Duncan/Criner/Walden era NCAA football infractions

**pulse** · 07-11-2009, 04:30 AM

Originally Posted by Bigguns

You are right. What he should have complained about the crappy facilities and poor fan support during his first 3 years when he had done every thing right to turn things around.

Year 1 3-8(overall) 2-5(conference) 6th place
Year 2 5-6 3-4 5th
Year 3 6-5 4-3 4th
Year 4 4-6-1 2-4-1 4thT

I don't know what the attendance was but I know it was pathetic. If fans would have supported Walden like they did Chizik he would have one games.

Yes it was the fans' fault....

**WLCY** · 07-11-2009, 04:53 AM

I can remember when Criner was introduced as the new ISU head coach. There was a high school coaches clinic in Des Moines. There were several
coaches talking about it and the first thing we heard from a couple of college coaches was that Criner would turn the program around, but ISU would be put on probation by the NCAA within 4 years. He was known as a coach that was not real ethical when he was hired. The only bad thing about what was said was we were on probation, but Criner never turned the program around.

**CyBobby** · 07-11-2009, 06:45 AM

Originally Posted by jbhtexas

Jimbo was just priming us for things to come. He might have done better with some infrastructure and administrative support from ISU.

At least Chizik bailed before ISU had the opportunity to keep him around way beyond his expiration date...

Let me just say that gene cheezedip chizik did isu and pollard a big favor by heading down south....the good old gene and jamie show was going NOWHERE FAST!!!

Another 2 years down the road and both pollard and chizik would have been run down the road when attendance completely tanked!!!

One thing you can always count on ...If the football is bad the fans will stay home and the stadium will be 3/4th empty...Been there See It and Done It

"GC saved Pollard's job by quitting and heading to Auburn"..sez Matt Perrault kxno radio

**cyclonenum1** · 07-11-2009, 08:43 AM

Originally Posted by Tornado man

+1 to you. Walden continually harping about scholarships got sooooo old. We kept him eight years when he should have been fired after four.

This method of handling coaches at ISU is a time-honored tradition! We kept McCarney 12 when he should have been fired after 3 and just look at what we are doing in MBB right now with McDermott.

I was there for the Criner years and the start of the Walden era. Criner's rule breaking was not real major stuff as I recall...but rule breaking nonetheless. The biggest thing I do recall was how thuggish the team was on the whole. They would get their arses handed to them on Saturday afternoon and then head down to the Cave Inn on Saturday night to beat the crap our of some mild mannered engineering student trying to score a chick at the Cave.

A few mottos from the Criner days...

+ Iowa State is finer with Jim Criner (university released)
+ We cheated and we still couldn't win (student spoken)
+ They can't beat the teams they play so they beat up other students (student spoken)

**Bobber** · 07-11-2009, 09:00 AM

Originally Posted by Bigguns

Calvin Branch was better than Troy Davis when Davis was a Freshman.

How would he know? I don't think they competed against each other. If they would have Davis's talent would have clearly shown.

**Bigguns** · 07-11-2009, 01:53 PM

Originally Posted by pulse

Yes it was the fans' fault....

I am just saying after the Donnie Duncan and Jim Criner years Jim Waldon had things moving in the right direction, had the fans recognized that and filled up the stadium the Athletic Dept could have started improving the facilities then and Walden could can recruited better players and the snowball would have started growing then instead of when we fired him and hired a new coach. Walden didn't even have a out door practice field. The school tried to pass the rec center off as an indoor practice but that was a joke. And yes the fans do have to take some credit for ISU's lack of success in sports.

**Bigguns** · 07-11-2009, 02:10 PM

Originally Posted by Bobber

How would he know? I don't think they competed against each other. If they would have Davis's talent would have clearly shown.

They did compete in practice Branch was bigger, faster, stronger and a better runner in the option offense. Davis was a great I back even as a freshman the problem was we only had 1 TE on scholarship and he dislocated his shoulder during 2 a days. Another problem was that Davis did not clear the NCAA clearing house until about the 3rd week of practice. That's a little late to be changing your offense. I agree that Walden had to go for ISU to make progress but I don't think people realize was an innovative coach he was. His down fall was job selection. Washington State and Iowa State both played second fiddle to Washington and legendary coach Don James and Iowa and legendary coach Hayden Fry.

