MLB: Big Hurt Released

superdorf · 04-21-2008, 03:41 PM

Originally Posted by CloneFan65

Couldn't agree more. I don't blame Thomas for being upset. He's not being benched or released to make the team better, he was benched so the team can save money. Most likely the team was sitting back and waiting for the Big Hurt to go through his first slump of the season so they could pull this.

Frank signed the contract, and if he didn't like the stipulation of the number of AB's then he shouldn't have signed the contract.

Baseball players are so spoiled. They all have guaranteed contracts! Talk to a football player, who can be cut at anytime and not get paid anymore.

shagcarpetjesus · 04-21-2008, 04:17 PM

Originally Posted by superdorf

Frank signed the contract, and if he didn't like the stipulation of the number of AB's then he shouldn't have signed the contract.

Baseball players are so spoiled. They all have guaranteed contracts! Talk to a football player, who can be cut at anytime and not get paid anymore.

Frank DID like the stipulated number of ABs that's why he signed the original contract in the first place. He would have easily met the targeted ABs this season & triggered his option for next year. Frank WANTED to trigger his option and tack on an extra year in '09 for $10 mil. If you want to spew some righteous indignation at somebody for signing the contract & then trying to get out of it, direct it at J.P. Ricciardi. Don't get me wrong, the Blue Jays have every legal right to do what they're doing. But I'm not going to trash Thomas because he's a little irked at the way things have gone down.

cybsball20 · 04-21-2008, 04:20 PM

It just goes to show that professional sports aren't all about W-L but about the $$$, even to management. With the exception of the Red Sox and Yankees, who operate in the red, all teams are trying to gain as much profit possible. Thats why teams like the Rays and Royals have some of the largest profit margins despite bad records.

mwitt · 04-21-2008, 04:26 PM

If the Red Sox are in the red this year, I shutter to think the return Detroit is getting, as they have the second highest payroll.

cybsball20 · 04-21-2008, 04:31 PM

Originally Posted by mwitt

If the Red Sox are in the red this year, I shutter to think the return Detroit is getting, as they have the second highest payroll.

The Tigers actually operated at $4.6 mill profit. The Yankees lost $47.3 million.

http://http://www.forbes.com/lists/2...ll_Income.html

Gordyo5 · 04-21-2008, 04:32 PM

Originally Posted by shagcarpetjesus

To a certain extent, I understand where the Big Hurt is coming from on this. This move isn't just about the Blue Jays getting rid of a guy who no longer produces. The Blue Jays benched him because they didn't want him to get enough ABs to trigger his option for next year. IMO, J.P. Ricciardi (the Blue Jays GM) is one of the worst in baseball and this is just par for the course with him. Thomas is a notoriously slow-starter and even though he's only hitting .167 right now, he's still hit 3 HRs and driven in 11 runs. Last year he hit 26 HRs with 95 HRs for the Blue Jays so it's not like he's been a complete dud in Toronto. Ricciardi doesn't want to pay Thomas next so he's cutting him loose. I think Big Frank is going to be one motivated dude after this and is going to put up some nice numbers for whoever picks him up. Just look at what he did in Oakland in '06 after he left the White Sox.

I think the issue is more that he was not producing now and the Blue Jays need someone who is right now in the DH spot. Franky would not have been happy on the bench and when unhappy can be posion in the locker room. Exactly what a young Blue Jays team does not need. If he would have been a positive member of the team by sitting the bench and spliting time until he got hot the Jays would have kept him. It is easy to make this look like Ricciardi's fault and make him look like the bad guy, but the fact is Frank was hurting them now in a year when they may have a shot at the postseason and can't afford to fall behind by that much now. Would having Frank at the end of the season help them more than he is hurting them now, I highly doubt it.

cybsball20 · 04-21-2008, 04:35 PM

It's hard to get any idea how he is doing in 60 at bats, you can't get any read at all, and he is known as a slow starter. One 4-5 game would raise his batting average from .167 to .215

mwitt · 04-21-2008, 04:35 PM

Originally Posted by cybsball20

The Tigers actually operated at $4.6 mill profit. The Yankees lost $47.3 million.

http://http://www.forbes.com/lists/2...ll_Income.html

In 2007 or 2008? The Tigers added a lot to payroll for this year.

cybsball20 · 04-21-2008, 04:36 PM

The numbers are for 2007...

mwitt · 04-21-2008, 04:37 PM

Originally Posted by cybsball20

The numbers are for 2007...

