Re: View Point of Older Fans
I LOVE the fact that Gene Chizik is our coach, and I love what Jaime Pollard's goals and ambition with the athletic department (although his means are up to scrutiny, it seems).
In my opinion, people need to get over the fact that Chizik and Pollard are here. Others need to get over the fact that Mac isn't. We probably would not have been in position to get either if it weren't for McCarney (or even Van De Velde, for that matter :shocked:). But Chizik and Pollard are here, and so far neither have shown a whole lot to make us doubt them yet.
Re: View Point of Older Fans
Quote:
Originally Posted by
jamesfnb 
Most told me the same thing, "If I had a nickel for everytime over the years I've heard how ISU is "rebuilding" and "this coach will take us to a new level" yada yada" Talking to them doesn't give me much hope for the future.............
Seeing 2 conference titles in 113 years of football tends to make old-timers a little cynical.
Re: View Point of Older Fans
Quote:
Originally Posted by
MontyBurns Do you realize that Earle Bruce used ISU as a stepping stone and jumped at the chance to leave the first time a bigger program came calling? While Dan turned down more than one opportunity to do the same thing in order to stay at ISU?
Bruce may have been a better college coach than McCarney, but McCarney was a better ISU coach than Bruce...or anyone else for that matter.
Yeah Earle Bruce went home and took a job.
Dan McCarney coaching in Iowa was a home type of job for him as well. Most people don't leave once given the opportunity to come back home to coach, plus his whole family lived in Iowa.
If Dan didn't have Iowa connections he probably would of done the same thing. Since when has ISU been a destination job??
Earle Bruce is an ISU coach. Just like Gene Chizik. Gene will do the same thing if he wins. Doesn't make him any less of a Cyclone.
The only way a coach has a longer stay then Dan is if he has Iowa connections and doesn't want to move on to bigger things, or ISU keeps rising the bar in coaching pay.
Here is the facts on Earle Bruce...
Earle Bruce - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Re: View Point of Older Fans
It is not only older fans, I spoke to somebody that works at Iowa State today, and he told me he did not like the new logo, he also said that the McCarney staff treated them allot better then the new staff does.
So I guess it is kind of like if people like somebody you work with, but you have trouble relating with them, those people do not goes on in the inside.
That being said, I am happy with the new staff, and hope they get this turned around.
:confused:
Re: View Point of Older Fans
Quote:
Originally Posted by
MontyBurns Do you realize that Earle Bruce used ISU as a stepping stone and jumped at the chance to leave the first time a bigger program came calling? While Dan turned down more than one opportunity to do the same thing in order to stay at ISU?
Bruce may have been a better college coach than McCarney, but McCarney was a better ISU coach than Bruce...or anyone else for that matter.
That's insane. So what if Earle Bruce and Johnny Majors used ISU as a stepping stone. Between the two of them they went to four bowls (should have been five).
They played in bowl games when they weren't given so freely. And they were both better coaches than Mac at ISU because when they coached there wasn't any scholarship limits.
I liked Mac, but the best? Far from it. In all his time here how many of those teams would have went to a bowl if it never expanded from the 70s?
Re: View Point of Older Fans
OK I'll make it clear:
Earle Bruce had 3 winning seasons and 2 bowl games (0-2) at ISU, and he beat his biggest rival, Iowa, one time.
Dan McCarney had 5 winning seasons and 5 bowl games including 2 bowl wins, and he beat his biggest rival, Iowa, 6 times. By they way, Dan's two bowl wins are the only two bowl wins in ISU history.
Dan McCarney is the best football coach in ISU's history. Nobody has come close to him in number of wins, number of winning seasons, rivalry game wins, bowl appearances, or bowl wins. Whatever Earle Bruce did at Ohio State is nice for Ohio State. It's irrelevent to me. Do you claim part of Texas' 2005 national title belongs to ISU because Mack Brown was an assistant here 29 years ago?
