Volvo Going Electric/Online Only By 2030

[usedcarguy]

I view it as a race right now for who wins the battle for charging station money. Gas stations / convenience stores are going to get left behind if they don’t adopt quick.

if I were Starbucks, I’d have quick charging stations at every store in 2-3 years. It’s perfect for coffee shops.

The first round of adaptors (Hyvee, Kum & Go) has been WAY too early. And they're doing it as much or more for PR and image advertising than practicality. Starbucks should probably consider adding them if they're in the urban locations where people don't have access to home charging.

As for everyone else, being first isn't always best. If you're an optimist about where this is heading, no one will get left behind because charging stations will be a commodity. Everyone will have one and it will boil down to convenience There's no need to jump in until there's a legitimate need. Otherwise it's a poor use of capital.

 

[usedcarguy]

I disagree here - people get coffee in the morning, presumably right after their car has been sitting in their garage all night long charging up.

Again though, I think the charging thing is completely overblown. Most homes have two cars. It will make sense to have one EV for daily driving and all the normal stuff you do, and another for longer trips. How many times a year do I drive more than 300 miles in a day? 2 or 3 times? It's just absolutely not a concern of mine. It's 200 miles to KC. I'm going to be still at 1/3 of a tank and I'm just going to find a hotel that has charging stations as part of it.

I agree. But to be fair, the conversation started in this direction because of the clusters of people who live in apartments or condos and don't have a place to plug in. If EVs take off, charging locations with a high density of this kind of housing is going to be a big deal.

 

[HFCS]

The first round of adaptors (Hyvee, Kum & Go) has been WAY too early. And they're doing it as much or more for PR and image advertising than practicality.

You will be surprised how that will completely change in the blink of an eye.

2-3 years ago chargers went up everywhere in LA. The grocery store near me has 7 charges with primo parking spots that sat mostly empty every day.

A few years later it couldn't be more different. Now those 7 spots are usually full, or there might be one or two open. Signs posted saying they are monitoring to make sure only people who are shopping are using them. These sat empty like a joke for a year or two and now they are very obviously in very high demand.

 

[BryceC]

Yes, for the consumer.

Maybe no for the American Auto worker?

Probably not for them. That's the way of the world though unfortunately, and everybody from journalists to coals miners are feeling it too.

 

[Macloney]

Probably not for them. That's the way of the world though unfortunately, and everybody from journalists to coals miners are feeling it too.

I get that but there is more to it. About a quarter of automobile manufacturing is in the chassis. These operators and parts won't be needed. OEM part suppliers employ more people than OEM manufacturers, so that supply chain would take a huge hit. These are good jobs in a huge industry. What will replace them? It just doesn't take as many parts and people to build ev's.

I agree that this coming, but there is always more to think about and it isn't as simple as industries adapt. As things become less complex, easier to make and more automatic people will lose jobs.

 

[BryceC]

I agree. But to be fair, the conversation started in this direction because of the clusters of people who live in apartments or condos and don't have a place to plug in. If EVs take off, charging locations with a high density of this kind of housing is going to be a big deal.

For sure. And for those places, there will be a lag on adapting to the new technology. Let's be honest, new technology is frequently first bought in to by wealthier people who have the means to do so, and frequently those people live in single family homes. Those places will be much easier to adapt to this. From there it will branch out, eventually culminating with apartments and other ways we can't even imagine.

 

[BryceC]

I get that but there is more to it. About a quarter of automobile manufacturing is in the chassis. These operators and parts won't be needed. OEM part suppliers employ more people than OEM manufacturers, so that supply chain would take a huge hit. These are good jobs in a huge industry. What will replace them? It just doesn't take as many parts and people to build ev's.

I agree that this coming, but there is always more to think about and it isn't as simple as industries adapt. As things become less complex, easier to make and more automatic people will lose jobs.

And again, that's just not something I am going to concern myself with. When I use my computer I don't think about all of those poor filing clerks that lost their jobs either. When I read CF I don't think about the tens of thousands of journos who lost their jobs. Someday in the not so distant future it could be that my job will be unneeded because I think a fairly narrow AI could probably do my accounting job quite well. And let me tell you, the last thing people will shed a tear over is the poor folks from the accounting department.

