John Deere strike imminent?

[NWICY]

This is why the 2022 Ford Maverick pick up truck I ordered is being built in Mexico.

Sweet humble brag. What is the expected delivery date? I know of one ordered in July that is supposed to be delivered in Nov. I believe. (not mine distant family member.)

 

[NWICY]

I know the situation. If you have a side job that makes more than the Deere job why have a Deere job in the first place?

Insurance and retirement

 

[Sigmapolis]

So you want to throw SS into the market with the idea that it will increase returns, there is no guarantee that will happen.

I think this is the main difference between me and you.

You seem to think of the market as some sort of casino. Sure, one might win some money in the short term, but eventually the house always wins. So it's too risky to put money into it.

That just isn't the reality. Yes, the market goes up and down, but those who stick it out in the long term have always been rewarded over the course of essentially the last century.

IPERS is 58.5% in equities. You seem to love IPERS, and I like it just fine (my grandmother sure does as a former nurse at the county hospital in Boone). Are you unaware of or do you just choose to ignore that your favorite pension program has most of its money in that Wall Street casino for you?

My argument is, if it is good enough for you, good enough for IPERS, and good enough for RR to the point that railroad workers have repeatedly and vociferously fought being folded into the SS system, then maybe making SS pay back a bit more to the poorest among us would be a good thing.

 

[besserheimerphat]

You can always find an outlier, but it's well documented that pensions are crippling cities, states and companies.

Employee retirement costs crippling cities

Costs that cities and towns have to pay for employee retirement benefits don’t get the same attention as pensions, but they typically cost twice as much — and bills are rising fast enou…

www.sentinelandenterprise.com

A $76,000 Monthly Pension: Why States and Cities Are Short on Cash (Published 2018)

Governments are struggling as mounting pension obligations crowd out the rest of their budgets. Oregon faces a severe, self-inflicted crisis.

www.nytimes.com

Muni bond investors could lose out as pension crisis cripples many U.S. cities

Budget cuts, tax hikes among few options for cities struggling to fulfill pension promises.

www.marketwatch.com

Soaring pension costs still crippling Phoenix budget

More money is flowing into Phoenix city coffers than ever has before, but the city faces projections of deficits.

www.azcentral.com

As public pension costs soar, some Southern California agencies turn to controversial borrowing to fill deep holes

California’s cities and special districts are slated to pay $5 billion to fill outstanding holes in their pension plans in 2022, a jump of 43% over what they paid in 2019.

www.ocregister.com

The Coming Pension Crisis Is So Big That It's A Problem For Everyone

The pension funding gap is a problem for everyone. Almost all public pension funds assume investment returns somewhere around 7% (and some as high as 8%+). The most common solution to this problem so far has been cutting services in the hope no one notices. They can't delay the inevitable forever.

www.forbes.com

Already in trouble, corporate pension plans are doomed by low interest rates

General Electric, one of just 16 companies in the Fortune 500 with defined benefit pensions, is freezing its plan.

qz.com

The $66 billion question: How can we fix Pa.’s pension crisis?

You've heard all about the issues surrounding Pennsylvania's largest public pension funds. Now: How do we fix them?

www.pennlive.com

City, county and state governments rarely can afford to post competitive salaries so they have to offer better benefits to make up for it. Also part of the reason you get inefficient/ineffective government - when you don't offer competitive wages, you don't attract the best talent.

 

[NWICY]

They're going out and I think they're going to be out for a while. Two years ago that contract would have sailed through. It's kind of nice to see the union (rank and file, not leaders) stand up for once.

Out at midnight tonight and picketing starts at 7:00 tomorrow morning.

Leadership was pushing for approval of the original offer correct?

 

[qwerty]

City, county and state governments rarely can afford to post competitive salaries so they have to offer better benefits to make up for it. Also part of the reason you get inefficient/ineffective government - when you don't offer competitive wages, you don't attract the best talent.

Being on the border, I follow Illinois politics and finance just for the laughs. They are laughably bad at it.

 

[1UNI2ISU]

Leadership was pushing for approval of the original offer correct?

Yes. They thought it would pass, maybe by a narrow margin, but it would pass. It got massacred.

 

[Sigmapolis]

Yes. They thought it would pass, maybe by a narrow margin, but it would pass. It got massacred.

Sounds like a wildcat to me.

 

[Pope]

Sweet humble brag. What is the expected delivery date? I know of one ordered in July that is supposed to be delivered in Nov. I believe. (not mine distant family member.)

Ordered mine on July 15 and unfortunately I'm still waiting for it to be scheduled for build. Over 100,000 have been ordered.

