Tiger may need new knee

**Rural** · 06-20-2011, 06:24 PM

Originally Posted by yaman3

It was more violent but it's still there which would be fine if his knee hadn't been through 4 operations. You don't need to put that much torque on that knee.

I've heard that a retirement announcement is coming and that Tiger is OK with getting out.

**ThatllDoCy** · 06-20-2011, 07:10 PM

I would be shocked if Tiger retired. Cannot see that happening.

Tiger was a great putter. He has always been erratic off of the tee, but his short game was absolutely beautiful. If he wants more majors that is where he will need to focus.

His regular swing will be fine once he is healthy and he can find a Coach willing to work with him. As I understand it the bridges to Butch and Hank are burned, but those are rumors that I hear, I have no proof of it.

Tiger inspired Rory's performance and the entire generation of golfers that are coming of age. His impact is the way they play. They took the Tiger model and have improved upon it by being more consistent. Watching Rory was amazing. He made it look easy. Tiger and Phil always make it look tough by hitting off of other fairways etc.

Tiger is a winner and he will figure it out. Too much talent and love of the game to give up.

**Cyclonestate78** · 06-21-2011, 11:17 AM

Originally Posted by CyCrazy

Maybe but there are plenty of damn good players on tour now younger than him, just as talented. His edge is gone.

Absolutely agree here. The amount of young talent on tour and in the amateur ranks right now is ridiculous. There were more amateurs in the US Open then I can ever remember seeing. 16 year old kids are now good enough to qualify and play in the US Open. That is amazing. Jordan Spieth from Dallas has been in contention 2 years in a row at the Byron Nelson and he just graduated high school. Phil Mickelson got beat by 7 shots by a sophomore at UCLA in the US Open. These young guys are really good.

You can thank Tiger Woods for all of this. These kids were growing up when Tiger was dominating the sport. He made playing golf cool and in the same process also gave these young kids a blueprint for golfing success. They work out more, practice more, practice more effectively, and start doing it at a much younger age then what some of the 30 something guys on Tour started doing it to try and catch up to Tiger.

Then you look at some of these developmental tours like the Gateway Tour, Hooters Tour, Nationwide Tour, etc... and you see a ton of talented young players who are in the process of learning how to win and when they do look out. Just in recent years the Gateway Tour has been represented on the PGA Tour by Bubba Watson, JB Holmes, Sean O'Hair, Spencer Levin, Brendan Steele, Tommy Gainey, Charlie Hoffman, Robert Garrigus, Brandt Snedeker, Gary Woodland, Steve Marino, Jeff Overton and Martin Laird. Several of these guys have already won on the PGA Tour and some have multiple wins.

Tiger Woods for the first time is facing a level of competition that is not only younger then him but in short order will be better then him in all areas of the game. Tiger's ship has sailed.

**cy4prez7** · 06-21-2011, 11:24 AM

Tiger won 14 majors in 12 years...even if he's done (I don't think he is) that's still one of the best careers EVER!

**Senolcyc** · 06-21-2011, 11:26 AM

Of Tiger's body parts to be worn out, I wouldn't have guessed knee.

**Cyclonestate78** · 06-21-2011, 11:37 AM

Originally Posted by cy4prez7

Tiger won 14 majors in 12 years...even if he's done (I don't think he is) that's still one of the best careers EVER!

No doubt about that. The biggest key to Tiger's success was that he outworked everyone on tour. He practiced more, worked out more, etc.... and it showed up on the golf course. He can't say that anymore. He created a legion of younger golfers who are following his example. In essence... Tiger has created more competition for himself. I hope he makes it back and gets his game going again. If not... there is a whole bunch of young guys on the verge of becoming superstars to take his place. Golf doesn't need Tiger as much today as it did 5 or 6 years ago.

**Tre4ISU** · 06-21-2011, 11:45 AM

Originally Posted by Cyclonestate78

No doubt about that. The biggest key to Tiger's success was that he outworked everyone on tour. He practiced more, worked out more, etc.... and it showed up on the golf course. He can't say that anymore. He created a legion of younger golfers who are following his example. In essence... Tiger has created more competition for himself. I hope he makes it back and gets his game going again. If not... there is a whole bunch of young guys on the verge of becoming superstars to take his place. Golf doesn't need Tiger as much today as it did 5 or 6 years ago.