I assumed so. The Tigers didn't have the second highest payroll in 2007. They do in 2008. That's all I meant.

superdorf · 04-21-2008, 05:17 PM

Originally Posted by shagcarpetjesus

Frank DID like the stipulated number of ABs that's why he signed the original contract in the first place. He would have easily met the targeted ABs this season & triggered his option for next year. Frank WANTED to trigger his option and tack on an extra year in '09 for $10 mil. If you want to spew some righteous indignation at somebody for signing the contract & then trying to get out of it, direct it at J.P. Ricciardi. Don't get me wrong, the Blue Jays have every legal right to do what they're doing. But I'm not going to trash Thomas because he's a little irked at the way things have gone down.

Are you insane? If the contract stated 600 AB's then Thomas could have THOUGHT he would easily get that, but the team (however sleasy it may be) as every right to sit his butt on the bench if they don't want him to get those AB's.

He signed the contract. The contract didn't say he would get the at bats, just that if he did he would get more money.

Last time I checked I don't think "The Big Hurt" was under a cash crunch... so he had 2 options.

1) Ride the bench and be happy to have a job.
2) Ask for a trade privately.

P.S. I feel kind of stupid, but I had to look up righteous indignation...
Righteous indignation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

mwitt · 04-21-2008, 05:26 PM

Originally Posted by superdorf

Are you insane? If the contract stated 600 AB's then Thomas could have THOUGHT he would easily get that, but the team (however sleasy it may be) as every right to sit his butt on the bench if they don't want him to get those AB's.

He signed the contract. The contract didn't say he would get the at bats, just that if he did he would get more money.

Last time I checked I don't think "The Big Hurt" was under a cash crunch... so he had 2 options.

1) Ride the bench and be happy to have a job.
2) Ask for a trade privately.

P.S. I feel kind of stupid, but I had to look up righteous indignation...
Righteous indignation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

No one has said that the Blue Jays violated any rule or law by benching Thomas. What they're saying is it's sleazy, unethical, and would **** off almost any player, especially a future Hall of Famer.

While Frank did sign the contract, the Blue Jays also agreed to it. If they were afraid of the option for the third year, then they shouldn't have included it in their offer.

CloneFan65 · 04-21-2008, 05:27 PM

Originally Posted by Gordyo5

I think the issue is more that he was not producing now and the Blue Jays need someone who is right now in the DH spot. Franky would not have been happy on the bench and when unhappy can be posion in the locker room. Exactly what a young Blue Jays team does not need. If he would have been a positive member of the team by sitting the bench and spliting time until he got hot the Jays would have kept him. It is easy to make this look like Ricciardi's fault and make him look like the bad guy, but the fact is Frank was hurting them now in a year when they may have a shot at the postseason and can't afford to fall behind by that much now. Would having Frank at the end of the season help them more than he is hurting them now, I highly doubt it.

I agree that Thomas could have handled the situation better, but I have to take exception with that last statement. I find it hard to believe having an OBP over 0.350 with 25-30 HR and 85-95 RBIs would hurt the team's chances. I think by doing this the Jays have demonstrated they're more worried about the bottom line than they are winning games.

Gordyo5 · 04-21-2008, 06:21 PM

Originally Posted by CloneFan65

I agree that Thomas could have handled the situation better, but I have to take exception with that last statement. I find it hard to believe having an OBP over 0.350 with 25-30 HR and 85-95 RBIs would hurt the team's chances. I think by doing this the Jays have demonstrated they're more worried about the bottom line than they are winning games.

The bottom line is he is not producing now and that Matt Stairs/ Adam Lind/ Rod Barajas will fill that roll in basically the same way that Franky would, if no better. In not way do I think what they did was wrong and I do not think it was about the ABs. They are obviously worried about winning games if they saw that he was hurting the team and would rather have some one else in that role. If he was hitting even 250 they would have kept him. Since Frank is above riding the bench through a slump, they did the only thing they could to keep the team together.

cybsball20 · 04-21-2008, 06:54 PM

Guess the Red Sox better give up on Big Papi, he is only hitting .177 with a third more at bats... Ryan Zimmerman, .215, bench... Robinson Cano? .169? see ya... Troy Tulowitzki, flash in the pan only hitting .176... Ryan Howard better take his .186 packing too... and while he's at it he can take Carlos Delgado, Russell Martin, Paul Konerko, Alphonso Soriano and Prince Fielder with him...

It's too early to tell!