A question to you older fanatics: Donnie Duncan

[Bobber]

Thanks to everyone for the history lessons. It's amazing how a few jerks in high places (Branstad, Pomerantz, etc) can really affect a program. It is really sad to think about what could have been with ISU football. I really only remember the McCarney years and beyond. Keep the stories coming!

Oh I wouldn't buy into the conspiracy theory stuff too much. If that's a case, then the same powers have conspired to turn Iowa Basketball over the last 30 years into the mediocre program it is and has built ISU basketball during the same time frame.

We made a lot of mistakes in football during the 80's and early 90's. Hiring Dan McCareny and spending money on the program after that were good moves. The end of the McCarney era was painful and hiring Gene Chizik could have been a huge goof, but we got a reprieve and I believe have a guy in place now who can really do well. What the program needs do do now is generate more dollars.

 

[Steve]

My recollection is that Johnny was interested in being the AD and wanted to hand the program off to a successor chosen by him (likely Halihan).

Obviously, the ISU administration wanted neither of those things and I think that led to the tension during the end of the JO era. But I do not believe JO "quit" on ISU...he was plenty ******...but did not quit.

Johnny was very vocal about the final slate of candidates when Gene Smith was hired. He probably had a point even though Smith ended up being an upgrade to Max. Some of the others on the list would have been over their heads at the UNI level.

The quitting claim gains some credibility when you look at the recruiting classes after the Fred/Loren group. The last couple of classes were not sufficient to remain competitive in the Big 8. The real head scratcher was a last minute plan C level scholarship to a guy who couldn't even crack the starting lineup at his Juco.

 

[Mowilly]

ISU is to blame first, no question about that. The school and certain profs have certainly held us back.

As for conspiracy, you need to look at hires of the BOR to the institutions more than through the athletic lens. Do you think that ISU could have gotten away w/ hiring a FB coach who had left not one, but two schools on probation? If we thought that the hire would be welcomed, we would have allowed Cooper to have the job. Pres. Parks thought that we would have been hammered from the BOR thus he went the so-called safe route (if any OU coach could be called that).

DO you think that if Iowa had owned WOI TV (believe me, they were PO'd that ISU had it) that it would have been broken off and sold?
Do you think that Gordon Eaton (a man well known for hating athletics) would have been hired at Iowa?

While WOI would never have been a top newscast in this market, it would have or could have become a HUGE recruiting tool as much has changed since 1993. (nobody was thinking that way at the time- Pomerantz just did not want ISU to have it)

Don't you find it funny that Rep. Wayne Ford sits by for the last 24 months while athletes at Iowa and UNI get arrested and says and does nothing but then when Banks and the other guys get in trouble this fall he now is calling for reform?

Look at who is sitting in the sky suites in IC on Saturdays and then tell me if they want to see ISU do well?

 

[woodie]

duncan was a wimp when it came to coaching-kindalike chizzywitch.

 

[CYKOFAN]

My recollection is that Bruce said Ohio State (his alma mater) was the only job he would leave ISU for. I don't remember if he said that before or after the job opened up, but I too remember watching the Ohio State-Clemson bowl game with some fellow ISU fans, and getting sick when Woody punched the Clemson player. Re Johnny, I'm 99% sure he was forced out. I love Johnny but he acted like a 2 year old during the A.D search, no doubt because he wanted the job. He told the media that he could find better a.d candidates by opening up any page in the phone book (or something very close to that). A friend sat next to the ISU president (I believe it was Eaton) at the Big 8 tournament and was told Johnny would very likely not be back.

 

[cychhosis]

It was a comedy of errors committed by a lot of different people. Earle Bruce never should have left and he's admited that after the fact. John Cooper would have been a great hire.

I blame Woody Hayes (not the Clemson linebacker).:no:

 

[theshadow]

There were fans that wanted Earle run out of town the entire time he was in Ames -- even during the winning years. Solid (not flashy) ground-based offenses and stingy defenses weren't enough for some folk.

