TCU and the Mountain West

[clone4good]

Put TCU in the Sec, Put Utah in the Big 12, Put BYU in the Big Ten and these teams will have more than 1 or 2 losses. Same goes with Boise State put them in one of those conferences and they will be the same. These teams are good and the mountain west is pretty good. But just imagine these teams playing high quality teams week in and week out. They would be playing the nations top recruits if they were put in one of these conferences which means they would have to get up for each and every single game. I just cant see that happening.

[alaskaguy]

Put TCU in the Sec, Put Utah in the Big 12, Put BYU in the Big Ten and these teams will have more than 1 or 2 losses. Same goes with Boise State put them in one of those conferences and they will be the same. These teams are good and the mountain west is pretty good. But just imagine these teams playing high quality teams week in and week out. They would be playing the nations top recruits if they were put in one of these conferences which means they would have to get up for each and every single game. I just cant see that happening.

There are very weak teams in every conference. Teams in the BCS Conferences aren't playing high quality teams week in and week out. For example just how many high quality teams did Iowa State play this season? Iowa, Nebraska, and that's really the extent of the high quality teams they played this season.

[Bobber]

There are very weak teams in every conference. Teams in the BCS Conferences aren't playing high quality teams week in and week out. For example just how many high quality teams did Iowa State play this season? Iowa, Nebraska, and that's really the extent of the high quality teams they played this season.

You forgot Oky State and Missouri isn't that bad. KU was actually rated when we played them as well.

[Dryburn]

I really hate arguments like this. Not many conferences have more than about 1/3 of thier teams that are that strong. The exception might be the SEC, and on occassion, the Big 11, Big 12, and Pac 10. People can argue that if these Mountain West, Conference USA, and other small conference teams had to play in the bigger conferences, they would not win as many games, but that is a baseless statement. If these schools played in those conferences with the same teams they have now that may be true. However, if they played in the bigger conferences, their recruiting and revenue situations would also improve, so who is to say how strong they would be?

Does Texas truly play quality competition for their level each week? How about Florida or Alabama this year? Did Ohio State, Iowa and Penn State play high-level competition each week?

I just think these other conferences need to be given a lot more credit than they are by the analysts and others. Fact so far this year is that 2 MWC teams have beaten 2 Pac 10 teams in bowls, and beaten them pretty convincingly. Wyoming beat a very good Fresno State team. The lower level teams in that conference this year were teams like UNLV (which ISU has not exactly dominated) and Colorado State (who had 3 wins this year, including one against Colorado).

The Mountain West deserves a lot more credit then they are getting, IMO. I would love to have seen TCU take on Florida, Texas, or Alabama. Instead, they get put against Boise State.....so no matter who wins, it won't mean much on the national scale. Pretty sad.

People still downplay Boise State too....which amazes me. Here is an undefeated team, who beat the Pac 10 conference champion Oregon handily (yes, make all the first game, blah, blah, blah excuses): a team (Oregon) that most are picking to beat the Big 10 conference champion.

Personally, I just think the whole BCS thing is nonsense. These schools from supposedly "lesser" conferences to me are embarrassing the big boys. That is why we are getting 2 undefeated teams in TCU and Boise against each other rather than playing someone from the BCS schools.

[cyfan15]

You know, it's not like we wouldn't be in the same position if it weren't for the fact that we were extremely lucky that we forced 8 turnovers against Nebraska. Actually, we wouldn't be in the same position as Wyoming - they'd be bowling and we'd be staying home.

The difference is that Colorado, Baylor, and Iowa State would all have better records than Wyoming against their schedule. In fact, Colorado blew Wyoming out. Yes, I know Colorado State beat Colorado, but that was a rivalry game and Colorado was a lot better by the end of the season.

The bottom half of the Mountain West just doesn't compare to the bottom half of any BCS conference including the Big East. TCU is as good as anybody IMO, and BYU and Utah are comparable to Cotton Bowl and Holiday Bowl type teams, but there aren't any Alamo/Champs Sports/Car Care Bowl type teams. 4th place Air Force is comparable to the teams in the Insight Bowl. Wyoming is in the New Mexico Bowl, but wouldn't be in a bowl in a BCS conference. Then everybody else in the conference is comparable to Vanderbilt, Maryland, and Washington State. Roughly half the teams in the MWC would only have 1-4 wins each if they played in a BCS conference.

The MWC can be a BCS conference if they add Boise State (and possibly two more like Fresno State, Nevada, or Houston) and if the bottom half improves. Wyoming and Colorado State (despite the setback this year) have good coaches and will get better. San Diego State has a great coaching staff and has a chance to improve to the 4th best program IMO. UNLV also hired a coach with a good resume. New Mexico has a ways to go. If two out of the bottom six start winning 7-9 games per year and they add Boise State, I don't know how you could keep them out.

[Bobber]

The difference is that Colorado, Baylor, and Iowa State would all have better records than Wyoming against their schedule. In fact, Colorado blew Wyoming out. Yes, I know Colorado State beat Colorado, but that was a rivalry game and Colorado was a lot better by the end of the season.

You know most of your post made a lot of sense, but I did not see Colorado get a lot better by season end. Their level of play really did not seem to change much all season.

