Outsiders view of ISU football

[Clark]

My take on this is that if we consistently win 6-7 games and go to a blah.com bowl, the ISU fanbase will be sick of this after about 3-4 years (see Danny Mac era) and begin to say that we need to find someone to get us over the hump. I for one would have this attitude. In order to be relevant I agree, we need to be consistent. Win at a minimum 6 games probably 9 out of 10 years and win 8 or 9 or even 10 games at least two times in that same 10 year span. We dont need BCS every year but we need to play in Jan. a few times.

As one other posted stated we cant stand another two year stretch like the Chizick era.

That's the point some are missing. ISU isn't going to get respect finishing .500 every year and going to some crappy bowl nobody sees. At some point ISU will have to make a few runs at a conference championship in order to get respect. They don't have to win it, but just having ISU's name in the discussion would be huge.

[The_Architect]

Consistency and a major upset every now any again. For example beating OU 2 seasons ago tied 7-7 in the 4th quarter. We need to be able to compete better with superior teams. We should never lose at home as badly as we did last season to Okie State for example.

[GoShow97]

My take on this is that if we consistently win 6-7 games and go to a blah.com bowl, the ISU fanbase will be sick of this after about 3-4 years (see Danny Mac era) and begin to say that we need to find someone to get us over the hump. I for one would have this attitude. In order to be relevant I agree, we need to be consistent. Win at a minimum 6 games probably 9 out of 10 years and win 8 or 9 or even 10 games at least two times in that same 10 year span. We dont need BCS every year but we need to play in Jan. a few times.

As one other posted stated we cant stand another two year stretch like the Chizick era.

Four winning seasons out of 12. One, 1 win season, Two, 2 wins seasons, Two, 3 win seasons. Two failed Big 12 North titles. A 56-85 all time record. This is what the fan base was sick of.

[CYkodelic]

That's the point some are missing. ISU isn't going to get respect finishing .500 every year and going to some crappy bowl nobody sees. At some point ISU will have to make a few runs at a conference championship in order to get respect. They don't have to win it, but just having ISU's name in the discussion would be huge.

disagree a little. i think at some point we need to win a conference championship, for real, not just "be in the conversation" or make a run. none of that shared title stuff either. if that's all we ever accomplish and never actually reach the mountain, then it's all just threats and most will still see us as an also ran. we're still just pretenders, not true contenders.

[delt4cy]

In order to be consistent and improve our national view we have to:

1. Beat KU, K-state, and Missouri consistently. (toughest task)

2. Continue to improve our facilities...ie (bowl the south end zone, upgrade sound system)

2a. In the Big 12-2, we remain the only school with a Texas HS style open end zone stadium. From an outsiders viewpoint, this looks JV and pegs ISU as second class. (How do you think a recruit sees this?)

3. Find our niche style of players, understand that we can't out recruit anyone south of Kansas save Baylor, and excute our niche flawlessly as a program/team.

3a. Exp. to follow Iowa, Cincy, KU w/ Mangino, Oregon St.

[JUKEBOX]

What do "outsiders" think of ISU Football, as in fans outside the midwest? I'll answer your question with another question. What do you know or think of Mississippi State, Washington State, etc.? We've been conditioned to believe they're non-competitive members of power conferences, who can't compete because they're the #2 schools in their respective states and located in "back-water" cities. They periodically "flash" (ie - Ryan Leaf) but never seem to sustain success in the key programs. That's what outsiders think of ISU...

Wasn't WSU really good in the early 2000's?

[CykoAGR]

Four winning seasons out of 12. One, 1 win season, Two, 2 wins seasons, Two, 3 win seasons. Two failed Big 12 North titles. A 56-85 all time record. This is what the fan base was sick of.

Think that you are missing my point. From 2000-2006 ISU had a winning season 5 out of 7 years. Granted one of the losing seasons was a 2 win season and the other was a 4 win season. What I'm saying is that Mac took us to heights that we had not seen for years if ever. This unmatched success in the final 7 years of his tenure was still not much better than mediocre save for the 9-3 year with Sage and the Insight bowl win.

I was on the boat to get rid of Mac, I wanted more than mediocre. I wanted to win the North and have a chance to play in the tittle game and beat the winner of the South.

All I'm trying to say is that ISU fans much like any other fanbase will settle for mediocre when they are coming from disaster (see 2009 season). Tell me how you will feel in three years if we continue to barely sneak into lower tier bowls. I know that I for one want and expect more. Mark my words if CPR and his staff win a max of 6-7 games a year for three years then ISU fans will be calling for his job.

[GoShow97]

Think that you are missing my point. From 2000-2006 ISU had a winning season 5 out of 7 years. Granted one of the losing seasons was a 2 win season and the other was a 4 win season. What I'm saying is that Mac took us to heights that we had not seen for years if ever. This unmatched success in the final 7 years of his tenure was still not much better than mediocre save for the 9-3 year with Sage and the Insight bowl win.

