Chops Owners Want to Sell/Move Franchise

[DaddyMac]

The arena cost $90 million to build. You're saying they were $100M short? The only things that got cut were the facade (supposed to have been limestone, they went with brick) and a few minor upgrades.

It is impossible to get downtown? There are 8 to 10 entrances into downtown. If you choose to follow the sheep and the marked IA Events Crt exit off of I-235, that is on you.

parking? You can park for free 4 or 5 blocks away to the south or west or down at Court Ave. Again...don't follow the sheep to the flat lot north of Vets and you wont' have any issues.

Yeah - fun!

Hiking up from Court Avenue in December so Vets can sit there empty.

God help us if they ever DO get an event that takes up both. Then we can park in Water Works or something...

There's 10 entrances downtown? Coming from the west, I can think of 2 that are even reasonably close. The vast majority are going to take the freeway (that's why it's there). You have the 6th/7th street and 2nd/3rd. Both of which on event night are backed up on to the freeway itself - particularly 2nd/3rd. And coming from the east? Well, you pretty much have the same two. I suppose you could go ALL the way down to Court from Keo or even MLK. Or over from East 6th. But I wouldn't call any of those options close, quick or efficient.

I find it ironic in the city of skywalks we can't get people across 3rd street other than ground level - only compounding the traffic/parking issues.

[Cyclonestate78]

+ 10

And is there still talk of taking that north lot and putting in an "anchor" hotel? Meaning there won't be any real parking for blocks?

And with the building of Hy Vee hall, why do we still have the Polk County Convention Center? We have 4 facilities in this town, all combined don't look to have events to fill a single one of them.

I totally agree. Vets needs to be torn down and cleared out as it is of no value anymore. There is no way in hell they should be discussing spending in the neighborhood of 20 million dollars to renovate Vets. If they want to spend money then they should clear out Vets and build a parking ramp which would still leave plenty of room for other projects in the area. I was in Vets recently and I am amazed that building hasn't crumbled to the ground on it's own yet. What an amazing dump.

[JP4CY]

The arena cost $90 million to build. You're saying they were $100M short? The only things that got cut were the facade (supposed to have been limestone, they went with brick) and a few minor upgrades.

It is impossible to get downtown? There are 8 to 10 entrances into downtown. If you choose to follow the sheep and the marked IA Events Crt exit off of I-235, that is on you.

parking? You can park for free 4 or 5 blocks away to the south or west or down at Court Ave. Again...don't follow the sheep to the flat lot north of Vets and you wont' have any issues.

Are you going to believe that it only cost $99 million to build? I know that's what they are saying and what has been printed but add in that they operated in the red for atleast the first year, the building of it got stalled by months which wasn't free, and now the taxpayers will probably be on the hook for the hockey team. In the meanwhile they still kept vets when they could have used that valuable space.
I just think it seems to be a poorly managed project from the get go and a lot of taxpayers will probably think that too.

I'm not a sheep and do you think that its really that easy to find a parking spot on Court Ave on a Friday night? I don't carry a list of event with me everytime I head downtown to know which exits I can/should take, it shouldnt be necessary. Putting a large arena a block from the interstate doesn't help traffic at all.

[JP4CY]

The arena cost $90 million to build. You're saying they were $100M short? The only things that got cut were the facade (supposed to have been limestone, they went with brick) and a few minor upgrades.

It is impossible to get downtown? There are 8 to 10 entrances into downtown. If you choose to follow the sheep and the marked IA Events Crt exit off of I-235, that is on you.

parking? You can park for free 4 or 5 blocks away to the south or west or down at Court Ave. Again...don't follow the sheep to the flat lot north of Vets and you wont' have any issues.

I also never said build cost, I said in the plan. Are you somehow financially tied into this? I just hear from a lot of people how dissatisfied they are with this whole thing.

[aeroclone]

I guess I'm the only one who thinks it's a pretty nice arena for the Des Moines market.