Re: View Point of Older Fans
I know some long time season ticket holders that are upset about the price change in their seats and that is understandable. What some of the mad fans dont realize what it takes to win at this level. JTS need and needs the upgrades bad for a lot of reasons. JP has made people mad but he is putting people in the seats of JTS and that is what he gets paid to do. Even in Macs greatest of seasons ISU had a hard time selling 40,000 tickets and that is now becoming a norm. If a program in the Big 12 isnt making the changes and upgrades then they are falling behind and will have a harder time of catching up. I dont think some realize this. Dan Mac was a good coach at ISU and I am glad he did what he did and he was the coach (why do we always have to say this when talking about him) but the last few years he was at ISU it was more and more visable he was starting to lose the strides he made for one reason or another. At ISU you have small room for error before your program goes backwords and lets face it errors were made at the end of his tenure. These people need to look back and 06 and see how close ISU really was to going 0-11. Change is hard for some but you have to keep up with the times.
Re: View Point of Older Fans
Quote:
Originally Posted by
MontyBurns OK I'll make it clear:
Earle Bruce had 3 winning seasons and 2 bowl games (0-2) at ISU, and he beat his biggest rival, Iowa, one time.
Dan McCarney had 5 winning seasons and 5 bowl games including 2 bowl wins, and he beat his biggest rival, Iowa, 6 times. By they way, Dan's two bowl wins are the only two bowl wins in ISU history.
Dan McCarney is the best football coach in ISU's history. Nobody has come close to him in number of wins, number of winning seasons, rivalry game wins, bowl appearances, or bowl wins. Whatever Earle Bruce did at Ohio State is nice for Ohio State. It's irrelevent to me. Do you claim part of Texas' 2005 national title belongs to ISU because Mack Brown was an assistant here 29 years ago?
I'll keep biting on this Monty...
Dan McCarney had 4 winning seasons in 12 years as coach. 1 season 7-7.
Earle Bruce 3 winning seasons in 6 years. Given 12 years he would of easily gotten more wins then Dan, but he left, so who knows.
Dan had the bowl win. Bruce took the team to bowl games back when they meant more then 6 wins. He had one season with 8 wins and no bowls. Only 1 win against Iowa... Not the flippin SUPERBOWL...
Dan only beat Iowa cause of the SUPERBOWL mentality, cause he was an Iowa Hawkeye for a time.
Earle had teams that won 8 games 3 straight years.
Dan had the most underachieving season when we could of gone undefeated for the most part but couldn't beat Kansas or Missouri when it mattered. Although he did beat Iowa.
In no way did I mention anything that would connect coach Brown his title to ISU.
I stated Earle Bruce left ISU to go home and coach where he played college ball.
Re: View Point of Older Fans
Anyway....
I really don't care much for the Dan arguement, cause for every 1 thing you throw out I can state 5 more that counter that. I love Coach Mac. He did alot of good things, but he is gone now for his own doing. He was a victim of his own success, cause we wanted more and ISU stalled out.
So.... What are the view point of older fans? I keep getting this afraid of change attitude.
Re: View Point of Older Fans
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Originally Posted by
bellzisu Anyway....
I really don't care much for the Dan arguement, cause for every 1 thing you throw out I can state 5 more that counter that. I love Coach Mac. He did alot of good things, but he is gone now for his own doing. He was a victim of his own success, cause we wanted more and ISU stalled out.
So.... What are the view point of older fans? I keep getting this afraid of change attitude.
I'm with you.
As people get older they get that afraid of change attitude. I remember my Dad would rip on is dad for never changing. Now my dad is the one afraid of change, not as bad as his dad, but he still fights it. Once the change is made he thinks its great but getting him to that point is hard at times.
Re: View Point of Older Fans
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Originally Posted by
Cyclonick182 Call me what you will, but I honestly think they have cattered(sp?) to the older market for too long. I think its time this program takes a new shape and reaches out to a new generation. Shake things up and get some attention from a younger market. And as mean as this sounds, but the fans in their 70's arent gonna be around forever, and if we worry more about them then the younger fans, its possible Cyclones could fade with their generation.