 

[1UNI2ISU]

Sounds like a wildcat to me.

This one was probably better for current workers than the last one (other than pay raises) but sold out future employees like the 1997 contact did to this generation and people stood up against it.

 

[deadeyededric]

A buddy of mine is a trades worker out there full-time for another company. He packed up his **** and is going somewhere else to work for a while. He's a union worker but isn't UAW. He isn't crossing the line.

 

[jmax71]

Sounds like a wildcat to me.

The UAW bargaining committees is basically required to at least bring back a tentative for the members to vote either up or down.
Also, I don’t know what your definition of a wildcat is but that’s not it.

 

[Sigmapolis]

The UAW bargaining committees is basically required to at least bring back a tentative for the members to vote either up or down.
Also, I don’t know what your definition of a wildcat is but that’s not it.

I thought "wildcat" referred to union membership and union leadership being at odds.

 

[Blandboy]

Sounds like a wildcat to me.

wildcat strike = workers walking without the authorization of their union

 

[Blandboy]

These things can get testy. I remember an '80s strike when the UAW burned a casket at Deere & Company signifying "the death of the working relationship between Deere management and the union". Picket lines weren't fun to cross, either, although there were ways to circumvent their "solidarity". Most of the sign-toters liked beer and it was pretty cheap back then...

 

[jmax71]

I thought "wildcat" referred to union membership and union leadership being at odds.

A wildcat refers to a strike or walkout when it occurs without International Union approval or sanction. That is why you will not see individual locals or individuals just act on their own. Individuals or groups that think they can go that route will find they are on their own in any discipline as a result of those actions.

 

[Althetuna]

How in the world is this thread NOT in the cave?

 

[Althetuna]

It absolutely is why. Rich people, white people, and men are generally more tolerant of high-risk, high-reward investing strategies than are poor people, nonwhite people, and women, which might lead to more up and down swings for the former group than the latter, but it eventually pays off in the long term. I know you are more risk-adverse than me, which is fine, but that doesn’t mean you should get to force your conservatism on everybody else.

As to your direct question, it is pretty simple. Take roughly 10% of the income from a poor person (which is exactly what Social Security does considering it runs on a flat tax) and invest it in a financial product with a real return of 0% or less. Then invest the same amount from another poor person in financial products that yield 5%+ real returns over the course of a lifetime. The second one is going to be *way* ahead of the first at a retirement age.

The specific scenario you laid out would have the second person coming out way ahead. Here's a couple of different scenarios.

Both people are injured in their 40's and can no longer work.

Both people live way beyond their anticipated life expectancy.

Its not clear who would be better off.

 

[SEIOWA CLONE]

I think this is the main difference between me and you.

You seem to think of the market as some sort of casino. Sure, one might win some money in the short term, but eventually the house always wins. So it's too risky to put money into it.

That just isn't the reality. Yes, the market goes up and down, but those who stick it out in the long term have always been rewarded over the course of essentially the last century.

IPERS is 58.5% in equities. You seem to love IPERS, and I like it just fine (my grandmother sure does as a former nurse at the county hospital in Boone). Are you unaware of or do you just choose to ignore that your favorite pension program has most of its money in that Wall Street casino for you?

My argument is, if it is good enough for you, good enough for IPERS, and good enough for RR to the point that railroad workers have repeatedly and vociferously fought being folded into the SS system, then maybe making SS pay back a bit more to the poorest among us would be a good thing.

You seem to think the market has little or no risk for those involved, and if they just wait it out, then they will be far ahead over what they would be in a regular investment type program. You may be, or you may not be, but being in the market is no guarantee of wealth in the future.

You would rather be in the market, you seem to think you have a better idea of where and how to invest that money that will do the best for you. How many others have that same level of knowledge and confidence to do the same? Most would say few, you will respond that they can learn, which is true, but many they do not want to, or choose not too.

Its all about risk and reward, some people just do not to risk their future retirement, no matter how big the reward might be.

 

[madguy30]

How in the world is this thread NOT in the cave?

So far it's mainly looked like an actual discussion.

Give it time.

 

[DeereClone]

You seem to think the market has little or no risk for those involved, and if they just wait it out, then they will be far ahead over what they would be in a regular investment type program. You may be, or you may not be, but being in the market is no guarantee of wealth in the future.

You would rather be in the market, you seem to think you have a better idea of where and how to invest that money that will do the best for you. How many others have that same level of knowledge and confidence to do the same? Most would say few, you will respond that they can learn, which is true, but many they do not want to, or choose not too.

Its all about risk and reward, some people just do not to risk their future retirement, no matter how big the reward might be.

What would you consider a regular type investment program?