Is Herman at risk with the openings elsewhere?

**jdoggivjc** · 11-29-2009, 09:44 PM

Originally Posted by cyclonenate

No, our offense did NOT do very good this year

I would blame much of that on the offense. Go back and look at the stats - virtually every team that beat us this year owned us in time of possession, which means that the offense didn't do their job first in putting points on the board (esp. against OSU and aTm) and second in keeping the defense off the field (esp. against K-State and Missouri).

**kingcy** · 11-29-2009, 09:46 PM

Originally Posted by jdoggivjc

I would blame much of that on the offense. Go back and look at the stats - virtually every team that beat us this year owned us in time of possession, which means that the offense didn't do their job first in putting points on the board (esp. against OSU and aTm) and second in keeping the defense off the field (esp. against K-State and Missouri).

Yes but if you move the ball you eat into the other team TOP. This team really struggled at times moving the ball.

**Cyrok** · 11-29-2009, 09:47 PM

Does anyone know where the report on assistant coaches' salaries in the Big 12 is? IIRC, ISU was at the bottom and it wasn't close. This should be a priority fix. To step up the quality of our program we have to recruit solid talent both in players and assistant coaches. If we don't pay the coaches better, then the good ones we get will only stay a short while and use ISU as a stepping stone.
It's the nature of the coaching profession for the young guys to move up to better positions, but we need to eliminate salary being a liability to our program.

**d4nim4l** · 11-29-2009, 09:48 PM

IF (and that is a huge if) Herman was on anyone's radar it would be a smaller school in a less athletic/competitive conference than the Big XII.

I am sure Rice would love to have him back right now after this season.

**jdoggivjc** · 11-29-2009, 09:50 PM

Originally Posted by kingcy

Yes but if you move the ball you eat into the other team TOP. This team really struggled at times moving the ball.

That's exactly what I'm talking about. In our losses, with the exception of the KU game, not only did we lose the ToP battle, we were smoked in it, in a lot of cases by more than 10 minutes. The offense simply cannot hang the defense out to dry like that, especially when it's well established that the defense struggled putting any kind of pressure on the QB, even with blitzes.

**kingcy** · 11-29-2009, 09:50 PM

Originally Posted by Cyrok

Does anyone know where the report on assistant coaches' salaries in the Big 12 is? IIRC, ISU was at the bottom and it wasn't close. This should be a priority fix. To step up the quality of our program we have to recruit solid talent both in players and assistant coaches. If we don't pay the coaches better, then the good ones we get will only stay a short while and use ISU as a stepping stone.
It's the nature of the coaching profession for the young guys to move up to better positions, but we need to eliminate salary being a liability to our program.

3 years ago they did make that a priorty and if I am correct our asst coaches were somewhere in the middle of the pack, which I thought was good for what we thought we were getting. In just 3 years we have fell back to the bottom. If coaches move on so be it, most asst coaches will use ISU as a steping stone no matter what the pay. PR is well connected and well thought if in the coaching circle and knows how to find the right guy for the job, he will be able to get good coaches because of that.

**jdoggivjc** · 11-29-2009, 09:52 PM

Originally Posted by kingcy

3 years ago they did make that a priorty and if I am correct our asst coaches were somewhere in the middle of the pack, which I thought was good for what we thought we were getting. In just 3 years we have fell back to the bottom. If coaches move on so be it, most asst coaches will use ISU as a steping stone no matter what the pay. PR is well connected and well thought if in the coaching circle and knows how to find the right guy for the job, he will be able to get good coaches because of that.

Most asst coaches will use any football program (even schools like USC and Texas) as a stepping stone to advance their career, no matter what the pay.

**kingcy** · 11-29-2009, 09:53 PM

Originally Posted by jdoggivjc

Most asst coaches will use any football program (even schools like USC and Texas) as a stepping stone to advance their career, no matter what the pay.

Agreed. The goal of most asst coaches is to be a head coach some day.

