THIS ONE IS ON FRED!!!

**BigBake** · 01-09-2013, 09:25 PM

Originally Posted by CyArkie

A good team effort and both the team and coaching need to improve.

Coaching is one of the main reasons we even sent this game in to OT at KU.

**DistrictCyclone** · 01-09-2013, 09:27 PM

Originally Posted by Dryburn

We need Johnny to call Dicky V again.........just tweeted by Dicky:

Dick Vitale‏@DickieV Iowa st like Colorado lost to KU & Arizona because they refused to foul & allowed a 3 to send games to OT & eventually got a big L. #FOUL

At least that's better than his tweet after the Iowa game:

Dick Vitale‏@DickieV Iowa st lost because they're not as awesome as Dook and UNC #ACCBONER

**clonedude** · 01-09-2013, 09:27 PM

Originally Posted by cyhawkdmb

Whats the difference between a l and L.

Vitale is correct. He has ALWAYS said you should foul in those situations. I only wish we had.

**CyArob** · 01-09-2013, 09:28 PM

Originally Posted by cyhawkdmb

Whats the difference between a l and L.

a l hurts your tourney chances, and a L does not.

**CyArkie** · 01-09-2013, 09:29 PM

We should have won this one, not only did we not foul when we should have, but more disturbing for myself is the coach not calling a timely time out until 2 minutes left in overtime and watching for three minutes his team steadily go down 10 points. Coaches are supposed to coach, calm them down, make a play, do something other than watch.

I believe the team and Fred will and do need to improve.

**BigBake** · 01-09-2013, 09:29 PM

Originally Posted by clonedude

Vitale is correct. He has ALWAYS said you should foul in those situations. I only wish we had.

Too bad Self disagreed with him.

**tigershoops31** · 01-09-2013, 09:29 PM

Originally Posted by clonedude

Vitale is correct. He has ALWAYS said you should foul in those situations. I only wish we had.

Yeah I don't get why he isn't still coaching anywhere...his Detroit teams gained national acclaim for their late game fouling prowess. If Vitale, Calipari, and Mario Chalmers are our 3 "experts" endorsing the foul call there I don't understand why everybody doesn't do it!!!

**kingcy** · 01-09-2013, 09:30 PM

This staff also put together one hell of a gameplan to put ISU in that situation.

There are also things that can go wrong when you put guys at the line with the clock stopped.

**MIClone** · 01-09-2013, 09:31 PM

Fred was definitely not out-coached tonight. KU executed when they had to, we made a few too many mistakes (e.g., the front end of 1-1), and they got a nice run of calls from the zebras at crunch time. None of the "mistakes" people are calling out Fred for are actual mistakes. They are just legitimate differences in approach. For instance, fouling to avoid the 3 point shot is not a universal given. There is a lot of danger in stopping the clock on purpose like that down the stretch and a smart player will put up a shot while he's getting fouled to get 3 free throws. If that doesn't work, they can make the first and miss the second and get a putback. Either approach has risks. People need to settle down on the excessive critique of Fred, especially given the game he coached tonight!

**cyclonewino** · 01-09-2013, 09:32 PM

Yea, I'm certain if ISU fouled the refs would have given us every opportunity to score again. I like the foul at the end of a game, but coaches hate to put the game in the hands of the refs, that and give them points. (FT's)

**Wesley** · 01-09-2013, 09:32 PM

Originally Posted by iacyguy

ohh cyclonefanatic... how smart your are. Some saying we will win the big 12. some saying we should fire fred hoiberg. atleast we can all agree on one thing... YOGA PANTS

No. Too disappointed. Yoga pants not till tomorrow.

**Nihawk** · 01-09-2013, 09:32 PM

Originally Posted by SC Cy

I've never seen one instance where the team up three and fouls loses.

Me either. I was yelling at TV the whole time to foul. Especially with under 4 seconds to play.

**clonedude** · 01-09-2013, 09:32 PM

Originally Posted by CyArkie

We should have won this one, not only did we not foul when we should have, but more disturbing for myself is the coach not calling a timely time out until 2 minutes left in overtime and watching for three minutes his team steadily go down 10 points. Coaches are supposed to coach, calm them down, make a play, do something other than watch.

I believe the team and Fred will and do need to improve.

I do agree with that. I'm not sure why Fred just let KU run out to a 10+ pt lead in OT without calling a timeout? I guess he had given up at that point too? He, along with the players, knew it was over when they didn't foul, and saw that 3 pt shot banked in.

I also wish Fred would have stood up for his guys more tonight. I only saw him question one bad call by the refs. You have to support your guys more than that IMO. There were some bad calls tonight, but Fred seemed to just take it. So the bad calls kept on coming.

**BigBake** · 01-09-2013, 09:33 PM

Originally Posted by MIClone

Fred was definitely not out-coached tonight. KU executed when they had to, we made a few too many mistakes (e.g., the front end of 1-1), and they got a nice run of calls from the zebras at crunch time. None of the "mistakes" people are calling out Fred for are actual mistakes. They are just legitimate differences in approach. For instance, fouling to avoid the 3 point shot is not a universal given. There is a lot of danger in stopping the clock on purpose like that down the stretch and a smart player will put up a shot while he's getting fouled to get 3 free throws. If that doesn't work, they can make the first and miss the second and get a putback. Either approach has risks. People need to settle down on the excessive critique of Fred, especially given the game he coached tonight!

That's where I'm at, you stop the clock and give them 6 - 7 secs to do something. Worse case they make 2, steal the ball back and win in regulation.

**SC Cy** · 01-09-2013, 09:34 PM

I'm still waiting for one moment when fouling backfired. And by the way, not one person on here is saying Coach Hoiberg was out-coached. What I'm saying is he coached one hell of a game, I just disagree with his philosophy at the end of three-point games. That doesn't mean people that disagree are stupid or don't watch basketball. Easy folks.