ISU Medical School
- Thread starter Cypow
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Its been that way for 40 years. They also have this weird obsession with making everything 'equal' when the 3 universities have much different missions. It took UNI three years of absolute teeth pulling to convince the regents that its tuition didn't have to be lockstep with Iowa and ISU because they are going after a different student.
I seem to remember that when they moved the capital from Iowa City, there was an agreement that U of I would be the only university in the state system to be allowed a law school and medical school. I couldn’t find a reference, so I may be wrong.
Also, it would be interesting to see if the Mayo Clinic could get involved. They seem to be very independent and have the money to do it. I know it’s MN, but geographically, they are close and there reputation is world class. Just a thought.
Also, it would be interesting to see if the Mayo Clinic could get involved. They seem to be very independent and have the money to do it. I know it’s MN, but geographically, they are close and there reputation is world class. Just a thought.
If, hypothetically, ISU had the external funding (likely through large donations) to build a medical school, how much freedom does it have to act within the BoR system?
Building a medical school may not be the most appealing route for the BoR, but if ISU intends to stay academically relevant in the long term, it's going to have to act in its own interest, not the interests of the board. We say it's good for Iowa if each of the regent universities serves a distinct purpose, but is it really good for Iowa if two of the three publics are totally relegated to tier 3 university status (or less)? I can't see how that's in the best interest of Iowa. If ISU becomes a purely specialized engineering/ag school, as some recommend, then in 50 years or so, it's essentially just a tech school, not a true university. And if the university continues to decline in the rankings, perceived value of ISU degrees decline, which certainly is not better for Iowa.
Building a medical school may not be the most appealing route for the BoR, but if ISU intends to stay academically relevant in the long term, it's going to have to act in its own interest, not the interests of the board. We say it's good for Iowa if each of the regent universities serves a distinct purpose, but is it really good for Iowa if two of the three publics are totally relegated to tier 3 university status (or less)? I can't see how that's in the best interest of Iowa. If ISU becomes a purely specialized engineering/ag school, as some recommend, then in 50 years or so, it's essentially just a tech school, not a true university. And if the university continues to decline in the rankings, perceived value of ISU degrees decline, which certainly is not better for Iowa.
I think the cleanest route is a law school. Drake is private, don’t worry about them.
I would prefer a med school. Or at least go into the physical therapy and that kind of stuff. Maybe chiropractic.
I would prefer a med school. Or at least go into the physical therapy and that kind of stuff. Maybe chiropractic.
little to no chance isu will be adding new dept. more like losing with budgets and covid-19 related stuff.
MDs and DOs are both rightfully called "doctors" and practice evidence-based medicine. Osteopathy started on sandier footing than did the mainstream medical community a century or two ago, but they eventually came around and saw the light. This is in contrast to some well-known forms of quackery out there (see my last comment below) who do not embrace science. We should point and laugh at those types of "docs."
That being said, nearly all the top-tier institutions out there are going to be staffed by MDs. MD programs tend to attract the better students, match their graduates into higher-profile residency programs and specialties, and have a higher match rate compared to DO graduates. That is not to say DOs never find themselves in higher echelons, but the averages are what they are. MDs are at the heights and DOs at the base.
I will reiterate though -- the "lower-tier" docs who go through a lot of the same hell to end up working in relatively low-paying lunch pail specialties (e.g., family medicine or psychiatry, etc.) only have my respect. They go through a lot of the same nonsense as the high-flyers only to serve as the front-line "grunts" at community and rural hospitals that we need. A lot of those types are DO graduates, and we should be thankful for them.
See my comments above. It is really rare to see a DO at a top-ranked research school or residency program. It is not impossible, but it is definitely rarer.
Yes, there certainly is.
I would prefer, if this were to ever happen, that ISU went the MD route. Very few public universities offer a DO program, most that once did have converted to MD, and the few that still do often offer both and only have the DO program around as a "legacy" sort of thing rather than something they would build if they started fresh.
I doubt any of the new flock of public medical schools in the past 20 years is a DO program opposed to an MD program -- should be the same here.
Yeah, they do. DOs have just carved out for themselves a less prestigious niche for themselves at the bottom of the totem pole, but an important one.
Goodness no. Get that quackery out of here.
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For years I've dreamt of ISU acquiring DMU to give ISU a med school that doesn't duplicate the one at Iowa. I never thought it would happen but it didn't stop the dream.
I have had the same thoughts but figured if ISU and DMU came to an agreement the BOR would put a stop to it. I'm still pissed ISU lost WOI.
As far as preparing students for successful careers, I disagree. I have hired a large number of both ISU and U of I graduates over the years in the finance field. I have never had an ISU grad that disappointed and really only 1 Iowa grad that did. I spent more than 12 years in the Chicago market and hired a lot of people but was always thrilled to see an ISU resume come in, almost an "instant hire". I think both schools provide well rounded graduates. On a side note, I only ever hired 2 Notre Dame grads and they were some of the worst employees ever. They were smart enough, but seemed to lack common sense and people skills. I know it is a small sample but just sayin'.