Meh, I sort of disagree. I can't remember who, but someone on The Golf Channel brought a up a good point. Does Rory have the fire that Tiger had? He is of a different mental makeup. Tiger had these goals and was set on achieving them. I don't see that drive from Rory. IMO, ROry will win somewhere around 8 majors and have a tremendous career but I don't think he will approach Tiger's level. I just don't see the guys out there with the same mental makeup as Tiger. It was a great performance last week but remember, he won by half as many as Tiger did in 2000 and on a course that was 2 strokes easier per day. I also don't think it's fair to Rory to put that expectation on him. There's a difference there as well. Tiger placed those expectations on himself so there was no added pressure by the media and fans doing it. ROry has never placed that pressure on himself, at least not publicly so when everyone expects him to be the next Tiger, the pressure will mount. He will have to handle it.

**Cyclonestate78** · 06-21-2011, 11:54 AM

Originally Posted by yaman3

Meh, I sort of disagree. I can't remember who, but someone on The Golf Channel brought a up a good point. Does Rory have the fire that Tiger had? He is of a different mental makeup. Tiger had these goals and was set on achieving them. I don't see that drive from Rory. IMO, ROry will win somewhere around 8 majors and have a tremendous career but I don't think he will approach Tiger's level. I just don't see the guys out there with the same mental makeup as Tiger. It was a great performance last week but remember, he won by half as many as Tiger did in 2000 and on a course that was 2 strokes easier per day. I also don't think it's fair to Rory to put that expectation on him. There's a difference there as well. Tiger placed those expectations on himself so there was no added pressure by the media and fans doing it. ROry has never placed that pressure on himself, at least not publicly so when everyone expects him to be the next Tiger, the pressure will mount. He will have to handle it.

I think that is a big misconception. Tiger is by far the most vocal golfer as far as his own personal goals and expectations are. Every single golfer shows up every week at every tournament fully expecting to win. If they didn't there wouldn't be any point. Tiger is simply the only one that gets up in front of the media and says I expect to win this tournament. Period. That is part of his hype or legend if you will. Tiger is cocky but he can back it up. Some guys just don't have that ego to carry around with them. They don't need to flaunt it like Tiger did. I think that is where the big difference is. Rory is a nice kid, treats the media with respect, shows his personality, answers questions etc.... Tiger doesn't do any of that. He acts like a dick to the media, shows zero personality, and doesn't want to answer any questions, etc... It is more of a personality difference between Tiger and the rest of the guys on Tour.

**jdoggivjc** · 06-21-2011, 12:08 PM

Originally Posted by ThatllDoCy

I would be shocked if Tiger retired. Cannot see that happening.

Tiger was a great putter. He has always been erratic off of the tee, but his short game was absolutely beautiful. If he wants more majors that is where he will need to focus.

His regular swing will be fine once he is healthy and he can find a Coach willing to work with him. As I understand it the bridges to Butch and Hank are burned, but those are rumors that I hear, I have no proof of it.

Tiger inspired Rory's performance and the entire generation of golfers that are coming of age. His impact is the way they play. They took the Tiger model and have improved upon it by being more consistent. Watching Rory was amazing. He made it look easy. Tiger and Phil always make it look tough by hitting off of other fairways etc.

Tiger is a winner and he will figure it out. Too much talent and love of the game to give up.

There's the key statement right there. Tiger's strength off the tee was always he could hit it a mile; it was never accuracy. He was never one of the better golfers at % of fairways hit. Then again, he never had to be accurate off the tee - his short game and putting were so good that misfired drives that would sink other golfers he would still hit for par or even sneak a birdie out. This led to his biggest strength - intimidation. Tiger was always able to get into his competitions' heads, and they quite literally feared him. If his competition was lucky enough to have a lead going into the final round, it was never safe, and they always had one eye on the scoreboard checking if Tiger was inching his way up it.

The problem is today's newest pro golfers aren't intimidated by Tiger. They all grew up idolizing him and learned the game the way Tiger played it - and they're better than him at it. They have the great short game plus they also hit the fairway.

