Miller and Deace!

[CycloneErik]

Miller's logic is good logic, but it's also flawed.

Yes, KF has taken the Hawks to places they've never been before.
Yes, his overall winning percentage is great.
Yes, Iowa is a hard place to have success.
Yes, KF has done more with less than almost any other coach in the country.
Yes, just two seasons ago, they won the Orange Bowl.

Those are all good, valid points. The problem is, that this is College Sports, and today's landscape sticks very closely to the mantra of "What have you done for me lately?" Successful coaches are run out of town all the time after just a few poor seasons. Why should Kirk be different?

And Kirk is a victim of his own success. 3 consecutive top 10 finishes will do that. He set the bar very, very high and was rewarded for it. Those three seasons taught the fan base that the hardships that faced Iowa can be overcome and done with consistency. After that lesson had been taught, the old "Poor little Iowa" schtick doesn't play as well, anymore. Now he, and his apologists, are trying to go back and claim that Iowa is not capable of the expectations that he set, himself.

The fans have every right to be upset. They have every right to ask for change.

That said, should he be fired? Of course not. Firing KF would be a terrible idea. The chances of them landing another coach who could get them to the places that KF has taken them is slim to none.

For argument's sake, can't a person logically argue that leaders/coaches typically have a limited time threshold at each stop in which they're effective? Hayden Fry found that (albeit at the end of his career). Isn't it actually possible that Kirk went past his window of effectiveness and is reaching a time where he's essentially outstayed his ability to succeed where he is?

[kingcy]

Listened to 5 mins when I figured out it was going to be a Miller whine fest turned it off.

[Mr Janny]

For argument's sake, can't a person logically argue that leaders/coaches typically have a limited time threshold at each stop in which they're effective? Hayden Fry found that (albeit at the end of his career). Isn't it actually possible that Kirk went past his window of effectiveness and is reaching a time where he's essentially outstayed his ability to succeed where he is?

Sure it is. Deace actually made a good point about this. He said, in so many words, that the loss to Minnesota, last year, was shocking. The loss this year, is scarier, because it might be indicative of a systemic problem. Let's say Iowa goes 7-5 again this year with a 4-4 conference record again, and maybe they do the same, next year, or maybe even go 6-6, and drop another 1-2 games that they shouldn't. It will be hard for even the staunchest KF homer to ignore the stink on the program, at that point, and it will be even more difficult to make the argument that the game has not passed Kirk by.

[CycloneErik]

Sure it is. Deace actually made a good point about this. He said, in so many words, that the loss to Minnesota, last year, was shocking. The loss this year, is scarier, because it might be indicative of a systemic problem. Let's say Iowa goes 7-5 again this year with a 4-4 conference record again, and maybe they do the same, next year, or maybe even go 6-6, and drop another 1-2 games that they shouldn't. It will be hard for even the staunchest KF homer to ignore the stink on the program, at that point, and it will be even more difficult to make the argument that the game has not passed Kirk by.

That last line seems like a real key. The college game is really built for aggressive styles right now, and Kirk obviously isn't that.

The man does have to decide at some point whether he's willing to make that change.

[kingcy]

Sure it is. Deace actually made a good point about this. He said, in so many words, that the loss to Minnesota, last year, was shocking. The loss this year, is scarier, because it might be indicative of a systemic problem. Let's say Iowa goes 7-5 again this year with a 4-4 conference record again, and maybe they do the same, next year, or maybe even go 6-6, and drop another 1-2 games that they shouldn't. It will be hard for even the staunchest KF homer to ignore the stink on the program, at that point, and it will be even more difficult to make the argument that the game has not passed Kirk by.

Iowa fans are to stupid to realize this. Iowa seldem pulls an upset, they go .500 vs teams on the same level they are on and lose to atleast one team a year worse than they are. Now their ups are higher than ISUs ups, and their downs are not as bad as ISU's downs. The reason they dont get blew out is the same reason they dont blow other teams out. Oh KF treats the meida like his little puppet, but the media is full of supporters they dont care.

[kingcy]

The man does have to decide at some point whether he's willing to make that change.

I think that decision has been made for better or worse for Iowa fans. Live by what KF does and die by it. KF runs the athletic dept and Barta he doenst have to change or make changes.

[Rural]

Surely we don't need yet another reminder of how Vega sets its lines do we?