 

[zach]

Great thread full of info...nice input by many.

Z

 

[sweaty7]

Johnny was very vocal about the final slate of candidates when Gene Smith was hired. He probably had a point even though Smith ended up being an upgrade to Max. Some of the others on the list would have been over their heads at the UNI level.

The quitting claim gains some credibility when you look at the recruiting classes after the Fred/Loren group. The last couple of classes were not sufficient to remain competitive in the Big 8. The real head scratcher was a last minute plan C level scholarship to a guy who couldn't even crack the starting lineup at his Juco.

I don't know what was happening behind the scenes at that point, but I remember watching games in Johnny's last couple of years and thinking he was basically a figurehead at that point. During games, he'd walk in to the Tonight Show theme, then mostly sit on the bench the rest of the game while his assistant (Hallihan, I think) did most of the game-coaching. I don't know if I'd necessarily say Johnny quit, though. More like a working retirement.

 

[Sparkplug]

Didn't Duncan, as OU AD, end the Oklahoma-Nebraska series?

 

[MilehighClone]

Donnie was much more of a CEO type than a hands on football coach. Delegated a lot of responsibility. Mack's style is very similar today, so it does work. Perhaps Ames is too small or we didn't have the "infrastructure" in place to run a program in this fashion. Discipline/character were issues. I remeber guys like King Green and Marcus Robinson who were VHT kids but didn't last to long. Robinson had a couple 100 yd rushing games as a true, and then was suddenly dismissed(I think that's how it went). However, Donnie was good for increased sales numbers at places like the Cave Inn and Grand Daddy's, lol.

 

[cyhiphopp]

ISU is to blame first, no question about that. The school and certain profs have certainly held us back.

As for conspiracy, you need to look at hires of the BOR to the institutions more than through the athletic lens. Do you think that ISU could have gotten away w/ hiring a FB coach who had left not one, but two schools on probation? If we thought that the hire would be welcomed, we would have allowed Cooper to have the job. Pres. Parks thought that we would have been hammered from the BOR thus he went the so-called safe route (if any OU coach could be called that).

DO you think that if Iowa had owned WOI TV (believe me, they were PO'd that ISU had it) that it would have been broken off and sold?
Do you think that Gordon Eaton (a man well known for hating athletics) would have been hired at Iowa?

While WOI would never have been a top newscast in this market, it would have or could have become a HUGE recruiting tool as much has changed since 1993. (nobody was thinking that way at the time- Pomerantz just did not want ISU to have it)

Don't you find it funny that Rep. Wayne Ford sits by for the last 24 months while athletes at Iowa and UNI get arrested and says and does nothing but then when Banks and the other guys get in trouble this fall he now is calling for reform?

Look at who is sitting in the sky suites in IC on Saturdays and then tell me if they want to see ISU do well?

I think it is the University of Iowas interest to have ISU competitive, but remain second tier to Iowa. If ISU returned to the perpetual futility of the 80's it would affect the strength of schedule for the Hawks.
Hopefully, with the right coaching staff, and the currect athletic administration, ISU can build a better program no matter what the BOR does.

 

[isudoc03]

Didn't Duncan, as OU AD, end the Oklahoma-Nebraska series?

The big 12 ended the series.

 

[jbhtexas]

Hopefully, with the right coaching staff, and the currect athletic administration, ISU can build a better program no matter what the BOR does.

The university president sets the tone for the university, and the BOR approves the university president. The BOR is appointed by the governor. As we saw (for those of us who were around back then), one governor with an agenda and one bullying member on the BOR to strong arm the governor's agenda can wreak havoc on the athletic and academic status of Iowa State.

President Geoffroy is in his early to mid 60's, I think. There could be a chance that he retires in the next few years. If someone were (back) in the governor's office who believes that ISU should be a satellite school for the UofI when the next president of ISU was selected, it could be very, very bad for ISU. The athletic department would fall quickly.