**CyCloned** · 07-11-2009, 02:15 PM

I didn't look over all of the infractions, but as I remember, lump sum, they were no big deal, and the kind of stuff that goes on everywhere. Clearly it was not the number of dollars involved in the subsidized house scam that went on at the school to the east or nothing like some of the things that happened at ND or CU or NU. As usual it was a case of the NCAA kicking the crap out of a cellar dweller to show that they will enforce the rules as long a it doesn't affect their bottom line.

**CyCloned** · 07-11-2009, 02:18 PM

Originally Posted by Bigguns

They did compete in practice Branch was bigger, faster, stronger and a better runner in the option offense. Davis was a great I back even as a freshman the problem was we only had 1 TE on scholarship and he dislocated his shoulder during 2 a days. Another problem was that Davis did not clear the NCAA clearing house until about the 3rd week of practice. That's a little late to be changing your offense. I agree that Walden had to go for ISU to make progress but I don't think people realize was an innovative coach he was. His down fall was job selection. Washington State and Iowa State both played second fiddle to Washington and legendary coach Don James and Iowa and legendary coach Hayden Fry.

Walden would have been a great OC, no doubt about that. He was a decent game day coach too. What he wasn't was a great recruiter, and if you can't get at least decent players, you are not going anywhere.

**Bigguns** · 07-11-2009, 03:13 PM

Originally Posted by CyCloned

Walden would have been a great OC, no doubt about that. He was a decent game day coach too. What he wasn't was a great recruiter, and if you can't get at least decent players, you are not going anywhere.

he couldn't recruit because ISU had terrible facilities and and even worse budget.

**Tornado man** · 07-11-2009, 03:24 PM

Originally Posted by Bigguns

he couldn't recruit because ISU had terrible facilities and and even worse budget.

Walden "couldn't recruit" because he didn't work hard at it. As soon as an in-state player was also being recruited by Fry, he would give up and stop.
His camps were a joke. Low attendance from kids because the coaches didn't take them very seriously.
Walden didn't push very hard for facilities improvements because he didn't want the pressure or expectations resulting from them. That way he could still wail "poor me."
Just ask anyone who worked in the athletic department to compare the intensity and work days of Walden with McCarney. Night and day.

**Bobber** · 07-11-2009, 07:05 PM

Originally Posted by Bigguns

he couldn't recruit because ISU had terrible facilities and and even worse budget.

And he didn't like to go out on the road...

**Bigguns** · 07-12-2009, 11:20 AM

Originally Posted by Tornado man

Walden "couldn't recruit" because he didn't work hard at it. As soon as an in-state player was also being recruited by Fry, he would give up and stop.
His camps were a joke. Low attendance from kids because the coaches didn't take them very seriously.
Walden didn't push very hard for facilities improvements because he didn't want the pressure or expectations resulting from them. That way he could still wail "poor me."
Just ask anyone who worked in the athletic department to compare the intensity and work days of Walden with McCarney. Night and day.

I won't even try to argue that Mac didn't out work Walden, but Walden worked harder in his first 4 years than he did in the end. Mac lost a bit of that fire in the end to, just not to the degree that Walden did. Walden pushed very hard for an indoor practice facility.

**Bigguns** · 07-12-2009, 11:22 AM

Originally Posted by Bobber

And he didn't like to go out on the road...

I have never herd that before. I don't know where you are coming from with that info.

**cc1091** · 07-13-2009, 10:17 PM

Originally Posted by Bigguns

I am just saying after the Donnie Duncan and Jim Criner years Jim Waldon...

I assume you were trolling from that misspelling.

Aside from the misspelling, I agree with most of what you have said regarding this subject.

Did the Lied recreation facility (that ISU used at that time as an indoor practice facility) exist in the early years when Walden was at ISU? My memory was that it didn't, so indoor practices were at old State gym (i'm told). The 'powers that be'at the University didn't want to spend money on an indoor facility. I remember that the GSA contributed heavily to the building of that facility.

I think that the State Board of Regents and the guy who was President of it at that time (Marvin Pommerantz) had a lot to do with the lack of funding for ISU in general. That this had a detrimental affect for ISU football was only a bonus for hawk fan and Iowa alumnus Pommerantz.

I suppose his ghost will come haunt me now...