Nope, I will agree with you on this one. I think for the market WFA is pretty nice. I've been to Sprint Center several times as well, and while I agree from the outside appearance Sprint kills WFA, from the inside it doesn't seem to be a huge difference, especially considering that Sprint is in a market 5X the size and has been built with plans of an NBA or NHL team in the future.

That said, I think the difference between the two are the vision beyond the arena itself. Kansas City has parking ramps and large hotels close to the arena, and the Power and Light district just across the street. WF needs to address the issue of what is around the arena more than the arena itself. Bulldozing Vets would be a good start.

I really think when you look at some of the places hosting the first weekend NCAA tourney games, as far as the arena goes there are many that are not a match for WF, we just need the rest of the package to go with it.

[DaddyMac]

Are you going to believe that it only cost $99 million to build? I know that's what they are saying and what has been printed but add in that they operated in the red for atleast the first year, the building of it got stalled by months which wasn't free, and now the taxpayers will probably be on the hook for the hockey team. In the meanwhile they still kept vets when they could have used that valuable space.
I just think it seems to be a poorly managed project from the get go and a lot of taxpayers will probably think that too.

I'm not a sheep and do you think that its really that easy to find a parking spot on Court Ave on a Friday night? I don't carry a list of event with me everytime I head downtown to know which exits I can/should take, it shouldnt be necessary. Putting a large arena a block from the interstate doesn't help traffic at all.

Agree completely.

Except that having a large arena from a block from the interstate should help immensely, IMO. That is, if there's parking for it.

[mplscyclone]

And there was no numbers fudging? IE, those aren't falsely inflated numbers due to flooding the market w/ free tickets?

No kidding. The goal is to make money. Last year, attendance was high but the tickets were underpriced/free, which is why they couldn't pay the Ducks at the end of the year. I don't doubt that for big games there were 10,000 people there, but a majority of those were getting in for less than they should've.

Wells Fargo Arena is a big part of the problem. You don't have 16,000 seat arenas in a city the size of Des Moines. I think it's bigger than the Target Center in Minneapolis, and Minneapolis is much larger.

I'm sure the building's lease is expensive due to size, cost to operate, etc. Factor in that the team doesn't make money off of parking and concessions, makes it a tough deal.

Des Moines isn't marketable enough to host premier sporting events, and big concerts are once in a blue moon. It's a shame and a waste of a space.

[capitalcityguy]

Yeah - fun!

Hiking up from Court Avenue in December so Vets can sit there empty.

God help us if they ever DO get an event that takes up both. Then we can park in Water Works or something...

There's 10 entrances downtown? Coming from the west, I can think of 2 that are even reasonably close. The vast majority are going to take the freeway (that's why it's there). You have the 6th/7th street and 2nd/3rd. Both of which on event night are backed up on to the freeway itself - particularly 2nd/3rd. And coming from the east? Well, you pretty much have the same two. I suppose you could go ALL the way down to Court from Keo or even MLK. Or over from East 6th. But I wouldn't call any of those options close, quick or efficient.

I find it ironic in the city of skywalks we can't get people across 3rd street other than ground level - only compounding the traffic/parking issues.

There is skywalk access from Court Ave (3 access points I can think of off-hand) to Wells so the time of the year (i.e....weather) is irrelevant. I guess I have found this out on my own, but it makes me think a PR campaign might be in order if this isn't well known?

As far as access to downtown, you can come off the freeway from at least four different entrances (as opposed to the "IA Events Ctr exit") that I can think of. And yes, they are efficient especially if you're not going to get suckered into parking and paying for the flat lot next to Wells. Also, you have the entrances from the east, south, and west.

[capitalcityguy]

I also never said build cost, I said in the plan. Are you somehow financially tied into this? I just hear from a lot of people how dissatisfied they are with this whole thing.

I live in polk county, so I guess I'm financially tied to this. This is a public building, how would I have any other financial gain/loss exposure? Odd comment.

[jdoggivjc]

No kidding. The goal is to make money. Last year, attendance was high but the tickets were underpriced/free, which is why they couldn't pay the Ducks at the end of the year. I don't doubt that for big games there were 10,000 people there, but a majority of those were getting in for less than they should've.

