Rate the centers

**J-Diggy** · 02-17-2009, 11:40 AM

I think Cato is getting a little too much love. He had a better pro career than many on the list, but as a college player both Big Vic and Loren Meyer were better (IMO).

Cato was a game changer on D, but as someone pointed out was also prone to foul trouble. And his offense was pretty much dunk or nothing, with a few flashes of actual post moves thrown in.

I remember Johnny Orr saying after Big Vic's last game agains Missouri how he felt so bad for the kid because the other teams fouled him everytime and it never got called because he was so big.

Norm Stewart responded by saying, "If they didn't let him travel every time he got the ball we wouldn't have to keep fouling him."

Vic, even at 305 pounds, was a helluva basketball player.

**bobh33** · 02-17-2009, 12:00 PM

Hester. Enough said.

**Aclone** · 02-17-2009, 12:03 PM

You listed a bunch of guys who weren't centers.

1. Kelvin Cato
The guy was a defensive enforcer, and owned the paint.
2. Loren Meyer
He might have been a head case, but when he wanted to, he could do whatever he wanted.
3. Victor Alexander
I'm not sure that I'd call him lazy, because I saw him working a lot, at State Gym or running laps at Lied--but always at the slowest pace possible. I never understood why he didn't "get" that. Still, he had soft hands and a great touch wherever he got the ball.
4. Dean Uthoff
Rebound city, the guy owned the boards.
5. Jared Homan
Matured into good effort as an upperclassman.
6. Ron Fallenschek
Hey, it's not a long list of true centers.
7. Justin Hamilton
Yes, he already makes the list--and can move up quite a few notches really quickly next season.

Brackins, Fizer, Vroman, Hubalek, etc, are not centers. For that matter, Sam Hill, David Moss and Lafester Rhodes at times played center, but weren't, either.

**nhclone** · 02-17-2009, 01:13 PM

I'm pretty young so I haven't seen some of the older guys play much except on old videos someone recorded or on the mediacom flashbacks but this is how I would rate them:

Center:

1) Cato-mostly based on his D. Probably the best post defender ever to play at ISU.
2) Alexander- Watched a replay of a couple of his games, could not believe he was as athletic as he was. Did not look the part but was a force inside at times.
3) Homan- the guy worked his butt off his senior year
4)Meyer- Only seen him play once but he appeared to be able to take over a game if he wanted

PF:
1)Fizer
2) Brackins
These 2 could almost be 1a and 1b. I think Brackins will be better by the time he leaves if he returns next season.
3)Hubalek- Once he settled in as a post player he was very good
4)Vroman-Very versatile player that fit in well with the up tempo offense we were running at the time

**Cyclones01** · 02-17-2009, 01:17 PM

Originally Posted by johnsonjj

I would probably place Brackins at the top. I'm too young to have seen Cato or Meyers play, and I barely remember seeing Fizer play because I was in 5th grade during the 2000 season. And is Alexander referring to Chris Alexander? The guy who only played in like 20 games as a Cyclone? Because I would have to rank him near the bottom.

1. Brackins (not really a center)
2. Fizer (not really a center)
3. Cato (never saw him play much, but I've seen clips, and he was good)
4. Homan
5. Hubalek
6. Shirley
7. Meyers (never saw him play)
8. Alexander (wasn't that good)[/quote]

What? Are you kidding me? He was the greatest offensive center I have seen at ISU (I didn't see those before the 80's). He was 1st string all conference twice if memory serves me correctly, and a first round draft choice (17th overall) in the NBA. He had the best hands of any big man I have seen. He could stroke the 15-18 foot J, and was able to get by with more hooks with his elbow on spin moves of any big man I have seen. Vic was the real deal. We had a good starting 5 with him, but not much depth. Tough to know how good of defender he might have been, as we couldn't afford for him to get into foul trouble.

Do some people just not read? It's been said 2 or 3 times now that I had the wrong Alexander.

**cyclonenum1** · 02-17-2009, 01:36 PM

Originally Posted by Knownothing

Cato made the offensive of the other team change there whole mindset. That is how imposing of a block Machine he actually was. It took Homan 4 years to break Cato's 1 and a half year block record. Remember Cato was suspended the first semester of both years he played at ISU. So basically he was only around for a little over 1 year and he made that big of a difference.

More important than that...his presence allowed us to play a much more aggressive and gambling defense on the perimeter...if the guys on the perimeter got beat, Cato was there to tend the goal.

**johnsonjj** · 02-17-2009, 02:08 PM

[quote=Cyclones01;903823]

Originally Posted by johnsonjj

Do some people just not read? It's been said 2 or 3 times now that I had the wrong Alexander.