They cannot alienate the older market, as they have all the money, and thus more donations.
Re: View Point of Older Fans
Quote:
Originally Posted by
MontyBurns OK I'll make it clear:
Earle Bruce had 3 winning seasons and 2 bowl games (0-2) at ISU, and he beat his biggest rival, Iowa, one time.
Dan McCarney had 5 winning seasons and 5 bowl games including 2 bowl wins, and he beat his biggest rival, Iowa, 6 times. By they way, Dan's two bowl wins are the only two bowl wins in ISU history.
Dan McCarney is the best football coach in ISU's history. Nobody has come close to him in number of wins, number of winning seasons, rivalry game wins, bowl appearances, or bowl wins.
So Earle and Dan had the exact same winning percentage against Iowa. Pretty compelling argument you have there.
Also, Hayden Fry didn't punch an opposing player, resulting in a close-to-home head coaching vacancy.
Nobody came close to Mac in years/games coached, either. But that has no relevance to games won or winning seasons, does it?
Re: View Point of Older Fans
Well, I'm not old by any means, but I really dislike the general direction that college football has taken. Basically it comes down to who has the most $$$, and it's so uneven from top to bottom, that the teams at the bottom won't ever be able to compete.
I would almost compare the current situation of the Big 12 to that of MLB. Texas (Yankees) has more money than they know what to do with, leaving teams like ISU (Royals) to flounder. We roll out a plan to spend $20mil on stadium upgrades (maybe another $65mil for the endzone project), then teams like UT and Mich throw $200+ mil into stadiums that already put ours to shame.
I hate to be such a cynic, but I really don't think it matters what we do to our stadium, which coach we hire, etc. We'll never have the financial resources to compete with the upper half of our conference on a regular basis. Sure, we might catch lightning in a bottle once in a while, but anyone who thinks we can consistently compete for conference championships in the Big 12 is chasing a pipe dream.
Of course, that's just my opinion, I could be wrong.
Re: View Point of Older Fans
Quote:
Originally Posted by
CarolinaCy Sure, we might catch lightning in a bottle once in a while, but anyone who thinks we can consistently compete for conference championships in the Big 12 is chasing a pipe dream.
Of course, that's just my opinion, I could be wrong.
I'll take it now and then or once every 5 or 10 years as long as we compete, have a good record, have a shot in each game, and go to bowl games 3 to 4 of 5 years. Heck I just want to see a conference title before my oldest girl goes to college in 16 years. Another thing I would like to see is fans still being there for the team in those off years.
I agree on the money spent point, but at ISU we have to be smarter and have less room for error as those big budget schools.
Re: View Point of Older Fans
Quote:
Originally Posted by
CarolinaCy Well, I'm not old by any means, but I really dislike the general direction that college football has taken. Basically it comes down to who has the most $$$, and it's so uneven from top to bottom, that the teams at the bottom won't ever be able to compete.
I would almost compare the current situation of the Big 12 to that of MLB. Texas (Yankees) has more money than they know what to do with, leaving teams like ISU (Royals) to flounder. We roll out a plan to spend $20mil on stadium upgrades (maybe another $65mil for the endzone project), then teams like UT and Mich throw $200+ mil into stadiums that already put ours to shame.
I hate to be such a cynic, but I really don't think it matters what we do to our stadium, which coach we hire, etc. We'll never have the financial resources to compete with the upper half of our conference on a regular basis. Sure, we might catch lightning in a bottle once in a while, but anyone who thinks we can consistently compete for conference championships in the Big 12 is chasing a pipe dream.
Of course, that's just my opinion, I could be wrong.
You do know that the parity in college football right now is like none that has ever existed right?
The teams lower on the money chain may not be able to have sustained success, but that doesn't mean they can't have successful years.
