MVC Bias

**Bobber** · 03-01-2008, 10:47 AM

There sure seems to be a bias against the Missouri Valley Conference from some of the posters on this site. It almost seems that people feel that conference is second class and because Greg McDermott came from there, he has no chance of success in a "Power Conference" like the Big 12.

Why do some of you feel that way? Norm Stewart who was a very successful coach at Missouri first coached at UNI and that was before they were Division 1 AA. I'm sure you could rattle off a list of very good national coaches who also came from similar backgrounds.

Perhaps some of you feel threatened by the MVC? That conference is certainly more competive then what it was 20 years ago. Teams like SIU and Creighton can and do compete with most everyone in the country. They've got some great coaches, athletes and fans.

I'm not trying to start a flame throwing thread here. Some open discussion on this I think would be healthy for everyone.

**Cydkar** · 03-01-2008, 11:02 AM

This yeas the MVC isn't as good as the last 3-4.

**jumbopackage** · 03-02-2008, 08:29 PM

yeah I don't see anyone getting threatened by the MVC. It's a pretty good league, really, but it's still got a ways to go before it's in the same class as the major conferences.
I don't think it's misguided for people to have questions about coaches moving from one league to the other. While Drake may be a good TEAM, they simply don't have the athletes that the elite programs have. Can anyone imagine Kansas or Texas or Tennessee or Duke dropping games to St. Mary's, Southern Illinois, Bradley and Missouri State and still being taken seriously?

A couple of good teams does not a good conference make.

**CycloneErik** · 03-02-2008, 08:37 PM

Originally Posted by jumbopackage

yeah I don't see anyone getting threatened by the MVC. It's a pretty good league, really, but it's still got a ways to go before it's in the same class as the major conferences.
I don't think it's misguided for people to have questions about coaches moving from one league to the other. While Drake may be a good TEAM, they simply don't have the athletes that the elite programs have. Can anyone imagine Kansas or Texas or Tennessee or Duke dropping games to St. Mary's, Southern Illinois, Bradley and Missouri State and still being taken seriously?

A couple of good teams does not a good conference make.

I would say that every team has struggles in conference play with teams you wouldn't think would be challenging.

And St. Mary's has been ranked for much of the year.

**jumbopackage** · 03-02-2008, 08:42 PM

Originally Posted by CycloneErik

I would say that every team has struggles in conference play with teams you wouldn't think would be challenging.

And St. Mary's has been ranked for much of the year.

I agree, to some extent. One or two of those losses would be believable for a top tier team, but you go undefeated outside of those losses? I guess my point is that the top-to-bottom quality of teams in the MVC just isn't the same as the major conferences.

**CycloneErik** · 03-02-2008, 08:49 PM

Originally Posted by jumbopackage

I agree, to some extent. One or two of those losses would be believable for a top tier team, but you go undefeated outside of those losses? I guess my point is that the top-to-bottom quality of teams in the MVC just isn't the same as the major conferences.

I'm sure that the bottom MVC teams are pretty bad compared to other conferences. It just seems that the things we logically expect kind of go out the window in conference play.

So, I can see it happening where a top tier team nationally could be in the MVC, and still manage to drop one to Evansville, or whoever else may be at the bottom.

Seems like our Elite Eight team had a little problem with Drake that year. That sort of thing.

**ajk4st8** · 03-02-2008, 09:05 PM

Maybe its that most of the people here dont want to end up playing a defense only MVC style of bball.

**CycloneErik** · 03-02-2008, 09:13 PM

Originally Posted by ajk4st8

Maybe its that most of the people here dont want to end up playing a defense only MVC style of bball.

I could see that. I do love to see a running team

**kingcy** · 03-02-2008, 10:14 PM

It is a good conference and has put some good coaches into BCS jobs. It doesnt have the depth of athletes as other conferences but the coachs do a good job of put the plays in a position to win.

**Wesley** · 03-02-2008, 10:20 PM

Even though it went 8-2 on bracket buster saturday, Drake and Illinois State might be the only reps (maybe just MVC tournament winner). That is not enough reps to have respect. If they had 4-6 reps in NCAA, then it would be much more impressive. MVC is down this year just like the Big 12 is slightly up this year. Of course, the Big 10 is down also. Winning by defense is not as much fun watchng as winning by offense like memphis, Duke, NC. etc.

**JHudd** · 03-02-2008, 10:27 PM

Originally Posted by jumbopackage

A couple of good teams does not a good conference make.

I love that line, it made me picture Yoda the minute I read it.

