IC Paper discusses UI-ISU rivalry

[Torks Pub]

[quote=SouthernHawk;448315]This is actually a very true post.


"Just thought I'd mention, 3 of those 5 wins were against some of Iowa's worst teams in history, and came over half a decade ago. If you're going to call the 15 game streak irrelevant because of time and how bad the team was, so is that 5 game winning streak."

Some of the worst teams in history? You must be young if you can't recall how putrid the Hawkeyes were in the '60's and early 70's. No matter how bad the Hawkeyes were in the years you are referring to, they were not even close to the horrible teams of those years when they could not even get a conference win.

I love it how Hawkeye fans must demean ISU victories over them by pointing out how bad they were and by association point out how bad we too, must be. Typical, and systemic, after years of listening to Jim Zabel broadcast how each game was not really an Iowa loss but stolen by bad breaks, bad officiating, etc.

[SouthernHawk]

Originally Posted by Torks Pub

Some of the worst teams in history? You must be young if you can't recall how putrid the Hawkeyes were in the '60's and early 70's. No matter how bad the Hawkeyes were in the years you are referring to, they were not even close to the horrible teams of those years when they could not even get a conference win.

I love it how Hawkeye fans must demean ISU victories over them by pointing out how bad they were and by association point out how bad we too, must be. Typical, and systemic, after years of listening to Jim Zabel broadcast how each game was not really an Iowa loss but stolen by bad breaks, bad officiating, etc.

Some does not mean the. I realize that Iowa was awful in the 60's and 70's. That's a little too far back to be relevant to this conversation.

I was not demeaning ISU's wins over Iowa. They were wins, and they were good for ISU's program (stopping a streak like Iowa's is only a positive step).

My point was that if you're going to compare recent history, the last 5 years is more relevant than the last 10. If you're going to go to 10 years (when none of the current players were on the roster), why not go to 20 years? It's easy to twist the current success to show one program being the dominant one, but the fact of the matter is, at the time the game has been played, both teams have been pretty equal.

[DJKHawk]

Originally Posted by Cyclone711

ISU doesn't have as many students as Iowa correct? But hey, we still beat you.....

Nevermind that Iowa has roughly twice the wins against ISU in the football and men's basketball rivalries, and nearly three times the wins in wrestling. Yup, but you still beat us ...

Originally Posted by Cyclone711

Edit: Also, USC (a private school to boot) with an enrollment of 32,000 sure as heck isn't having trouble in athletics. Pac-10 Conference - Conference of Champions Official Athletic Site.

Standford, enrollment 13,075, also has had much success in athletics (practically every sport but football).

Yes, those schools have done quite well. But so has:

• Texas
• Penn State
• Ohio State
• Michigan
• Arizona State
• Wisconsin
• Florida State
• Florida

Sure, we can both pick and choose schools to support our respective sides. Stanford and USC are nice exceptions to the norm, and you might as well throw West Virginia and Tennessee in there because their enrollments are quite similar to Iowa's.

And thanks for the bundle of joy comment ... I try

But I do wonder, are you confusing me with DJK15 (username stealer) or it this based on my own merit? Thanks in advance.

[Phaedrus]

Originally Posted by DJKHawk

Nevermind that Iowa has roughly twice the wins against ISU in the football and men's basketball rivalries, and nearly three times the wins in wrestling. Yup, but you still beat us ...

It's instructive to note, that as a hawk fan, you are unable to acknowledge your team getting beat by the "lowly" Cyclones in ANYTHING without qualifying with a totally irrelevant and cheap, "Nevermind that Iowa has roughly twice the wins against ISU in the football and men's basketball rivalries, and nearly three times the wins in wrestling."

Do you still wonder why we hate Hawk fans??? They bring it on themselves by their arrogance. Really.

[Cyclone711]

Originally Posted by DJKHawk

Nevermind that Iowa has roughly twice the wins against ISU in the football and men's basketball rivalries, and nearly three times the wins in wrestling. Yup, but you still beat us ...





Yes, those schools have done quite well. But so has:

• Texas
• Penn State
• Ohio State
• Michigan
• Arizona State
• Wisconsin
• Florida State
• Florida

Sure, we can both pick and choose schools to support our respective sides. Stanford and USC are nice exceptions to the norm, and you might as well throw West Virginia and Tennessee in there because their enrollments are quite similar to Iowa's.

And thanks for the bundle of joy comment ... I try

But I do wonder, are you confusing me with DJK15 (username stealer) or it this based on my own merit? Thanks in advance.

Living in the past much? Typical homer hawk fan excuse.

Edit: That's like me saying Minnesota has one of the best football programs out there because they won 6 national championships. The catch is that they were all before 1970.

[cycloneworld]

If ISU "overachieved" this last decade, I'll take my overachieving Clones with our 70% win percentage for the next decade as well.

Honesly, Iowa had 3 power years during a down Big 10 stretch. They now think they are world beaters and have been slapped back to reality the last few years.

[iowast8fan]

Iowa talking about Gymnastics:

The two schools meet twice a year, with each dual counted, and ISU had won seven times in a row until Iowa won March 7.
"To have that win, really and truly means the world," Iowa women's gymnastics coach Larissa Libby said. "It's the state rivalry, and they have some kind of ridiculous record against us."
Libby, in her fourth season, said that her coaching staff needed to get that win to prove they are making progress.
"As a staff, we kind of focused our program on that," Libby said. "You have to be the best in the state to be the best in the conference, to be the best in the country. If you can't start at the state level, you're going to be in trouble.

I think this sums up the way ISU has gone about the series. ISU football had been so bad for so long that beating a team year after year who had been historically better is a way to get the program off the ground. It is a building block and it has to start somewhere. ISU had some success against Iowa, and then started building towards better conference results. The next step is to win a north championship, which it had come dangerously close to on more than one occasion.