**Cyrok** · 11-29-2009, 09:58 PM

Originally Posted by kingcy

3 years ago they did make that a priorty and if I am correct our asst coaches were somewhere in the middle of the pack, which I thought was good for what we thought we were getting. In just 3 years we have fell back to the bottom. If coaches move on so be it, most asst coaches will use ISU as a steping stone no matter what the pay. PR is well connected and well thought if in the coaching circle and knows how to find the right guy for the job, he will be able to get good coaches because of that.

OK, I like your response, but wouldn't it be nice if we had minimal turn-over and the staff could put all their focus into recruiting for ISU and coaching the guys they are familiar with, in a system they are all familiar with?

To really carry out this discussion it would be great to see some comparative stats - anyone have info on turn-over at ISU vs. the rest of the Big 12/national average? I'm going into this with the thought that we have a great deal more turn-over than average. If that's not true, then I'll go back to my crayons.

**Cyrok** · 11-29-2009, 10:05 PM

Originally Posted by arganbright2

Ash is also the recruiting coordinator at ISU---put together a nice class last year on short notice and is doing extremely well this year. Only gets paid 100k a year. ******, Jay Boulware's pay got doubled to 210k when he went to Auburn and I felt that guy was the worst coach on the staff last year....

Wally is staying until he retires at which point I wouldn't be surprised if Ash was named Defensive Coordinator.

Wouldn't mind having Tony Alford back to ISU if he is relieved of his duties along with Charlie Weis at Notre Dame...

Jay Boulware's pay was doubled? These guys have young families and pay has to be an important part of their decision to stay or go regardless of whether the move is a "step up" the coaching ladder.

Also, Wally is staying until he retires and his SON takes over at DC (or has already moved on to a bigger gig). Ash will be long gone by the time Wally retires in 3-5 years.

**kingcy** · 11-29-2009, 10:10 PM

Originally Posted by Cyrok

OK, I like your response, but wouldn't it be nice if we had minimal turn-over and the staff could put all their focus into recruiting for ISU and coaching the guys they are familiar with, in a system they are all familiar with?

To really carry out this discussion it would be great to see some comparative stats - anyone have info on turn-over at ISU vs. the rest of the Big 12/national average? I'm going into this with the thought that we have a great deal more turn-over than average. If that's not true, then I'll go back to my crayons.

I see where you are coming from, but most winning programs do have turn over with their asst coaches, even the good schools. KF at Iowa is one of the few that doesnt. If you look at most asst coaches bio they have been all over the place.

**Cyrok** · 11-29-2009, 10:30 PM

Originally Posted by kingcy

I see where you are coming from, but most winning programs do have turn over with their asst coaches, even the good schools. KF at Iowa is one of the few that doesnt. If you look at most asst coaches bio they have been all over the place.

Yeah. Maybe my first post wasn't clear: I understand that there is a ton of movement in the coaching profession, but it seems to me that there is more turn-over at ISU then there is at other schools and I'm offering up salary as one reason for it.
Is there a way to compare assistant coach turn-over at ISU vs the average for the Big 12 or nationally?

**everyyard** · 11-29-2009, 10:34 PM

Originally Posted by Covenant Clone

I wouldn't worry about Herman for a couple more years. IMO he needs to be a coordinator in a major conference and have some legitimate success before he gets a look at being the head man somewhere. He did some nice things at Rice but he needs to prove himself in the big 12.

yeah, no chance a major program would hire a coach from ISU with no proven record. (chizik...cough...cough).

**theyork** · 11-29-2009, 11:00 PM

uh...did you see our offense this year? it was pretty offensive, if you will.

i would say we are pretty safe until the day our offense shows a pulse.

**CyPride** · 11-30-2009, 12:26 AM

Originally Posted by Bigguns

After a year of overachieving all assistants will be at-risk to leave. It is better than the alternative. I hope all of our assistants that grade out well with PR get generous raises.

Overachieving?

Look at who we have beaten, and look at our conference. Outside Texas, we are not a good conference. OSU has a BCS bowl on the line and they can only muster 50 yards offense, and give up 27 to a horrible offensive team?

Yes, we beat Nebraska, but come on, how many times did they fumble inside the 5? 8 turnovers and how many points did we score? 10?

North Dakota St, Army, Baylor, Bowling Green (or whatever terrible MAC team that had that high school stadium)........

I'm not ready to play this overachieve card yet.