 

[SCNCY]

The university president sets the tone for the university, and the BOR approves the university president. The BOR is appointed by the governor. As we saw (for those of us who were around back then), one governor with an agenda and one bullying member on the BOR to strong arm the governor's agenda can wreak havoc on the athletic and academic status of Iowa State.

President Geoffroy is in his early to mid 60's, I think. There could be a chance that he retires in the next few years. If someone were (back) in the governor's office who believes that ISU should be a satellite school for the UofI when the next president of ISU was selected, it could be very, very bad for ISU. The athletic department would fall quickly.

Putting all sports aside, why would it make sense for Iowa State to be a satellite school for the University of Iowa. Iowa State has good enough credentials to be considered a stand alone university. I just don't ever see it happening, but I would be curious to hear your opinions as to why this would be a "smart" move for Iowa State and Iowa.

 

[cyhiphopp]

The university president sets the tone for the university, and the BOR approves the university president. The BOR is appointed by the governor. As we saw (for those of us who were around back then), one governor with an agenda and one bullying member on the BOR to strong arm the governor's agenda can wreak havoc on the athletic and academic status of Iowa State.

President Geoffroy is in his early to mid 60's, I think. There could be a chance that he retires in the next few years. If someone were (back) in the governor's office who believes that ISU should be a satellite school for the UofI when the next president of ISU was selected, it could be very, very bad for ISU. The athletic department would fall quickly.

Putting all sports aside, why would it make sense for Iowa State to be a satellite school for the University of Iowa. Iowa State has good enough credentials to be considered a stand alone university. I just don't ever see it happening, but I would be curious to hear your opinions as to why this would be a "smart" move for Iowa State and Iowa.

I too am interested to hear why anyone would want ISU to be in this subordinate role. What are the benefits? Would it be just so that they can provide more advantages to U of Iowa?

 

[jbhtexas]

Putting all sports aside, why would it make sense for Iowa State to be a satellite school for the University of Iowa. Iowa State has good enough credentials to be considered a stand alone university. I just don't ever see it happening, but I would be curious to hear your opinions as to why this would be a "smart" move for Iowa State and Iowa.

I believe the reason given back then was that it would be in the best financial interest of the state to have consolidation of programs among the regent schools. Pomerantz is in the grave, so he can't answer for his agenda. However, the other party to that agenda is still alive, and I hear he is planning to run for governor again. Perhaps you can ask him. KPMG (PMG back then) was the consultant who supposedly devised the consolidation plan, so the buck will probably just get passed to them...

 

[CarolinaCy]

I heard him say it with my own ears when he was back here a couple years ago. Of course, he may have just been saying that because of his audience but who knows.

You are probably right. I just remembered that it was a linebacker who wrote the article and Dennis Gibson was the only one I could think of.

Gibson opened a pizza place in Johnston a couple of years ago. If it's still there, maybe someone could get the scoop for us.

 

[cyhiphopp]

I believe the reason given back then was that it would be in the best financial interest of the state to have consolidation of programs among the regent schools. Pomerantz is in the grave, so he can't answer for his agenda. However, the other party to that agenda is still alive, and I hear he is planning to run for governor again. Perhaps you can ask him. KPMG (PMG back then) was the consultant who supposedly devised the consolidation plan, so the buck will probably just get passed to them...

What would the consolidation entail? Would ISU drop funding for athletics and basically be forced to move down to an FCS/MAC conference level? What would the effects be?

 

[jbhtexas]

What would the consolidation entail? Would ISU drop funding for athletics and basically be forced to move down to an FCS/MAC conference level? What would the effects be?

That occurred about 20 years ago, and I don't remember the details. You're going to have to chug over to the ISU library and look up the details, because I don't think most of that stuff is online.

You might start here.
James Thomas Emmerson Papers, RS 13/13/18, Special Collections Department, Iowa State University Library