[cyfan15]

There are very weak teams in every conference. Teams in the BCS Conferences aren't playing high quality teams week in and week out. For example just how many high quality teams did Iowa State play this season? Iowa, Nebraska, and that's really the extent of the high quality teams they played this season.

It's just not the same. The teams that are considered average or bad in the BCS conferences are on a whole other level than the average and bad teams from the Mountain West. Teams like Kansas, Purdue, Baylor, Washington, Wake Forest, Virginia, Syracuse, etc. that are considered bad teams wouldn't have much problem getting to a bowl in the Mountain West. They would lose to BYU, Utah, TCU, and maybe Air Force, but beat most of the other teams.

[cyfan15]

You know most of your post made a lot of sense, but I did not see Colorado get a lot better by season end. Their level of play really did not seem to change much all season.

I disagree. Colorado did not look good at all to start the season. In November though, they played four bowl teams. The offense looked a lot better and they beat Texas A&M. The losses to Iowa State, Oklahoma State, and Nebraska were all one score games.

[alaskaguy]

It's just not the same. The teams that are considered average or bad in the BCS conferences are on a whole other level than the average and bad teams from the Mountain West. Teams like Kansas, Purdue, Baylor, Washington, Wake Forest, Virginia, Syracuse, etc. that are considered bad teams wouldn't have much problem getting to a bowl in the Mountain West. They would lose to BYU, Utah, TCU, and maybe Air Force, but beat most of the other teams.

Yeah right.

That's why Iowa State was lucky to defeat UNLV which was a bad Mountain West in 2007 and lost to UNLV which was a bad Mountain West team in 2008.

[cyfan15]

Yeah right.

That's why Iowa State was lucky to defeat UNLV which was a bad Mountain West in 2007 and lost to UNLV which was a bad Mountain West team in 2008.

You can believe whatever you want, but we're talking about the 6th place team in the MWC needing overtime to beat 2-10, last place in the Big 12 Iowa State.

[alaskaguy]

You can believe whatever you want, but we're talking about the 6th place team in the MWC needing overtime to beat 2-10, last place in the Big 12 Iowa State.

Yeah, in 2007 ISU was lucky to beat UNLV at Ames and won two Conference games while UNLV ended up wining one conference game.

[cyfan15]

Yeah, in 2007 ISU was lucky to beat UNLV at Ames and won two Conference games while UNLV ended up wining one conference game.

The bottom team in a BCS conference isn't going to dominate the bottom team in the MWC every single time, but it will more often than not. And you're talking about 2006 team that won one conference game and was four plays away from 0-12. My point remains that most of the bad team in BCS conferences would perform very well against the bottom of the MWC. There are always exceptions, like Washington State this year.

[jdoggivjc]

The difference is that Colorado, Baylor, and Iowa State would all have better records than Wyoming against their schedule. In fact, Colorado blew Wyoming out. Yes, I know Colorado State beat Colorado, but that was a rivalry game and Colorado was a lot better by the end of the season.

The bottom half of the Mountain West just doesn't compare to the bottom half of any BCS conference including the Big East. TCU is as good as anybody IMO, and BYU and Utah are comparable to Cotton Bowl and Holiday Bowl type teams, but there aren't any Alamo/Champs Sports/Car Care Bowl type teams. 4th place Air Force is comparable to the teams in the Insight Bowl. Wyoming is in the New Mexico Bowl, but wouldn't be in a bowl in a BCS conference. Then everybody else in the conference is comparable to Vanderbilt, Maryland, and Washington State. Roughly half the teams in the MWC would only have 1-4 wins each if they played in a BCS conference.

The MWC can be a BCS conference if they add Boise State (and possibly two more like Fresno State, Nevada, or Houston) and if the bottom half improves. Wyoming and Colorado State (despite the setback this year) have good coaches and will get better. San Diego State has a great coaching staff and has a chance to improve to the 4th best program IMO. UNLV also hired a coach with a good resume. New Mexico has a ways to go. If two out of the bottom six start winning 7-9 games per year and they add Boise State, I don't know how you could keep them out.

Blah blah blah it was a rivalry game. Blah blah blah Colorado would still rule the MWC. You know what this screams of? Excuses. Fact is, it's a rather bold assumption to say that Colorado would automatically have a better record than they do now if they played in the MWC, considering they lost to the worst team in the MWC (they even lost to New Mexico, a team that we were making fun of earlier this year). Colorado was just bad. So bad they lost to Toledo, a rather poor team from the MAC. You want to go to bat for Colorado and use the rivalry excuse for Colorado losing that game?

And unless they were playing in the Sun Belt Conference, they were going to struggle no matter who they played this year. But even that's debatable - as I pointed out, they couldn't compete with less-than-middle-of-the-road MAC teams this year...

[sunset]

It's really kind of funny that people are now arguing that the MWC type conference aren't as good because their worst teams aren't as "good" as the automatic qualifying conference's worst teams. Why is it comical? Because we'll never know since the worst teams don't play each other in bowl games (and very infrequently in regular season). As others have said, CSU regularly beats Colorado. UNLV beat us last year. Most yearss I'd take Air Force against the bottom half of the Big12. I guess people can't argue that the top teams aren't good enough anymore because they are smoking automatic qualifying conf teams in bowl games.

[dualthreat]

so should the mountain west be added? What will that solve? Boise state will ***** then.

What really needs to change is notre dame and their BS automatic qualifying