to pick between one of two guns of the same caliber I'm going with the one that moves faster.

**Cloned4Life** · 08-18-2008, 12:30 PM

I think we'll see a 2 QB system all year. Just a gut feeling. They'll split time at QB (neither will switch positions) because they're both too good to sit.

**cyeah** · 08-18-2008, 12:34 PM

Originally Posted by Cloned4Life

I think we'll see a 2 QB system all year. Just a gut feeling. They'll split time at QB (neither will switch positions) because they're both too good to sit.

If we see it this year all year won't that either push the same decision off a year or set us up for a 2QB for the next 2-3 years?

**clintr** · 08-18-2008, 12:37 PM

Originally Posted by Clonefan94

I wish there was a "I don't know" selection. honestly, without being there, it's really hard to say, even with stats. Who was on the field against them at the time? Are the exact same plays being called each time. Is it always the same players on offense for each QB? For me, I'm keeping an open mind. I really have faith that the guy who should be on the field will be there on the 28th. I guess I just don't want to think (or hear) "Bates (or AA) should have been in there if the first Offensive series tanks.

Right on, clonefan...

There is no way of knowing without being at the practice... and from my understanding they are "closed practices", except for driving past on University/Elwood drive.