The dark side of women's recruiting

[cyclone13]

I respect your coach a lot and do not think he does but if he is talking about a married head coach and straight assistants, thats wrong. A fallacy of your statement is you seem to assume that a gay coach will take advantage of a player. While that might happen, I think its more likely that a straight coach will take advantage of a player.

I can see and understand your point too.
And things go back to who said what and the context. Some posters here are spot on saying some groups have hijacked the "family values" to replace the "homophobic" term.

[gizzsdad]

The PC Police at ESPN are out in full force with this hit-piece.

Agree. A similar hit piece was done on Robin Pingeton soon after she went to Missouri.

I have several gay friends who agree it is not automatically discriminatory nor hateful to disagree with homosexuality.

But this should never be used as a club in recruiting. It is no different/worse than the sins of the straight coaches out there. I do think parents of recruits are perfectly within their rights to seek a Christian atmosphere for their kids, if that is their desire.

[ISUFan98]

Agree. A similar hit piece was done on Robin Pingeton soon after she went to Missouri.

I have several gay friends who agree it is not automatically discriminatory nor hateful to disagree with homosexuality.

But this should never be used as a club in recruiting. It is no different/worse than the sins of the straight coaches out there. I do think parents of recruits are perfectly within their rights to seek a Christian atmosphere for their kids, if that is their desire.

As a father of a little girl, I'd love for her to someday be able to go to ISU and play for Coach Fennelly (although he'd be in his mid-sixties by then--ouch), because you can tell his program is like a family. He's by nature a kind-hearted person, and you don't have to worry about your child being a pawn in some coaches' political agendas.

Making the familial aspect of the program a centerpiece of recruiting is not sinister, despite what those at ESPN and some in the sport of women's basketball (especially those with agendas and axes to grind) will tell you.

[ISUFan98]

A fallacy of your statement is you seem to assume that a gay coach will take advantage of a player. While that might happen, I think its more likely that a straight coach will take advantage of a player.

Really? Ever heard of Pokey Chatman or Nancy Lieberman-Kline?

[CloneIce]

straight heterosexual- the new alternative lifestyle?

I prefer hanging out with straight people... Is there something wrong with that?

I suppose not, but what does that even have to do with the topic being discussed?

[CyFaninPA]

The nation and NCAA women's basketball have a long way to go on lesbian inclusion, though things keep improving year to year. In 20 years things will have improved to a point where people will wonder why it was a struggle. My biggest issue with NCAA women's basketball coaches, players and athletic department staffs is the odd refusal to use the term "lesbian" or "gay" when talking about diversity. If no one truly cares about a person's orientation, then SAY the word and talk about how gay basketball players and gay coaches are welcome in the game, are valued and the sport is better for it.

To refuse to say gay or lesbian implies that it is a bad thing to be gay.

I have followed ISU women's basketball since I was a kid and will always be a fan. I think Coach Fennelly has done wonderful things for the program and I think this is a "learning moment" and gives the opportunity for the whole program to move forward and be more inclusive. Say you are family-oriented, that's great. But then add: "Yes, we are a family-oriented program and by that it means we really care about one another. We consider ourselves to be an inclusive family and we want to make it clear that we value gay players and staffers."

[majorcyfan]

I respect your coach but if he is talking about a married head coach and straight assistants, thats wrong. A fallacy of your statement is you seem to assume that a gay coach will take advantage of a player. While that might happen, I think its more likely that a straight coach will take advantage of a player.

Perhaps you should check out your own coach at OWA prior to Frau Bluder.

[MNCyGuy]

I respect your coach a lot and do not think he does but if he is talking about a married head coach and straight assistants, thats wrong. A fallacy of your statement is you seem to assume that a gay coach will take advantage of a player. While that might happen, I think its more likely that a straight coach will take advantage of a player.

I really doubt BF ever mentioned the sexuality of any of his coaches during recruiting. The writer really seemed to just be putting words in his mouth and jumping to conclusions. Even the quotes from the former player, seem to be taken really out of context. If you specifically go looking for "code words" in everybody's answers, you're going to find them, whether they're really there or not. Of course she was told to push the family angle. That team spends a lot of time together off the court and that's going to be appealling to a lot of girls, as opposed to Baylor's "just show up for practice and I don't really give a **** what you do with the rest of your time" approach. That's not homophobic.

I also think it's curious that the two coaches she mainly casts suspicion on are two of the most high-profile male WBB coaches. Clear agenda, ******* ridiculous.

[gizzsdad]

I also think it's curious that the two coaches she mainly casts suspicion on are two of the most high-profile male WBB coaches. Clear agenda, ******* ridiculous.

Good point - I agree.

[MNCyGuy]

Good point - I agree.

Especially with her whole "Men stole WBB from women after there was money in it"-tangent in the middle of the article.

[joefrog]

Really? Ever heard of Pokey Chatman or Nancy Lieberman-Kline?

Just what I was thinking.