Sorry about that. I was reading through the thread and posted that response before I saw the 2 or 3 mentions that it was the wrong Alexander. Can't you give me a few props for good detailed smack back?

**Aclone** · 02-17-2009, 02:09 PM

Originally Posted by cyclonenum1

More important than that...his presence allowed us to play a much more aggressive and gambling defense on the perimeter...if the guys on the perimeter got beat, Cato was there to tend the goal.

Exactly. +!.

**johnsonjj** · 02-17-2009, 02:13 PM

Originally Posted by cyclonenum1

More important than that...his presence allowed us to play a much more aggressive and gambling defense on the perimeter...if the guys on the perimeter got beat, Cato was there to tend the goal.

I agree, and think I said the same on the previous page

**Cloned4Life** · 02-17-2009, 02:33 PM

Originally Posted by khaal53

Cato played in 27 games his Jr year (33 total games for ISU) and 28 games his Sr. year (31 total games for ISU). Neither of those seem to line up quite right with missing the whole first semester. For instance, in 95-96 the 7th game of the season was on Dec. 16th.

I swear he missed the 1st semester his junior season. December 16th would be right after 1st semester finals so it makes sense he couldn't play until then.

I remember how excited I was to watch him play his first game. He didn't do much offensively but I think he had like 16 boards or something that first time out. What a player...

Speaking of suspensions, wasn't Mr. Pratt suspended the first semester of his senior season?

**khaal53** · 02-17-2009, 02:36 PM

Originally Posted by Cloned4Life

I swear he missed the 1st semester his junior season. December 16th would be right after 1st semester finals so it makes sense he couldn't play until then.

I remember how excited I was to watch him play his first game. He didn't do much offensively but I think he had like 16 boards or something that first time out. What a player...

Speaking of suspensions, wasn't Mr. Pratt suspended the first semester of his senior season?

Probably a good chance, he only played in 24 of the games.

**CarolinaCy** · 02-17-2009, 02:40 PM

Originally Posted by Aclone

1. Kelvin Cato
The guy was a defensive enforcer, and owned the paint.
2. Loren Meyer
He might have been a head case, but when he wanted to, he could do whatever he wanted.
3. Victor Alexander
I'm not sure that I'd call him lazy, because I saw him working a lot, at State Gym or running laps at Lied--but always at the slowest pace possible. I never understood why he didn't "get" that. Still, he had soft hands and a great touch wherever he got the ball.

I'd say out of those 3 that Meyer should have been the best one, by far. He seemed to be somewhat lazy though, as he was an athletic freak for a big man.

He came to a b-ball camp at my high school one year and put on quite a show at the end of the camp. My jaw hit the floor when I saw him get a running start from half court, take off with his heel on the free throw line and throw it down. I don't care if he was 6'-11", that's impressive.

EDIT: to those that are rating Homan ahead of Meyer, that's nuts.

**johnsonjj** · 02-17-2009, 02:43 PM

Originally Posted by CarolinaCy

I'd say out of those 3 that Meyer should have been the best one, by far. He seemed to be somewhat lazy though, as he was an athletic freak for a big man.

He came to a b-ball camp at my high school one year and put on quite a show at the end of the camp. My jaw hit the floor when I saw him get a running start from half court, take off with his heel on the free throw line and throw it down. I don't care if he was 6'-11", that's impressive.

EDIT: to those that are rating Homan ahead of Meyer, that's nuts.

Meyer thought he was a PG trapped in a big guy's body! He loved the opportunity to put the ball on the floor. I remember his freshmen year seeing him do a nice spin move in the lane off the dribble impressed the heck outta me.

**CarolinaCy** · 02-17-2009, 02:47 PM

Originally Posted by Cloned4Life

I swear he missed the 1st semester his junior season. December 16th would be right after 1st semester finals so it makes sense he couldn't play until then.

I remember how excited I was to watch him play his first game. He didn't do much offensively but I think he had like 16 boards or something that first time out. What a player...

Speaking of suspensions, wasn't Mr. Pratt suspended the first semester of his senior season?

I think you're right about Cato. His Jr year at ISU was my freshman year and I seem to remember something about him not being able to play until after finals. Don't really remember the details though.

**johnsonjj** · 02-17-2009, 02:55 PM

Originally Posted by CarolinaCy

I'd say out of those 3 that Meyer should have been the best one, by far. He seemed to be somewhat lazy though, as he was an athletic freak for a big man.

He came to a b-ball camp at my high school one year and put on quite a show at the end of the camp. My jaw hit the floor when I saw him get a running start from half court, take off with his heel on the free throw line and throw it down. I don't care if he was 6'-11", that's impressive.

EDIT: to those that are rating Homan ahead of Meyer, that's nuts.

Big Vic has better stats than Meyer, but hard to compare as they had quite a bit different supporting casts.