If Iowa starts another Dynasty (heaven forbid) ...

jbhtexas · 03-23-2008, 05:42 PM

Originally Posted by JonDMiller

The only reason anyone would wrestle at Iowa State is because of Cael.

Well, isn't that pretty much true for any recruited athlete in any college sport? I doubt too many college athletes use the rationale "Well I don't like Coach Y, but I real like the school, so I'm going there anyway"...

Madclone1 · 03-23-2008, 05:47 PM

Originally Posted by SouthernHawk

Do you really think that a team being too good will eliminate the sport? I mean, that would be cool and everything for Iowa fans, "Hey, other schools were just too afraid to wrestle us!"

But no, that's not how it works. Sports like gymnastics, tennis, golf, swimming, lacrosse, etc... will be dead sports before wrestling will be. I'm not aware of any other non Big Three (basketball, football, and hockey in the northern states) sports have championship events that draw 16,000 fans.

Yep . . and your analogy doesn't work because they (sports mentioned) are primarily female sports. They will stay. Wrestling is on life support . . why do you think the NCAA made a deal with ESPN? Another year of "the team championship has already been determined" will cause a major meltdown.

CYKOFAN · 03-23-2008, 06:12 PM

I'm with the guys that think the Iowa/.Va.Tech thing is a one or two year deal and Iowa will not become a dynasty again. There are a couple of things working against Iowa this time around imo, including Cael at ISU and so many big 10 teams becoming powerful in wrestling. I don't follow wrestling as close as many, but with Ryan now at Ohio State, won't that just make recruiting out east just that much tougher on Iowa, especially when you also add in the high level programs at Minny, Penn State and Michigan? Won't so many good wrestlers at the same weight make it that much tougher for big 10 teams to qualify as many wrestlers for nationals, or am I missing something there? How many wrestlers from the big 10 qualify at each weight, and then how many are added? It would seem that so many good wrestlers in the big 10 could make it tougher to get ranked and dilute how many each team would get to the nationals.

anticyclonic · 03-23-2008, 06:30 PM

Okay you worrywarts, you heard it here first, we will win the NC next year!!!!!!!!! To do so we need 120% from our wrestlers not 75%. Harold Nichols had a much more daunting task when he took over in the 1950s: break the dominance of the Oklahoma teams, he did it and Cael will figure a way to get his mission accomplished as well. We are one of four all time traditional powers in this sport and we will get back to our rightful place on top and maintain it.

dukeebear · 03-23-2008, 06:40 PM

I hate Iowa with a passion. Everything about them.

Except wrestling for some reason. Don't get me wrong I still want ISU to crush them in wrestling, but I can't help liking Iowa's style over what ISU puts on the mat. They attack at all times. They are better conditioned. They are more prepared.

Iowa State wrestlers are too defensive, not aggressive. It works I am proud of them, but it's like watching Princeton in basketball. Compared to the Iowa equivalent of Kansas basketball.

MontyBurns · 03-23-2008, 07:17 PM

Originally Posted by CyForPresident

Jon, have you considered guys like Tsritsis (sp). He was an AA in 2006 but red-shirted this year and in all likelihood will lose out to lecare. The guys that got replaced on Iowa that would be starting got screwed. They could have gone somewhere else out of high school and start, but not any more.

So you take two college starters - Tsirtsis who committed to Iowa and started for them at 141 lbs, and Leclere who committed to Virginia Tech, also at 141 lbs. Tsirtsis is a former all-american with a 69-32 record. Leclere had the benefit of what is effectively two redshirt seasons. Iowa benefits from open competetion between Tsirtsis and Leclere. They can start whichever wrestler is better and if that guy gets arrested or injured, they can just substitute in the other guy. Tell me again how they don't have an advantage over schools that didn't bring in a whole second team?

Cyclone62 · 03-23-2008, 07:48 PM

I'm "LOLing" at all the people that claim they don't care about wrestling, yet are whining the most about the Iowa/VT thing.

Indyclone · 03-23-2008, 07:49 PM

Originally Posted by MontyBurns

If Iowa starts another dynasty it won't really matter. It's just wrestling. Nobody cares about it outside of the state of Iowa...and not many care about it inside the state.

But I wouldn't worry about it. This year's Iowa wrestling team is a combination of Iowa's recruits and Virginia Tech's recruits that Tom Brands stole when he gutted his employer's program in order to come to Iowa. Of course they're going to be good when they combine the best wrestlers from two programs on one squad. It's a one-time-only deal. Let's see how good they are long term when they're limited to one recruiting class per year.