I don't think Tiger's career is over - not by a long shot. However, his biggest weapon - his ability to straight up intimidate the rest of the field - that is gone forever.

**Tre4ISU** · 06-21-2011, 12:54 PM

Originally Posted by Cyclonestate78

I think that is a big misconception. Tiger is by far the most vocal golfer as far as his own personal goals and expectations are. Every single golfer shows up every week at every tournament fully expecting to win. If they didn't there wouldn't be any point. Tiger is simply the only one that gets up in front of the media and says I expect to win this tournament. Period. That is part of his hype or legend if you will. Tiger is cocky but he can back it up. Some guys just don't have that ego to carry around with them. They don't need to flaunt it like Tiger did. I think that is where the big difference is. Rory is a nice kid, treats the media with respect, shows his personality, answers questions etc.... Tiger doesn't do any of that. He acts like a dick to the media, shows zero personality, and doesn't want to answer any questions, etc... It is more of a personality difference between Tiger and the rest of the guys on Tour.

I don't agree with that. I think there may be 10 golfers out there that think if they play well they will win. Tiger always knew if he played well he would win. There was no doubt. Tiger has stated his goals because he was asked. He didn't just give some generic answer like everyone else does and because of that, he's cocky or arrogant, whatever you want to call it. He was also voted by the players as more liked on tour than someone named Phil Mickelson. The media has done a great job to spin him as the villain, if you will and Phil as the hero. It was easier to do. People also believe it until you actually go watch them at and event. I have watched them both twice during rounds and Phil is no where near what the general public thinks he is. By far the nicest guy was Luke Donald but for the most part, everyone is the same. They are there to work and none of them want to be bothered. Tiger does plenty of kidding around and talking on the course as well, you just never see it.

**JonDMiller** · 06-21-2011, 01:00 PM

He will have to reinvent his game, relying more on a stronger mid-iron game that he has never had to have, due to decreased distance off the tee. Will make going low with regularity a problem, but it will make him more like the rest of the pack.

**PabloDiablo** · 06-21-2011, 01:47 PM

Originally Posted by Gordyo5

A new knee would take him a year or so to be back at full strength, this would be far from his biggest concern of his golf game. Finding and sticking with a swing is going to be his main challenge, although his main challenges of catching Jack just finished 1st and 2nd today, but he isn't done. I have never been a Tiger fan, but the sport is better with him than without.

A new knee would absolutely be his biggest concern. Having a knee replacement takes out your ACL/PCL complex and relies on internal components for rotational stability. Being that the majority of power comes from the ability to rotate through your hip and knees, he would be totally hosed. There are models of knee components being brought out with rotational stabilizers by companies such as Smith & Nephew, but there is no way that he would be able to generate the power needed to stay competitive.

Combine that with the fact that he would again have to create and learn a new swing would lead me to believe that his career as at least a competitive (top 50 or so) pro golfer would be done

**CloneLawman** · 06-21-2011, 01:49 PM

Is he needing a new knee to grab under the table or one to use for himself?

**Tre4ISU** · 06-21-2011, 01:58 PM

Originally Posted by PabloDiablo

A new knee would absolutely be his biggest concern. Having a knee replacement takes out your ACL/PCL complex and relies on internal components for rotational stability. Being that the majority of power comes from the ability to rotate through your hip and knees, he would be totally hosed. There are models of knee components being brought out with rotational stabilizers by companies such as Smith & Nephew, but there is no way that he would be able to generate the power needed to stay competitive.

Combine that with the fact that he would again have to create and learn a new swing would lead me to believe that his career as at least a competitive (top 50 or so) pro golfer would be done

I know nothing on the technicalities of a knee replacement but his left knee is the problem and you create next to no power with that leg. You have to be able to absorb the power created but you don't need to produce it. I can also point a to a bunch of swings that are very easy on a left knee.

**tyler24** · 06-21-2011, 02:00 PM

Regardless of what anyone says, I really want to see him make a come back. The shots the guy can make are unbelievable. Rory is a hell of a golfer and I want to see those two head to head. No offense to other countries but I just want to see us back on top in this sport. Tiger made a genius move by finally looking at his career and realizing he wants this thing to last. I want to see him come back better than ever...but I dont think his putter is ever going to be as dominate as it once was.