While they're out there, some said in recent interviews, they could face fallout from the March resignation of Pokey Chatman from Louisiana State, following charges of what the university described for the first time as inappropriate sexual relationships between her and former players.

Negative recruiting fears follow Chatman incident at LSU | HamptonRoads.com | PilotOnline.com

The players waited anxiously in the locker room for nearly 10 minutes before Lieberman joined them. She sat in front of a locker, crossed her legs and spoke in a measured tone. "I know that [some] of you have gone to management and said that Anna and I are having a sexual relationship," several players quote Lieberman as having said. Team members couldn't help but glance toward point guard Anna DeForge, a 25-year-old WNBA rookie. "Anna just put her head down," one Detroit veteran says. "After a while, she started crying."


Read more: A growing number of coach are falling in love with—and - 09.10.01 - SI Vault

For the record, I would have no problem with any relative of mine playing basketball for an openly gay coach no matter the sex. I also think that BF is a wonderful man and coach and a great representative for our university.

There are issues though. I do know that certain women's teams in the 90's had, um, many teammates that were more than teammates, and they intentionally made the other team members uncomfortable. I also know of a star basketball player who grew up an ISU fan who didn't even really consider ISU when choosing schools because she didn't want to deal with the situation at ISU at that time. This was pre BF. She also knows BF personally and wishes she had the chance to play for him.

[CyFaninPA]

About predatory coaches - straight or gay: they have absolutely no business being around young adults. Strong training and enforcement of university harassment policies and procedures help keep the creeps out of coaching.

I agree that Bill Fennelly is a great rep for ISU. And I'm so glad to hear that you would be comfortable with an openly gay coach. The key phrase for me was the use of the phrase "openly gay." When people are closeted, there is a lack of integrity at work. Hopefully more folks will come out over the next decade, that would help build a better environment for women's b-ball.

[Cyclonestate78]

I really doubt BF ever mentioned the sexuality of any of his coaches during recruiting. The writer really seemed to just be putting words in his mouth and jumping to conclusions. Even the quotes from the former player, seem to be taken really out of context. If you specifically go looking for "code words" in everybody's answers, you're going to find them, whether they're really there or not. Of course she was told to push the family angle. That team spends a lot of time together off the court and that's going to be appealling to a lot of girls, as opposed to Baylor's "just show up for practice and I don't really give a **** what you do with the rest of your time" approach. That's not homophobic.

I also think it's curious that the two coaches she mainly casts suspicion on are two of the most high-profile male WBB coaches. Clear agenda, ******* ridiculous.

BF is one of the classiest coaches in college basketball, PERIOD. Anybody that says otherwise either hasn't ever met BF, hasn't ever spoken to BF, hasn't heard others speak of BF and how classy he is, or they just don't have a clue what they are talking about.

[BooneCy]

The nation and NCAA women's basketball have a long way to go on lesbian inclusion, though things keep improving year to year. In 20 years things will have improved to a point where people will wonder why it was a struggle. My biggest issue with NCAA women's basketball coaches, players and athletic department staffs is the odd refusal to use the term "lesbian" or "gay" when talking about diversity. If no one truly cares about a person's orientation, then SAY the word and talk about how gay basketball players and gay coaches are welcome in the game, are valued and the sport is better for it.

To refuse to say gay or lesbian implies that it is a bad thing to be gay.

I have followed ISU women's basketball since I was a kid and will always be a fan. I think Coach Fennelly has done wonderful things for the program and I think this is a "learning moment" and gives the opportunity for the whole program to move forward and be more inclusive. Say you are family-oriented, that's great. But then add: "Yes, we are a family-oriented program and by that it means we really care about one another. We consider ourselves to be an inclusive family and we want to make it clear that we value gay players and staffers."

Why would he say that....I'm really....why would he even broach the subject? If a player says, I'm gay, is that going to be a problem? Then absolutely let that player know how you feel. But, there is no reason to even bring it up otherwise. It puts the issue at a level of importance it shouldn't even be on. The real answer, is who cares if you are gay or straight.

[3GenClone]

I really doubt BF ever mentioned the sexuality of any of his coaches during recruiting. The writer really seemed to just be putting words in his mouth and jumping to conclusions. Even the quotes from the former player, seem to be taken really out of context... Clear agenda, ******* ridiculous.

It really seems that the authors are directing this story instead of letting it unfold. Why would the player choose ISU over the programs with openly gay staff members? When talking about "family" in this situation there are typically two scenarios:

1. the family that is welcoming and can accept the family member that "comes out"

2. the family that disowns the the openly gay family member

There are many situations in-between, but I see these as probably the most popular outcomes. So the question has to be asked, why would a basketball player choose Iowa State's "family" atmosphere over other openly-gay programs? Read the article from these two points of view and you come away with two distinct and conflicting opinions - which tells me either the authors have an agenda and have bent the facts to meet their opinions, or that the article is very poorly written.