Wells Fargo Arena is a big part of the problem. You don't have 16,000 seat arenas in a city the size of Des Moines. I think it's bigger than the Target Center in Minneapolis, and Minneapolis is much larger.

I'm sure the building's lease is expensive due to size, cost to operate, etc. Factor in that the team doesn't make money off of parking and concessions, makes it a tough deal.

Des Moines isn't marketable enough to host premier sporting events, and big concerts are once in a blue moon. It's a shame and a waste of a space.

It really stuns me that someone thought it was a good idea to build a 16,000 seat arena in the city the size of Des Moines. The Quad Cities is a relatively comparable-sized metro area to Des Moines (400k vs. about 600k?) and we get along fine with our 9,000 seat iWireless Center (I still quiver at that name - I liked it so much better when it was dubbed "The Mark").

[JP4CY]

I live in polk county, so I guess I'm financially tied to this. This is a public building, how would I have any other financial gain/loss exposure? Odd comment.

No, I meant somehow involved with ownership, concessions, or with Wells itself.

I just don't hear a lot of people defending it that often so I was caught off guard.

[DaddyMac]

There is skywalk access from Court Ave (3 access points I can think of off-hand) to Wells so the time of the year (i.e....weather) is irrelevant. I guess I have found this out on my own, but it makes me think a PR campaign might be in order if this isn't well known?

As far as access to downtown, you can come off the freeway from at least four different entrances (as opposed to the "IA Events Ctr exit") that I can think of. And yes, they are efficient especially if you're not going to get suckered into parking and paying for the flat lot next to Wells. Also, you have the entrances from the east, south, and west.

Cap -

All that is like saying go to a game a Hilton, park over on Welch, and come from Des Moines via the Story City exit.

Not that everything you say can't be done. Question is why? For the sake of an old and under-utilized second arena?

I don't doubt about the entrances - but I still think something else could've been done to avoid the congestion on 3rd street from the one lot that we do have.

[JP4CY]

Cap -

All that is like saying go to a game a Hilton, park over on Welch, and come from Des Moines via North Grand Mall.

Not that everything you say can't be done. Question is why? For the sake of an old and under-utilized second arena?

No no, its going to the the Trade Show expo of the world. Apparently you haven't been notified but McCormick in Chicago is closing up show and moving into Vets, and yes ALL of McCormick can fit in there, even the hobos outside and the overpriced union semi riggers/unloaders they employ.

[capitalcityguy]

Like most things in life, it is easier to be critical. Goes along with my comment on the Pollard poll thread. 70% are OK with the extension, but the majority of the comments on the poll thread are the "no's". There is such thing as a silent majority.

DSM has three minor league sports team and concerts stopping through that did not happen prior to Wells Fargo. To call this anything but a success is very short sighted IMO. DSM would never had landed the women's NCAA tourney last year without the arena and it is very possible that they will land NCAA wrestling championship and maybe even a 1st round men's BB tourney (although a bit of a long shot) in the near future. Zero chance of any of these if the arena had been built smaller.

[mplscyclone]

Like most things in life, it is easier to be critical. Goes along with my comment on the Pollard poll thread. 70% are OK with the extension, but the majority of the comments on the poll thread are the "no's". There is such thing as a silent majority.

DSM has three minor league sports team and concerts stopping through that did not happen prior to Wells Fargo. To call this anything but a success is very short sighted IMO. DSM would never had landed the women's NCAA tourney last year without the arena and it is very possible that they will land NCAA wrestling championship and maybe even a 1st round men's BB tourney (although a bit of a long shot) in the near future. Zero chance of any of these if the arena had been built smaller.

My question is it worth it to build a massive arena, to have just a handful of successful events each year?

NCAA Women's Tourney was cool, but that was what? 1 long weekend in the entire history of the building?

NCAA Wrestling would be cool, but we couldn't get something exclusive. Again, is it worth it to have a large event for a weekend that reoccurs every handful of years?

In order to call an arena like that successful, the sports teams need to make money. You need to have that building booked more than when it's empty.