These are some odd, but interesting questions. Obviously, you struck a nerve for discussion. And this thread is surprisingly lacking the typical snarky and trolling posts. So, @Cypow what makes you so interested in these questions?
Really hard to do biomedical engineering without both a med school and an engineering school - something Iowa offers. My brother-in-law's friend from college is a biomedical engineer.
I've lived out of state for a while, but has the BOR gotten anymore friendlier to ISU over the years? Even going back to the 90s?
Also, who selects the BOR, is it governor appointment?
Also, who selects the BOR, is it governor appointment?
Towards the end of this outbreak there will be massive federal research money available concerning animal-to-human diseases. ISU should try to position itself accordingly.
Loooong time lurker here, first post. Fortunately this is right up my alley as I graduated from ISU and am a current med student at the U of I. A couple of thoughts, most have already been covered:
1. As mentioned, medical residency slots are funded by the feds and are basically "capped" unless more funding is legislated. Med schools have been popping up to met real world demand for doctors over the past 15 years, residency slots have not kept up, this = low tier schools students having difficulty matching. Supply side is high and new students are starting to catch on to this, so starting a new program would not be a wise investment in the near future.
2. Covid might open opportunities in Des Moines for ISU with either DMU or or Drake for the suggested programs. There will be lots of mergers in the coming years in every industry. My first thought reading this was something akin to Oklahoma State and their DO program. Make the emphasis on training rural docs for Iowa, perhaps some loan forgiveness for staying in state?
3. The engineering to law pipeline intrigues me as a feasible option. Otherwise as mentioned use dollars to beef up engineering/vet.
4. Pre-med should be way more streamlined than it was for me. ISUs pre-med is basically a tag on your advising profile and "hey there's a pre-med interest group." That said my class had someone go to Harvard and we are a core feeder for U of I. But we should be THE feeder for U of I, most years Wartburg has more come here that ISU it seems. Also, the med schools love engineering majors, the Kinesiology majors are not the ones inventing new devices and whatnot. Breadth in undergrad is valued. I'm not sure how to foster the pre-med track at Iowa State but a start would be to yearly meetings with those tagged pre-med to make sure they are on track with their pre-requisits and MCAT review, etc. Genetics, engineering, biochem, should all be pushed for majors, those are what ISU has strong departments in anyway.
1. As mentioned, medical residency slots are funded by the feds and are basically "capped" unless more funding is legislated. Med schools have been popping up to met real world demand for doctors over the past 15 years, residency slots have not kept up, this = low tier schools students having difficulty matching. Supply side is high and new students are starting to catch on to this, so starting a new program would not be a wise investment in the near future.
2. Covid might open opportunities in Des Moines for ISU with either DMU or or Drake for the suggested programs. There will be lots of mergers in the coming years in every industry. My first thought reading this was something akin to Oklahoma State and their DO program. Make the emphasis on training rural docs for Iowa, perhaps some loan forgiveness for staying in state?
3. The engineering to law pipeline intrigues me as a feasible option. Otherwise as mentioned use dollars to beef up engineering/vet.
4. Pre-med should be way more streamlined than it was for me. ISUs pre-med is basically a tag on your advising profile and "hey there's a pre-med interest group." That said my class had someone go to Harvard and we are a core feeder for U of I. But we should be THE feeder for U of I, most years Wartburg has more come here that ISU it seems. Also, the med schools love engineering majors, the Kinesiology majors are not the ones inventing new devices and whatnot. Breadth in undergrad is valued. I'm not sure how to foster the pre-med track at Iowa State but a start would be to yearly meetings with those tagged pre-med to make sure they are on track with their pre-requisits and MCAT review, etc. Genetics, engineering, biochem, should all be pushed for majors, those are what ISU has strong departments in anyway.
No law school please, despite of what you might think, the grads from Iowa already have trouble getting jobs in law. ISU does produce a significant number of talented premed students already. A medical school would be great for our "rankings" and even better for our access to research funding. However, like most of you had said, U of I already has one and without a massive private endowment or something, no way we end up with one.
ISU does have some good research happening in the biomedical sciences program and some other sections. However most of that research relies on using animal or similar types of models to research human medical conditions, this is great and all, but not quite the highest level of medical research. I would love if we added a medical school, but it isn't going to happen. If it did, it would probably be the U of I med. Ames.
ISU does have some good research happening in the biomedical sciences program and some other sections. However most of that research relies on using animal or similar types of models to research human medical conditions, this is great and all, but not quite the highest level of medical research. I would love if we added a medical school, but it isn't going to happen. If it did, it would probably be the U of I med. Ames.
When you are done with school and established in your profession, you should bring your knowledge back to Iowa State to help make those programs better.
Iowa doesn’t need a third law school. The U.S. in fact doesn’t need any new law schools right now. The fresh JDs to jobs ratio is not very good.
