Hoiberg vs. Orr

**CurvedAir** · 02-11-2013, 12:54 PM

How similar are these two? Both have sincere love and passion for Iowa State. Wide open offenses with emphasis on guards and 3pt's. Love to get out and run. Dominant at home. Able to beat ranked teams at Hilton. Struggle on the road. Strength clearly offense vs. defense. Funny and witty. About the only difference is the demeanor on the sidelines. Johnny was always on the refs and obviously more animated.

Of all the great coaches Fred played for, it seems like Johnny may be his closest blueprint. Hopefully the defensive side will improve vs. Orr's teams.

**awd4cy** · 02-11-2013, 12:57 PM

I wasn't alive through almost all of the Orr years but it sounded like Hoiberg's teams so far are much much better on the road than Orr's.

**mjhavlo76** · 02-11-2013, 01:00 PM

I think Hoiberg will eventually be at the coaching level of Orr, but is not there yet. Orr is a coaching legend!

**CurvedAir** · 02-11-2013, 01:05 PM

Originally Posted by awd4cy

I wasn't alive through almost all of the Orr years but it sounded like Hoiberg's teams so far are much much better on the road than Orr's.

By my count, Fred is 8-25 on the road (including win against UMKC). I don't have Johnny's road record, but I'd be surprised if he was much worse than a .242 clip. Maybe I'm wrong. Either way, we have to improve away from Hilton.

**Go2Guy** · 02-11-2013, 01:07 PM

It's too early for a career comparison, but consider a few things:

+ Fred started his ISU career with Johnny, but finished with Floyd and mentions him frequently as one of his mentors. Floyd was an excellent defensive coach and won on the road.
+ Johnny barely had a winning career record; road losses certainly contributed.
+ Johnny had some notorious road losses - like a Texas Tech loss, every year.

**Cyclonepride** · 02-11-2013, 01:09 PM

Even some of Johnny's good teams would get smoked on the road by questionable teams. Fred has been more competitive on the road, even if the win/loss percentage doesn't bear that out just yet.

**Clones85'** · 02-11-2013, 01:11 PM

Hoiberg has the team competitive in road games. Orr's teams use to get beat by 30

**Clones85'** · 02-11-2013, 01:14 PM

Orr won 52% of his games
Hoiberg is at 62%

**intrepid27** · 02-11-2013, 01:15 PM

A large part of the reason that Hilton enjoys a strong home court advantage from a statistical standpoint is that Orr's teams were not good on the road.
It was not uncommon for him to beat a team by 20 at home and lose by 15 to the same team 2 weeks later on the road.

Fred is MUCH earlier in his career. He is not at Johnny's level yet but someday will pass it IMO.

**2ndCyCE** · 02-11-2013, 01:16 PM

Originally Posted by Clones85'

Hoiberg has the team competitive in road games. Orr's teams use to get beat by 30

Yeah, I can remember them winning out at home against great teams like Okie State, Kansas, Mizzou, and losing the entire slate of road games, even to crappy Nebraska and Colorado teams.

**DistrictCyclone** · 02-11-2013, 01:19 PM

Originally Posted by Go2Guy

It's too early for a career comparison, but consider a few things:

+ Fred started his ISU career with Johnny, but finished with Floyd and mentions him frequently as one of his mentors. Floyd was an excellent defensive coach and won on the road.
+ Johnny barely had a winning career record; road losses certainly contributed.
+ Johnny had some notorious road losses - like a Texas Tech loss, every year.

Floyd was also Fred's coach while both were with the Chicago Bulls.

**CurvedAir** · 02-11-2013, 01:27 PM

Originally Posted by Clones85'

Orr won 52% of his games
Hoiberg is at 62%

I show Orr at .573 overall. He was .629 prior to Iowa State. That's also over a 30 year career. You could also argue that the commitment and resources that Fred has are night and day compared to Johnny.

**CurvedAir** · 02-11-2013, 01:36 PM

Originally Posted by 2ndCyCE

Yeah, I can remember them winning out at home against great teams like Okie State, Kansas, Mizzou, and losing the entire slate of road games, even to crappy Nebraska and Colorado teams.

In the end, a loss is a loss. It's nice to be in these games, but we obviously have to do better than losing 27 out of 35 road games. I think .500 should be a realistic goal for a team that's consistently in the top 3-4 in the B12.

**BringBackJohnny** · 02-11-2013, 02:32 PM

I really enjoyed Floyd as a coach. Did a great job of keeping the program moving forward. Can't blame him for taking the Chicago job.

I think it is apparent that Fred really enjoyed the pace of the Johnny era offence. Fans and players want to see/get points. It may be an ok offense but it will help in the recruiting games and putting butts in seats.

**cjclone** · 02-11-2013, 02:49 PM

Fred has better players overall to work with than Johnny did. Johnny's team were usually not very deep and definitely undersized overall for his first several years. I was there. Johnny brought excitement to the game and passion. he and Fred are so different outwardly, Johnny would make his entrance and fire up the crowd, while Fred is much more laid back that way. Fred has a very structured offense, less zone played now with the three point shot compared to when Johnny started, etc. hard to compare in many ways.