Great, the old saw, "equal action on both sides".
That never was and is not now true.

[AlleyAddict]

Iowa fans are to stupid to realize this. Iowa seldem pulls an upset, they go .500 vs teams on the same level they are on and lose to atleast one team a year worse than they are. Now their ups are higher than ISUs ups, and their downs are not as bad as ISU's downs. The reason they dont get blew out is the same reason they dont blow other teams out. Oh KF treats the meida like his little puppet, but the media is full of supporters they dont care.

Bolded for irony.

But seriously, this post doesn't have a lot of truth to it. They've had their share of upsets, just not lately.

[Clark]

Sure it is. Deace actually made a good point about this. He said, in so many words, that the loss to Minnesota, last year, was shocking. The loss this year, is scarier, because it might be indicative of a systemic problem. Let's say Iowa goes 7-5 again this year with a 4-4 conference record again, and maybe they do the same, next year, or maybe even go 6-6, and drop another 1-2 games that they shouldn't. It will be hard for even the staunchest KF homer to ignore the stink on the program, at that point, and it will be even more difficult to make the argument that the game has not passed Kirk by.

Except that next years team will be younger than this years team. Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't advise him to lose to Minnesota again next year but realistic Iowa fans aren't going to expect more than 7-8 wins next year.

Two years from now though? He loses a bunch of games then and he's in trouble.

I agree with Deace that this team needs an infusion of new coaching if for no other reason than to bring in some new ideas and a fresh perspective.

[weR138]

Except that next years team will be younger than this years team. Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't advise him to lose to Minnesota again next year but realistic Iowa fans aren't going to expect more than 7-8 wins next year.

Two years from now though? He loses a bunch of games then and he's in trouble.

I agree with Deace that this team needs an infusion of new coaching if for no other reason than to bring in some new ideas and a fresh perspective.

Do you think Mike Stoops will be the DC temporarily or will they get someone more permanent? Who's on the DC / OC wish list?

[isuno1fan]

I keep telling you nimrods that Murph and Andy are the only fair on air "team" in the DSM market. 2-4 KXNO is worth your time. The rest...not so much.

[Clark]

Do you think Mike Stoops will be the DC temporarily or will they get someone more permanent? Who's on the DC / OC wish list?

The OC is going to be KOK. I don't think there is any question about that. Honestly, his play calling hasn't been as bad as some make it out to be.

I do think this will be Norm's last year. It just hasn't been the same with him being up in the booth. He seems more like a figurehead than a coach. I do think Mike Stoops will be the permanent DC starting next year. I know Miller has said that his personality wouldn't mesh with Ferentz's that well but I think that's exactly what Ferentz needs.

If not Stoops, I would guess they'll promote from within and hire some new position coaches. Either way I think this is Norm's last year as a full time coach at Iowa.

One thing i'd be shocked at is the ST coach returning.

[weR138]

The OC is going to be KOK. I don't think there is any question about that. Honestly, his play calling hasn't been as bad as some make it out to be.

I do think this will be Norm's last year. It just hasn't been the same with him being up in the booth. He seems more like a figurehead than a coach. I do think Mike Stoops will be the permanent DC starting next year. I know Miller has said that his personality wouldn't mesh with Ferentz's that well but I think that's exactly what Ferentz needs.

If not Stoops, I would guess they'll promote from within and hire some new position coaches. Either way I think this is Norm's last year as a full time coach at Iowa.

One thing i'd be shocked at is the ST coach returning.

Define permanent; do you think Stoops wants another HC job and if so how long will he stay in IC?

The "personality" thing is BS. Stoops knows the score at Iowa. King Kirk presides. Stoops will do as directed.

[CykoAGR]

Bit off topic but I missed yesterdays show and would like to listen prior to tuning in today to hear the ISU talk.

I found some podcasts from last week on Itunes and Deace's website but nothing from yesterday. Is there anywhere that I can find yesterdays podcast?

[Cyhart]

Bit off topic but I missed yesterdays show and would like to listen prior to tuning in today to hear the ISU talk.

I found some podcasts from last week on Itunes and Deace's website but nothing from yesterday. Is there anywhere that I can find yesterdays podcast?

Doesnt look like they have it up yet, but normally you'd find it here.
October | 2011 | Miller and Deace