Recruiting Iowans

**Bobber** · 11-06-2009, 11:25 AM

Originally Posted by Clark

I think you are confusing this Iowa's defense with the previous Iowa defenses.

They were much faster than Arizona was and the announcers couldn't believe it.

No my point of the general speed both offensively and defensively that the better Big 12 teams have. Iowa caught ISU very early and our offense was primitive and our defense is just plain slow. Iowa really hasn't faced anybody with that kinda speed(maybe Arkansas State...)

Don't get me wrong. Iowa's defense(particuarlly it's secondary) is really good. I think a Texas and Iowa matchup would be interesting. Iowa hasn't faced that kinda speed, but I don't think Texas has faced that good a defense.

**Bigguns** · 11-06-2009, 11:35 AM

Originally Posted by Frak

Well, I'll say that I think you're wrong, but I hope you're right. I don't care how they're rated, Chizik brought in some good players.

Yet here we are 3 years post Mac and on O there are 8 Mac starters, on D there are 8 Mac starters, plus a Punter. With a good mix of in-state and out of state kids. Our statistical leaders in every offensive and nearly every defensive category are Mac guys. My point is not that we are in great shape, but that Chizik guys have not taken over the team because of Mac's horrible recruiting job and/or because of Chizik's great recruiting job.

**homerHAWKeye777** · 11-06-2009, 12:06 PM

AClone -

There's not only the issue of "starting" but also the issue of impact. Furthermore, you're also leaving out the fact that Bernstine, a native Iowan, would likely have been a starter were it not for injury.

With regard to impact, the absence of Sandeman has been hugely felt in our punt-return game ... and that's in addition to the quality depth that he gave the Hawks at WR. Also, Iowa had one Iowan go down at safety (Greenwood), only for another Iowan to come in and fill the void (Conklin). 2 of Iowa's top backups on the DL are Iowans (Meade and Hundertmark). As for on the OL, several of the top backups are from Iowa too ... and they're quality players too (Koeppel, Kuempel, and Haganman).

Also, were it not for injury, Geary would have been pushing for a starting spot ... or a lot of playing time ... at the very least.

Lastly, many of the Iowa guys that were listed for Iowa State are veteran upperclassmen and were brought into the program during the Mac-daddy administration. As Knott and Lenz have already proven ... Iowa kids could have really helped bolster ISU's depth through the prior years even more.

That's what Iowa has benefited from for years ... even if the guys don't end up starters. Furthermore, the Iowa guys still tend to end up setting the example for the squad with regard to work-ethic and attitude ... and that has been a HUGE component of Iowa's success.

While I agree with a prior poster that it really doesn't matter where a kid is from ... there do exist extra perks to landing local quality players. For one thing, you're not going to get the same homesickness issues (that can affect a player's motivation), nor is the weather going to be an issue.

**Clark** · 11-06-2009, 12:07 PM

Originally Posted by Bobber

No my point of the general speed both offensively and defensively that the better Big 12 teams have. Iowa caught ISU very early and our offense was primitive and our defense is just plain slow. Iowa really hasn't faced anybody with that kinda speed(maybe Arkansas State...)

Don't get me wrong. Iowa's defense(particuarlly it's secondary) is really good. I think a Texas and Iowa matchup would be interesting. Iowa hasn't faced that kinda speed, but I don't think Texas has faced that good a defense.

Either I'm not reading that first paragraph right or you have drank way too much koolaid.

Did you just say that Iowa hasn't faced anybody with ISU level speed?

**Bobber** · 11-06-2009, 12:08 PM

Lenz is a freshman.

**Bobber** · 11-06-2009, 12:09 PM

Originally Posted by Clark

Either I'm not reading that first paragraph right or you have drank way too much koolaid.

Did you just say that Iowa hasn't faced anybody with ISU level speed?

No I said ISU was slow.

Iowa hasn't faced anybody with Texas's speed. You haven't faced anybody with Nebraskas defensive speed...

**weR138** · 11-06-2009, 12:12 PM

Originally Posted by Clark

Either I'm not reading that first paragraph right or you have drank way too much koolaid.

Did you just say that Iowa hasn't faced anybody with ISU level speed?

and maybe Ark St.

**Clark** · 11-06-2009, 12:21 PM

Originally Posted by Bobber

No I said ISU was slow.

Iowa hasn't faced anybody with Texas's speed. You haven't faced anybody with Nebraskas defensive speed...

Maybe that's what you meant to say, but I don't think it came across that way.

Nebraska has one heck of a d-line but their LB'ers and secondary don't scare me.

Texas' D is for real though. They are very good. Few teams have played that good of a defense.