Iowa State is building itself up at a more efficient manner than Iowa. To build a program, it starts with wins....and like Iowa's gymnastics coach says, "If you can't start at the state level, you're going to be in trouble." Now that Iowa State knows they can beat Iowa, confidence is stronger about beating the conference foes. We'll see how it turns out, but I Iowa State is in a better place than it was when McCarney took over a winless program. That better place started by beating Iowa.

[SouthernHawk]

Originally Posted by cycloneworld

If ISU "overachieved" this last decade, I'll take my overachieving Clones with our 70% win percentage for the next decade as well.

Honesly, Iowa had 3 power years during a down Big 10 stretch. They now think they are world beaters and have been slapped back to reality the last few years.

I'd like to stay out of this argument but...

During those "Down years in the Big Ten", the BT had a winning bowl record, 3 Fiesta Bowl wins (including a National Championship by OSU), and a very solid OOC record.

[cycloneworld]

Originally Posted by SouthernHawk

I'd like to stay out of this argument but...

During those "Down years in the Big Ten", the BT had a winning bowl record, 3 Fiesta Bowl wins (including a National Championship by OSU), and a very solid OOC record.

2002 was a good year but the conference was very top heavy...only 4 teams finished with a winning conference record (2 were 4-4). And Iowa didn't play Ohio State that year. And also had a strength of schedule of 66.

In 2003 Iowa finished 4th which because of the B10's very good bowl tie-ins, went to a Jan. bowl game.

In 2004, Iowa tied for the B10 title (lost to Michigan who "won" the conference) but Ohio State was down and finished at 4-4. Hell, Northwestern finished 4th and didn't make a bowl game.

The Big 10 might have had 1-2 strong teams in those years but the rest of the conference was pretty bad.

[MontyBurns]

Originally Posted by cycloneworld

If ISU "overachieved" this last decade, I'll take my overachieving Clones with our 70% win percentage for the next decade as well.

Honesly, Iowa had 3 power years during a down Big 10 stretch. They now think they are world beaters and have been slapped back to reality the last few years.

Iowa fans seem to think they are "entitled" to top-ten teams like they had during Kirk's dynasty of 3 years. The fact is, they are a mediocre football program. Their all-time record is 559-505-39 (52% wins, 48% losses) and they have appeared in 22 bowl games in 118 years of football (one bowl every 5.4 years).

To the ones who think Iowa's current suckiness is a fluke and they will soon return to normal "Iowa football" like the 2002 season, wake up. The 2002 season was a fluke. The last 2-3 years is normal "Iowa Football".

[DJKHawk]

Originally Posted by Phaedrus

It's instructive to note, that as a hawk fan, you are unable to acknowledge your team getting beat by the "lowly" Cyclones in ANYTHING without qualifying with a totally irrelevant and cheap, "Nevermind that Iowa has roughly twice the wins against ISU in the football and men's basketball rivalries, and nearly three times the wins in wrestling."

Do you still wonder why we hate Hawk fans??? They bring it on themselves by their arrogance. Really.

Tell me, where did I refuse to acknowledge Iowa State beating Iowa in anything? I simply stated several facts, and now I'm (apparently) "arrogant".

And actually, I do wonder sometimes. Too bad the feeling isn't mutual.

[arndog77]

Originally Posted by MontyBurns

Iowa fans seem to think they are "entitled" to top-ten teams like they had during Kirk's dynasty of 3 years. The fact is, they are a mediocre football program. Their all-time record is 559-505-39 (52% wins, 48% losses) and they have appeared in 22 bowl games in 118 years of football (one bowl every 5.4 years).

To the ones who think Iowa's current suckiness is a fluke and they will soon return to normal "Iowa football" like the 2002 season, wake up. The 2002 season was a fluke. The last 2-3 years is normal "Iowa Football".

Ok, stats time:

ISU Football history: 476–556–46
Iowa Football history: 559-505-39

ISU Bowl Record: 2-7
Iowa Bowl Record: 11-10-1

Last 3 years:

ISU: 7-5, 4-8, 3-9
Iowa: 7-5, 6-7, 6-6

OK, number 1, I have WAY too much time on my hands. Number 2, If the past 2-3 years is "Normal" iowa football, is that "Normal" ISU football for ISU? Sorry, had to throw that one out there. Needless to say, yes, we are both mediocre, and both teams sucked the past few years.

[arndog77]

Originally Posted by DJKHawk

Tell me, where did I refuse to acknowledge Iowa State beating Iowa in anything? I simply stated several facts, and now I'm (apparently) "arrogant".

And actually, I do wonder sometimes. Too bad the feeling isn't mutual.

And ISU fans aren't arrogant? Wow

[ajk4st8]

Originally Posted by arndog77

Ok, stats time:

ISU Football history: 476–556–46
Iowa Football history: 559-505-39

ISU Bowl Record: 2-7
Iowa Bowl Record: 11-10-1

Last 3 years:

ISU: 7-5, 4-8, 3-9
Iowa: 7-5, 6-7, 6-6

OK, number 1, I have WAY too much time on my hands. Number 2, If the past 2-3 years is "Normal" iowa football, is that "Normal" ISU football for ISU? Sorry, had to throw that one out there. Needless to say, yes, we are both mediocre, and both teams sucked the past few years.

Wow.... Good post. I had no idea Iowa was that mediocre in football.

[arndog77]

Originally Posted by ajk4st8

Wow.... Good post. I had no idea Iowa was that mediocre in football.

thank god for wikipedia. yeah, nothing to brag about. neither school can get too excited about the overall records, or the last three years. hopefully they both can get their stuff turned around and when we play each other in a few years Chizek and Ferentz will both have top 25 teams for the big games. THAT would be interesting.