Gordon Hayward

**cyclonenum1** · 04-04-2010, 12:28 PM

This kid has a babyface but he is a player!

He has excellent range with a very nice stroke. He has good handles. He has some very nice mid-range-and-in moves in his repertoire. He is stronger on defense and rebounding than his body would lead you to believe.

If he could pass a little better he might be the second coming of Larry Bird.

**06Panther** · 04-04-2010, 01:02 PM

He is really good. And only a sophmore. Until recently, I wasn't aware of how big he actually is. I think he is listed at like 6'8.

**CloneIce** · 04-04-2010, 01:05 PM

Worst mustache ever.

**Ficklone02** · 04-04-2010, 01:07 PM

Originally Posted by CloneIce

Worst mustache ever.

I think you are referring to Howard. His mustache is awful!

**isuno1fan** · 04-04-2010, 01:08 PM

He looks a little funny because he has a man's body, but the head of a 12 year old boy.

Good player however.

**CloneIce** · 04-04-2010, 01:11 PM

Originally Posted by Ficklone02

I think you are referring to Howard. His mustache is awful!

Yeah I guess he's the one. So long, so scraggly, so ugly.

**cyatheart** · 04-04-2010, 01:18 PM

Hayward is really an outstanding player, I personally think the most complete player in the tournament. Other will disagree and that's fine. 6'8 can put it on the floor, rebound, shoot it from anywhere, go inside when need be and is an excellent defender. Interesting he was a 3 star, 6'8 185 coming out of high school, skinny as a bean pole. Picked Butler over IUPUI and Purdue.

Howard was a pretty big recruit it looks like, 4 star player, picked Butler over Purdue, Indiana, Dayton and Xavier.

**ISUChippewa** · 04-04-2010, 04:03 PM

This kid has a babyface but he is a player!

He has excellent range with a very nice stroke. He has good handles. He has some very nice mid-range-and-in moves in his repertoire. He is stronger on defense and rebounding than his body would lead you to believe.

If he could pass a little better he might be the second coming of Larry Bird.

Wow, I'm impressed....strong words coming from you since in your previous posts in different threads you have seemed to hate mid-majors and don't even think they should be allowed to play basketball at all.

I agree with you. I think he is the best individual player with the biggest NBA upside left in the tournament.

**cyclonenum1** · 04-05-2010, 08:02 AM

Originally Posted by ISUChippewa

This kid has a babyface but he is a player!

He has excellent range with a very nice stroke. He has good handles. He has some very nice mid-range-and-in moves in his repertoire. He is stronger on defense and rebounding than his body would lead you to believe.

If he could pass a little better he might be the second coming of Larry Bird.

Wow, I'm impressed....strong words coming from you since in your previous posts in different threads you have seemed to hate mid-majors and don't even think they should be allowed to play basketball at all.

I agree with you. I think he is the best individual player with the biggest NBA upside left in the tournament.

I don't hate mid-majors...I just call BS on anyone that tries to imply that the level of play in the mid-major conferences is anywhere near the level of play in the power conferences...because it is not.

You look at the teams from mid-major conferences that have made it to the finals...Indiana State, UNLV in the 90s, Memphis in the 00s, and now Butler and you see they are the exception rather than the rule.

What is interesting is there are a couple of common threads to these mid-majors that get this far...very talented (NBA good) players that spurned schools in the power conferences and went to the mid-major...and absolute total domination (no losses and often no one even giving a stiff challenge) of their mid-major conference both during the season and in the post season tournament.

What will be interesting is to see if Butler will be like Indiana State where the success was a total aberration or if they will be like UNLV of the 90s or Memphis of the 00s where they are able to maintain their level of success and gain the respect nationally to the point that they are not even really considered a mid-major in the eyes of most. To do that you have to keep that quality player pipeline flowing and you have to run the table in your league 2-3 years in a row and then make deep runs in the NCAAs every year.

Somehow, I get the impression that Butler will be more like Indiana State than UNLV or Memphis...but I could be wrong.

At any rate...Hayward is a fantastic player as I said before.

**cyatheart** · 04-05-2010, 08:22 AM

Originally Posted by cyclonenum1

I don't hate mid-majors...I just call BS on anyone that tries to imply that the level of play in the mid-major conferences is anywhere near the level of play in the power conferences...because it is not.

You look at the teams from mid-major conferences that have made it to the finals...Indiana State, UNLV in the 90s, Memphis in the 00s, and now Butler and you see they are the exception rather than the rule.

What is interesting is there are a couple of common threads to these mid-majors that get this far...very talented (NBA good) players that spurned schools in the power conferences and went to the mid-major...and absolute total domination (no losses and often no one even giving a stiff challenge) of their mid-major conference both during the season and in the post season tournament.

What will be interesting is to see if Butler will be like Indiana State where the success was a total aberration or if they will be like UNLV of the 90s or Memphis of the 00s where they are able to maintain their level of success and gain the respect nationally to the point that they are not even really considered a mid-major in the eyes of most. To do that you have to keep that quality player pipeline flowing and you have to run the table in your league 2-3 years in a row and then make deep runs in the NCAAs every year.

Somehow, I get the impression that Butler will be more like Indiana State than UNLV or Memphis...but I could be wrong.

At any rate...Hayward is a fantastic player as I said before.

All good points. I would argue Butler has been playing at a high level for a long time already, not national championship good, but they have been to the tourney 7 times since 2000. Also, they return 4 starters next year I believe, they will be very very good gain next year, probably ranked top 5 if I had to guess. (Hell they were top 10 at the begginning of this year.)

**Clonefan32** · 04-05-2010, 09:19 AM

I am making a prediction tonight, that Hayward scores maybe 10 and has 4 boards. I think Lance Thomas is going to eat his lunch....which I hate to say because I can't stand Duke.

**Al_4_State** · 04-05-2010, 09:20 AM

He looks like the guy from Dodgeball that ends up with the nasty Eastern European woman. Regardless, the guy can seriously ball. He has a bright future.

**CylentButDeadly** · 04-05-2010, 09:34 AM

Before we get too carried away on Hayward being a great outside shooter, it should be pointed out that he's only a 29% shooter from three point land this season. Granted, last year he took about the same number of threes and was a 44% shooter, but he has struggled from outside this year, even though he's knocked down a couple bigs ones in the tournament.

**cyclonenum1** · 04-05-2010, 10:03 AM

Originally Posted by cyatheart

All good points. I would argue Butler has been playing at a high level for a long time already, not national championship good, but they have been to the tourney 7 times since 2000. Also, they return 4 starters next year I believe, they will be very very good gain next year, probably ranked top 5 if I had to guess. (Hell they were top 10 at the begginning of this year.)

You know, I forgot about Utah in the 90s under Majerus.

They got to the finals with Keith Van Horn and Andre Miller. Kind of similar to Hayward and Mack of Butler.

Anyway, Utah was something in between Indiana State (one hit wonder on the national stage) and UNLV/Memphis (recognized as a perrenial power for a period of time on the national stage).

Maybe that will be where Butler ends up as well.

**brokenloginagain** · 04-05-2010, 10:20 AM

Originally Posted by cyclonenum1

You know, I forgot about Utah in the 90s under Majerus.

They got to the finals with Keith Van Horn and Andre Miller. Kind of similar to Hayward and Mack of Butler.

Anyway, Utah was something in between Indiana State (one hit wonder on the national stage) and UNLV/Memphis (recognized as a perrenial power for a period of time on the national stage).

Maybe that will be where Butler ends up as well.

Not to be too picky but Utah made the finals with only Miller - Van Horn went pro the year before.....