I was on the boat to get rid of Mac, I wanted more than mediocre. I wanted to win the North and have a chance to play in the tittle game and beat the winner of the South.

All I'm trying to say is that ISU fans much like any other fanbase will settle for mediocre when they are coming from disaster (see 2009 season). Tell me how you will feel in three years if we continue to barely sneak into lower tier bowls. I know that I for one want and expect more. Mark my words if CPR and his staff win a max of 6-7 games a year for three years then ISU fans will be calling for his job.

2002 was not a winning season. If the DMac era truly consisted of constant 7 win seasons that you refered to in your prior post, we would not be having this discussion.

If CPR wins 6-7 games in each of the next three seasons some fans probably will call for his job while the overwhelmingly vast majority will want ISU to give him a raise with a contract extention.

[CykoAGR]

2002 was not a winning season. If the DMac era truly consisted of constant 7 win seasons that you refered to in your prior post, we would not be having this discussion.

If CPR wins 6-7 games in each of the next three seasons some fans probably will call for his job while the overwhelmingly vast majority will want ISU to give him a raise with a contract extention.

I stand corrected on the winning season in 2002, you are right we ended up .500. As far as the CONSTANT 7 win seasons, in the words of SportstalkMatt "If you are going to quote me quote me right". I never said that we constantly won 7 games. I said that over the last 7 YEARS of the DMac era we had winning seasons 5 out of 7 years in which you corrected me and I admitted to being wrong (see above) we were in fact .500 or better in 5 of 7 years.

As for the contract extension for CPR, I said if he wins a MAX of 6-7 games a year for 3 yrs people will start to grumble and some will call for his job. If he has a few Chizick like seasons then I would venture to guess that there will be no extension and less than your "overwhelming majority" will be happy with our situation.

[cloneu]

Wasn't WSU really good in the early 2000's?

They had three 10 win seasons followed by four 4 to 6 win seasons. Then fell off the earth the last two years. The funny thing about WSU is that they had a better record than Washington every year from 2001-2008, but most people would think that Washington has been better over the last decade. Also they didn't get bad because Washington became a power again as one would expect, they just both got really bad.

[weR138]

They had three 10 win seasons followed by four 4 to 6 win seasons. Then fell off the earth the last two years. The funny thing about WSU is that they had a better record than Washington every year from 2001-2008, but most people would think that Washington has been better over the last decade. Also they didn't get bad because Washington became a power again as one would expect, they just both got really bad.

Yeah, a couple years ago UDub and Wazzou played to see who would go winless. That was an epic Apple Cup.

[cyclones500]

I agree with the need for an image-boost. It's a matter of degree. ISU was between marginal and horrible for most of the '80s and '90s. The past decade was, overall, slightly better (and the best years were more enjoyable as a fan than anything since the Earle Bruce era).

What we need is to take the next step up the ladder. We aren't going to reach consistent BCS bowl level overnight. What we need to do is get to the level where being in the BCS bowl discussion would be the next step.

To do that, the following needs to happen with regularity (the records and bowl bids would take care of themselves):
1. Do not lose to teams we should beat
2. Defeat ranked teams
3. Beat similar-level conference teams on the road
4. Something I call the "competitive hump." Example: it's midway through a fairly tight conference season and ISU is tied for fifth. Finish in third or fourth, not seventh or eighth.

I didn't attach specific schools to Nos. 1-3, because a lot of variation is possible. For example, if UT is No. 1 and headed for the BCS title game, and we go into Austin at 3-4, I expect to take my lumps. If we play OU at home when they're ranked 12th and we're knocking on the door of the top 25, we need to win that game.

And so on.

[iccyfan]

The funny thing about WSU is that they had a better record than Washington every year from 2001-2008, but most people would think that Washington has been better over the last decade.

Are WSU and Mississippi State decent comparison schools for ISU in the "outsider's view" debate? People didn't notice when WSU was good and they failed to maintain it; now few people even remember. I really don't know what ISU can do to distinguish themselves from EIU, who has had success in the '50's, 80's and 00's. Whatever the answer is, it's not gonna happen overnight...

[CykoAGR]

Are WSU and Mississippi State decent comparison schools for ISU in the "outsider's view" debate? People didn't notice when WSU was good and they failed to maintain it; now few people even remember. I really don't know what ISU can do to distinguish themselves from EIU, who has had success in the '50's, 80's and 00's. Whatever the answer is, it's not gonna happen overnight...

I agree changing the reputation of ISU will not happen quickly. Consistently winning 6-7 games MINIMUM a year with multiple 8-10 win seasons spread in there and win some bowl games when more than just ISU and the other teams fans are watching like the ones in Jan.

[Erik4Cy]

Just competing and staying in games is no longer good enough. I want 4 wins to be the worst case scenario year in the next decade with expectations around 7 wins, best case around 10 wins per season.