Can Cyclones knock off Kansas?

allfourcy

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This. OU front court is below average. If Lucus plays that many minutes against Iowa St, I like our chances much much more.

If Diallo doesn't come around like he's supposed to, this KU team looks much more like their previous years. They will be susceptible to bad shooting night, with nothing but Mason sprinting at the hoop, to bail them out.

OU front court is below average? Huh? I'd take Spangler on my team any day, that dude gets every rebound. Lattin/Buford made some decent and big plays at times. Now, of course I wouldn't trade them for ours, but I think you're underestimating OU's front court just because they're not the go-to type player that Thomas was last year. Besides, didn't McKay/Nader have trouble finishing underneath at Norman? I assume OU's front court was part of the reason for that.
 

allfourcy

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Without Joel Embiid, that's not happening. Niang has always been an issue for Kansas. Ellis can't guard him. KU didn't magically get better. It's pretty much the same team as last season, except Selden is playing at a much higher level, and they're getting more consistent minutes from Graham. Their current frontcourt is not capable of stopping Niang on most nights.

Or as the drunk KU fan said to me last season during ISU-Maryland in KC: "Everything fatboy puts up against us goes in."

Get what you're saying, but remember Niang has to guard somebody too, and I think Ellis has been very tough on him likewise.
 

WastedTalent

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. Diallo, Bragg, and Mykailuk could be starting or at least logging significant minutes off the bench on most teams in the country probably and they can barely get more than a handful of minutes right now with Traylor, Lucas, and Greene already coming off that bench.

Don't get too hung up on who KU starts, and who comes off the bench. Hunter Mickelson has been starting for them. Hunter Mickelson!! Bill Self knows he's not one of the top two front court players, on any night, but he still starts. Right now, Ellis is the only known commodity, everyone else game to game.
 

WastedTalent

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OU front court is below average? Huh? I'd take Spangler on my team any day, that dude gets every rebound. Lattin/Buford made some decent and big plays at times. Now, of course I wouldn't trade them for ours, but I think you're underestimating OU's front court just because they're not the go-to type player that Thomas was last year. Besides, didn't McKay/Nader have trouble finishing underneath at Norman? I assume OU's front court was part of the reason for that.

I would put McKay and Nader's inability to finish down low, more on McKay and Nader, than OU's defense. I will agree Lattin played better defensively than usual last night, but he is like freshmen and sophomore Ejim, on offense.

Spangler is the opposite, other than rebounding, he's bad at defense. He is good offensively though. He's getting to be a very poor man's Niang, just much worse footwork and dribbling.
 

Gunnerclone

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Get what you're saying, but remember Niang has to guard somebody too, and I think Ellis has been very tough on him likewise.

Ellis was bang average against us last year in the regular season and didn't even show up in the championship game. Seldon is who killed us last year and Oubre to a lesser extent. Without a shot-blocking/space-eating style center KU is a good match up for us.
 

HardcoreClone

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After watching that game last night I have us no better than 3rd in the conference right now until this team learns to play with more consistency and plays better defense. We don't have depth obviously but we do have the talent in our top 7 to compete with those 2 teams and we already showed it against OU coming up just short but this team is only going to be as good as the effort they put in on defense because offense is not a problem. KU could be scary good by March if their young guys start to develop and find a way to crack the rotation of expirienced guys they have. Diallo, Bragg, and Mykailuk could be starting or at least logging significant minutes off the bench on most teams in the country probably and they can barely get more than a handful of minutes right now with Traylor, Lucas, and Greene already coming off that bench.

I have similar thoughts. Even before watching last night, I've had us pegged for 4th, maybe even 5th, since Naz's injury. Last night just confirmed to me how much better KU and OU backcourts are compared to ours, and WVU isn't far off. Baylor will be up there challenging us as well, but for different personnel reasons.

As we all know, losing Naz hurts in terms of stretching the floor, taking/making big shots, serving as secondary ballhandler and actually giving Monte some breathers, ability to also attack the hoop, leadership and toughness....So much will now be riding on Monte to deliver against very good guards on both ends of the floor. Mason/Graham will make it very tough on him.

To say we should win every game at Hilton, even over KU and OU, is pretty clueless. Right now I'd lean the other way and say we lose the 3 remaining games against those teams. Doesn't mean that we're bad, they're just better.