You really don't know anything do you? Brands didn't steal recruits from VT as he was the coach there when he recruited these kids and they followed him to Iowa. It's not like he took the Iowa job then went out and tried to take the best off of other teams.

We need to let this go to rest about the VT transfers. 4 of the 5 are from Iowa and probably didn't grow up dreaming of wrestling for VT but for Iowa. These kids would have grown up watching Brands wrestle in the early 90's also and probably idolized him since they would have been junior high age.

I don't understand why everyone also thinks they have 2 recruiting classes either? They have the same number of scholarships as we do. They just elected to give them to transfers instead of high school kids. Just like football when a JC transfers in it isn't considered another recruiting class.

JonDMiller · 03-23-2008, 08:33 PM

Originally Posted by Madclone1

JonMiller . . "only reason to wrestle at ISU is because of Cael". . wow. How revealing.

I knew that someone would totally miss this.

I wrote that to show how ignorant the Brands/VT talk is. Since people were posting some nutty stuff, thought I would follow suit so folks could try it on for size.

MontyBurns · 03-23-2008, 08:56 PM

Originally Posted by Indyclone

You really don't know anything do you? Brands didn't steal recruits from VT as he was the coach there when he recruited these kids and they followed him to Iowa. It's not like he took the Iowa job then went out and tried to take the best off of other teams.

Players commit to the school, not the coach. Coaches with class know this and do not gut a program if they leave for another job.

When Dan McCarney got hired at South Florida in 2007, would you have been happy if Alvin Bowen, Bret Meyer, Athyba Rubin, and Todd Blythe had transferred there? After all, McCarney recruited them initially. By your logic, they should have left ISU and followed him? Get a clue.

agcy68 · 03-23-2008, 08:57 PM

Jon, I believe that you are bording on hypocritical here and think that your gold colored glasses are clouding what is usually your better judgement. See the other thread for the full arguement, but there is a 3-fold issue with VTech / Brands / UofI.

First, this is a very, very slippery slope for the NCAA. What is to stop a coach from using current recruits as a bargaining tool for a "better" job/pay?

Second, VaTech hired T. Brands to be their coach and develop their program (not prepare a program for UofI). If he did not do that, then he was in breach of contract and should pay every last penny that they paid him back to that university. To not respect the hand that feeds you is improper to say the least.

Third, IF we all thought that GMac took the high road by telling his UNI players and recruits to fulfill their obligations (Jon, I believe that you felt this way too), then aren't we by default sayig that if T. Brands did the opposite he is taking the low road (i.e. un-ethical / no class / ...)?

MontyBurns · 03-23-2008, 09:02 PM

Originally Posted by agcy68

Third, IF we all thought that GMac took the high road by telling his UNI players and recruits to fulfill their obligations (Jon, I believe that you felt this way too), then aren't we by default sayig that if T. Brands did the opposite he is taking the low road (i.e. un-ethical / no class / ...)?

True. And everyone including Jon (maybe especially Jon) thought that Steve Alford was taking the low road when they were worried about him trying to take Tyler Smith and his 2008 recruits to New Mexico with him. It's okay for Brands but not okay for Alford? That's funny.

keepngoal · 03-23-2008, 09:32 PM

Originally Posted by MontyBurns

True. And everyone including Jon (maybe especially Jon) thought that Steve Alford was taking the low road when they were worried about him trying to take Tyler Smith and his 2008 recruits to New Mexico with him. It's okay for Brands but not okay for Alford? That's funny.

Let this **** go already..... you have found a bite of food and so you, the troll, is good for how long?

Is there such thing as a low-carb troll diet?

-keep

crash_zone · 03-23-2008, 09:38 PM

to bad there aren't any vtech boards that we could ask them to hop on here and give their view about this (might be interesting)

*edit* i guess i could look for some vtech boards, but i'm lazy :S

JonDMiller · 03-23-2008, 09:53 PM

Originally Posted by MontyBurns

So you take two college starters - Tsirtsis who committed to Iowa and started for them at 141 lbs, and Leclere who committed to Virginia Tech, also at 141 lbs. Tsirtsis is a former all-american with a 69-32 record. Leclere had the benefit of what is effectively two redshirt seasons. Iowa benefits from open competetion between Tsirtsis and Leclere. They can start whichever wrestler is better and if that guy gets arrested or injured, they can just substitute in the other guy. Tell me again how they don't have an advantage over schools that didn't bring in a whole second team?

Tsirtsis was not going to wrestle this year because of grades. Stay out of the deep end here.