**RocktheDome** · 03-04-2008, 12:01 AM

The MVC is a quality league that doesn't get the respect it deserves. There are many characteristics that set the MVC apart from other "mid-major" conferences, mainly coaches salaries, modern arenas, and dedicated fan bases. Several Valley coaches get $750,000 annual salaries. Unheard of for "mid-major" teams. Facilities are top notch as well, Koch Arena in Wichita, Qwest Center in Omaha, and Missouri State's brand new Hammons Arena are examples of great arenas. Even UNI's McLeod Center which is on the smaller side is a great place to watch basketball. SIU will be renovating their arena soon. Half of the conference has brand new/newly renovated arenas.

People need to realize that the MVC has to fight much harder to earn those Big Dance berths. While Iowa State and Iowa help out UNI and Drake every year by giving home games to the Panthers and Bulldogs (similar to Creighton and Nebraska), certain schools refuse to play instate MVC schools. Illinois has nothing to do with Bradley, SIU, or Illinois State and Missouri refuses to play Missouri State. In my opinion, this is due to fear. As one poster said, BCS teams feel threatened to play AT Valley arenas. Because they are just as hard to win at as BCS arenas. Fear because these games are viewed as lose-lose situations. For some reason Valley schools aren't given the respect that it is okay to lose to them. They are viewed as schools that aren't as good as BCS league teams and therefore should never beat a BCS league team, let alone on their home court. Heck, Cyclone and Hawkeye (along with Husker fans) get up in arms every year after Drake, UNI, Bradley, and Creighton beat them. They need to realize these aren't bad losses. It's better than losing to Iowa, Colorado, or other BCS bottom dwellers.

When schools like Missouri State get left out of the tournament two years in a row with an RPI in the 20s and over 20 wins because the MVC should never have more teams in the tournament than the ACC shows the lack of respect for the MVC. The conference is down this year. But every single conference outside of the BCS conferences would love to say they were the 8th ranked conference in a down year.

I'll get off the soap box, haha.

**Ficklone02** · 03-04-2008, 12:24 AM

The MVC is very competitive...and I-State is doing everything we can to promote those teams the past few years. :)

**Erik4Cy** · 03-04-2008, 12:32 AM

Originally Posted by ajk4st8

Maybe its that most of the people here dont want to end up playing a defense only MVC style of bball.

I agree, however, it would NEVER keep me from watching Iowa State or attending games in Hilton. But god knows I would love to see that style of defense played, but I really would like our offense to be sped up a little to help compete with teams that can run. You can't totally shut down teams like KU, Texas, etc. with defense. Gotta be able to put points on the board. Please people, give McDermott's style a chance. I was completely excited watching his UNI teams up here in C.F. and even then Iowa State has still been my favorite team first, but I found myself jumping up and going nuts watching his Panther teams winning. Good times to come people. GO I-State!

**cyclonenum1** · 03-05-2008, 09:17 AM

Originally Posted by RocktheDome

The MVC is a quality league that doesn't get the respect it deserves. There are many characteristics that set the MVC apart from other "mid-major" conferences, mainly coaches salaries, modern arenas, and dedicated fan bases. Several Valley coaches get $750,000 annual salaries. Unheard of for "mid-major" teams. Facilities are top notch as well, Koch Arena in Wichita, Qwest Center in Omaha, and Missouri State's brand new Hammons Arena are examples of great arenas. Even UNI's McLeod Center which is on the smaller side is a great place to watch basketball. SIU will be renovating their arena soon. Half of the conference has brand new/newly renovated arenas.

People need to realize that the MVC has to fight much harder to earn those Big Dance berths. While Iowa State and Iowa help out UNI and Drake every year by giving home games to the Panthers and Bulldogs (similar to Creighton and Nebraska), certain schools refuse to play instate MVC schools. Illinois has nothing to do with Bradley, SIU, or Illinois State and Missouri refuses to play Missouri State. In my opinion, this is due to fear. As one poster said, BCS teams feel threatened to play AT Valley arenas. Because they are just as hard to win at as BCS arenas. Fear because these games are viewed as lose-lose situations. For some reason Valley schools aren't given the respect that it is okay to lose to them. They are viewed as schools that aren't as good as BCS league teams and therefore should never beat a BCS league team, let alone on their home court. Heck, Cyclone and Hawkeye (along with Husker fans) get up in arms every year after Drake, UNI, Bradley, and Creighton beat them. They need to realize these aren't bad losses. It's better than losing to Iowa, Colorado, or other BCS bottom dwellers.

When schools like Missouri State get left out of the tournament two years in a row with an RPI in the 20s and over 20 wins because the MVC should never have more teams in the tournament than the ACC shows the lack of respect for the MVC. The conference is down this year. But every single conference outside of the BCS conferences would love to say they were the 8th ranked conference in a down year.

I'll get off the soap box, haha.

A quick question for you...when was the last time a MVC team made it to the Final Four?

The answer might tell you why the MVC doesn't get the respect you think it deserves.