**Bigguns** · 11-06-2009, 12:22 PM

Does any one know who in the Fros class was landed by Chizik and who in Chizik first class was landed by Mac? Just curious.

**tazclone** · 11-06-2009, 01:07 PM

Originally Posted by Clark

Maybe that's what you meant to say, but I don't think it came across that way.

Nebraska has one heck of a d-line but their LB'ers and secondary don't scare me.

Texas' D is for real though. They are very good. Few teams have played that good of a defense.

Nebraska's LB's are underrated and with their DL who needs great CBs? Nebraska's defense is hands down the best defense we have played all year. There is no doubt about it at all. Not even close.

**Bigguns** · 11-06-2009, 01:13 PM

Originally Posted by tazclone

Nebraska's LB's are underrated and with their DL who needs great CBs? Nebraska's defense is hands down the best defense we have played all year. There is no doubt about it at all. Not even close.

I disagree. If you give Iowa Nebraska's defense they are not unbeaten.

**homerHAWKeye777** · 11-06-2009, 01:45 PM

Bigguns -

What you're not accounting for is that tazclone is correct ... but not necessarily for the reason that tazclone believes.

Nebraska played an ISU O that was without 2 of it's not weapons on O ... Iowa didn't have that luxury. Furthermore, Iowa's front 7 had a pretty mediocre game against ISU. Thus, I can definitely understand why an ISU fan would be more impressed by the Husker D than the Iowa D. However, a big part of that has to deal with timing of when the respective teams played one another.

I'm quite certain that of ISU's O faced the Iowa D instead of the Husker D a few weeks back ... ISU fans would have a dramatically different opinion. Of course, the view would also be skewed somewhat because Iowa's O is better than the Husker O.

Originally Posted by Bigguns

I disagree. If you give Iowa Nebraska's defense they are not unbeaten.

**Bobber** · 11-06-2009, 01:50 PM

Originally Posted by homerHAWKeye777

Bigguns -

What you're not accounting for is that tazclone is correct ... but not necessarily for the reason that tazclone believes.

Nebraska played an ISU O that was without 2 of it's not weapons on O ... Iowa didn't have that luxury. Furthermore, Iowa's front 7 had a pretty mediocre game against ISU. Thus, I can definitely understand why an ISU fan would be more impressed by the Husker D than the Iowa D. However, a big part of that has to deal with timing of when the respective teams played one another.

I'm quite certain that of ISU's O faced the Iowa D instead of the Husker D a few weeks back ... ISU fans would have a dramatically different opinion. Of course, the view would also be skewed somewhat because Iowa's O is better than the Husker O.

You've obviously never seen Ndamukong Suh play for Nebraksa. Best defensive lineman in the country in my opinion. I didn't see anybody on the Iowa D line that even comes close...

**homerHAWKeye777** · 11-06-2009, 01:53 PM

Bobber -

That is a standard misconception. SEC and Big 12 speed is not, across the board, more impressive than the speed in any other conference. The Big 10, Pac 10, ACC, and Big East all feature plenty of speed.

I'll agree that Texas and OU tend to get guys with impressive speed and athleticism ... however, despite being a huge favorite over Ohio State, Texas just barely got by them in the bowl game last season. Thus, that tells me that the elite speed from the tops of each conference tend to match up well against one another.

Heck, some of the best WRs in the Big 12 over the past few years haven't even really been speed guys (Crabtree, Bryant, Briscoe, ... ). Instead, the advantage that they've had is Texas's environment of year-round 7 on 7 football. If that doesn't refine passing games, I don't know what does.

Originally Posted by Bobber

The other thing I wonder about is would those Iowa players show as well in the speed enviorment that the Big 12 is?

**Bobber** · 11-06-2009, 01:55 PM

Originally Posted by homerHAWKeye777

Bobber -

That is a standard misconception. SEC and Big 12 speed is not, across the board, more impressive than the speed in any other conference. The Big 10, Pac 10, ACC, and Big East all feature plenty of speed.

I'll agree that Texas and OU tend to get guys with impressive speed and athleticism ... however, despite being a huge favorite over Ohio State, Texas just barely got by them in the bowl game last season. Thus, that tells me that the elite speed from the tops of each conference tend to match up well against one another.

Heck, some of the best WRs in the Big 12 over the past few years haven't even really been speed guys (Crabtree, Bryant, Briscoe, ... ). Instead, the advantage that they've had is Texas's environment of year-round 7 on 7 football. If that doesn't refine passing games, I don't know what does.

Speed wins most games and I'll bet on a SEC and Big 12 team who has it over any opponent 9 out of 10 days.