 

[Macloney]

And again, that's just not something I am going to concern myself with. When I use my computer I don't think about all of those poor filing clerks that lost their jobs either. When I read CF I don't think about the tens of thousands of journos who lost their jobs. Someday in the not so distant future it could be that my job will be unneeded because I think a fairly narrow AI could probably do my accounting job quite well. And let me tell you, the last thing people will shed a tear over is the poor folks from the accounting department.

I am not disagreeing, but at what point does it start to have a real impact?

 

[Neptune78]

I mean we already have multiple major manufactures telling us so much, but go ahead and doubt it.

It might take 15ish years or so, but we will get to that point where new cars won't be ICE anymore.

Maybe. I see you moved off of ten year fact and are now at 15. You're getting closer.

I'll wait for the big three in the US and the big two in Japan to announce their timeline.

 

[CascadeClone]

And again, that's just not something I am going to concern myself with. When I use my computer I don't think about all of those poor filing clerks that lost their jobs either. When I read CF I don't think about the tens of thousands of journos who lost their jobs. Someday in the not so distant future it could be that my job will be unneeded because I think a fairly narrow AI could probably do my accounting job quite well. And let me tell you, the last thing people will shed a tear over is the poor folks from the accounting department.

Creative destruction. It's what brings higher quality of life overall to society.

There will always be buggy whip manufacturers becoming obsolete, and associated workers losing their jobs. We need to have smarter policies about unemployment and especially retraining workers, rather than tilting at windmills by trying to preserve jobs that are simply not needed anymore. Policies that help protect workers, not just particular jobs.

 

[cycloneworld]

Maybe. I see you moved off of ten year fact and are now at 15. You're getting closer.

I'll wait for the big three in the US and the big two in Japan to announce their timeline.

I work in the renewables industry and the Japanese auto manufacturers are making huge bets on hydrogen fueling in Japan. We'll see if it becomes more widespread here outside of California.

 

[CascadeClone]

Maybe. I see you moved off of ten year fact and are now at 15. You're getting closer.
I'll wait for the big three in the US and the big two in Japan to announce their timeline.

Granted this is a prediction, but probably more realistic than most of us amateurs here. There is def going to be both oil and electrons for a long time yet.

 

[BryceC]

I am not disagreeing, but at what point does it start to have a real impact?

I don't know. I don't know what the overall impact has been or will be. We talking 30k jobs? That's how many journos have lost their jobs in the last decade and we don't seem to care. Will GM and others just keep closing plants here anyway and move those jobs to Mexico? I don't know but it sure seems like that'll have a lot bigger impact that EV's.

For the record I think it's already having a big impact if you look at the rust belt.

 

[usedcarguy]

You will be surprised how that will completely change in the blink of an eye.

2-3 years ago chargers went up everywhere in LA. The grocery store near me has 7 charges with primo parking spots that sat mostly empty every day.

A few years later it couldn't be more different. Now those 7 spots are usually full, or there might be one or two open. Signs posted saying they are monitoring to make sure only people who are shopping are using them. These sat empty like a joke for a year or two and now they are very obviously in very high demand.

I won't be surprised at all. My point was that for those few years they sit empty before they're needed, that money could be deployed elsewhere and generating revenue. In Iowa, several of these are going on 4 years with little to no use...and that's with the electricity being free. And if the market evolves to pay for charge or battery swapping, those first generation chargers will be obsolete long before they pay for themselves. It's much cheaper to wait for the demand than trying to create it.

 

[HFCS]

I won't be surprised at all. My point was that for those few years they sit empty before they're needed, that money could be deployed elsewhere and generating revenue. In Iowa, several of these are going on 4 years with little to no use...and that's with the electricity being free. And if the market evolves to pay for charge or battery swapping, those first generation chargers will be obsolete long before they pay for themselves. It's much cheaper to wait for the demand than trying to create it.

Same here, until it suddenly wasn't. And it's almost like there is a place that tends to be a national trend setter.