We really need Nader, Cooke, and McKay to step up if we want to be as good as everyone is saying. Jameel hasn't been that elite difference-maker. He struggles to finish against any sort of contest or contact around the rim. His defensive rim protection has dropped, maybe by design to help cover the boards? And he hasn't been great defending ball-screens. Again he hasn't been bad, but we need him to be better to compete against the big boys.
 

dualthreat

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Those were two really good teams going at it last night. I think our starting 5(7) can beat anyone, but our lack of depth will show down the stretch in big 12 play. I think we finish 3rd. Not sure who we lose to but I bet we can win all of our home games.
 

DeftOne

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OU could have blown them out of the water with better shot selection and less turnovers, so I still think OU is the better team. Both will be tough to beat, and will require our best games (wherever they are played). I see the 3 teams as pretty equal, within the margins for error in any game. Whoever plays the best in any given game should win.
That's some next-level analysis right there. Let me take it a step farther: whoever scores more points on a given night should (will) win. :jimlad:
 

Wesley

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Apr 12, 2006
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We should beat them both at home. We'll have to play well to win at Kansas but what will really determine the Big 12 race is how we do on the road against the middle of the pack teams
Yep, more confident than ever.
 

jahfg

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Apr 19, 2006
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I have similar thoughts. Even before watching last night, I've had us pegged for 4th, maybe even 5th, since Naz's injury. Last night just confirmed to me how much better KU and OU backcourts are compared to ours, and WVU isn't far off. Baylor will be up there challenging us as well, but for different personnel reasons.

As we all know, losing Naz hurts in terms of stretching the floor, taking/making big shots, serving as secondary ballhandler and actually giving Monte some breathers, ability to also attack the hoop, leadership and toughness....So much will now be riding on Monte to deliver against very good guards on both ends of the floor. Mason/Graham will make it very tough on him.

To say we should win every game at Hilton, even over KU and OU, is pretty clueless. Right now I'd lean the other way and say we lose the 3 remaining games against those teams. Doesn't mean that we're bad, they're just better.

We really need Nader, Cooke, and McKay to step up if we want to be as good as everyone is saying. Jameel hasn't been that elite difference-maker. He struggles to finish against any sort of contest or contact around the rim. His defensive rim protection has dropped, maybe by design to help cover the boards? And he hasn't been great defending ball-screens. Again he hasn't been bad, but we need him to be better to compete against the big boys.

Baylor has been smoked by Kansas and Texas A&M on the road. Like not even competitive. We are 11-2 and had an opportunity to beat OU on the road and looked very competent in doing so, but you think we could drop to 5th?

Nah.
 

Jer

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We can beat anybody, we can lose to anybody. I personally think KU is at their best since the Hinrich years and it's going to take a great game from everybody to have a chance. The room for error is so incredibly small right now that although we CAN beat them, I'd have a hard time betting money on it at this point.
 

CycloneBBFan

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Naz is gone but Burton the new force to be reckoned with. He's only going to get better. Two more games and everyone is going to be asking "How do we stop Burton"??????
 

somecyguy

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Where ISU needs to differ from what OU did last night, is drive and kick. Early the first half OU was driving to the hoop and either getting blocked or caught up in KU's bigs. They don't have any dominant bigs at defending, but collectively they will keep ISU minus Naing out of the lane I think. Like previously, Naing needs to drive and kick to Thomas, Burton, Cooke and Morris for threes and force KU to come out and guard.
 

roundball

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We can beat anybody, we can lose to anybody. I personally think KU is at their best since the Hinrich years and it's going to take a great game from everybody to have a chance. The room for error is so incredibly small right now that although we CAN beat them, I'd have a hard time betting money on it at this point.

I think KU's had several teams better than the Hinrich years since then. The 07/08 team was just 13 points from an undefeated season, and both the 2009/10 and 2010/11 teams were absolutely dominant (until they got to the tournament, haha).
 

BiggerCy

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Seeing as how OU nearly knocked off KU at a hostile Allen Fieldhouse last night, it's not a given that we'll hold serve at home this year. I'm just thankful that I will be there for both the OU and KU games when they come to Hilton. Should be a couple of great games in a great environment.
 

HardcoreClone

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Baylor has been smoked by Kansas and Texas A&M on the road. Like not even competitive. We are 11-2 and had an opportunity to beat OU on the road and looked very competent in doing so, but you think we could drop to 5th?

Nah.

It's a long conference season. I think both Baylor and WVU have more room to improve than we do. Would love to be wrong and finish top 3 or better! Tech and Baylor games this week should tell us a lot!
 

4CY4EVR

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Can we? Yes Will we? Probably not..the problem is what it always has been..
We tend to potentially drop games like
At kstate, at Texas Tech, etc
 

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