Retirement Targets

[yowza]

People are straight up bad with money. Had a friend tell me they didn't save for retirement because they didn't think they'd live that long.

They're still alive.

Throw in the "401k is a scam" crowd and it's a mess. I'm not a big nanny state guy, but automatic 401k participation could be the only thing between a nice retirement and cat food.

It should be forced saving starting with some X age and younger. What % could be based on income levels.

Thankfully for whatever reason, I paid attention to financial matters starting in high school age. My parents weren't good at saving and investing and my grandparents were products of Great Depression, so they did save, but they didn't ever really put it in stuff that would grow. Like investing all life in CDs and money markets.

 

[yowza]

It blows my mind you could retire at age 65 and have less then $100,000 saved. If you invested $50 a month for 45 years and got 5% interest you will have $100k.

Youngsters …. nothing beats TIME!!!

You nailed it. TIME is the key. You can't buy more and it is the biggest lever there is when you are young. Too many think life goes on forever and they are immortal and will save later on. Snap of the fingers and its decades later.

 

[yowza]

Basically he is saying SSI is enough to retire on and get by. That's probably true if you have your house paid off, don't have major medical expenses, don't want to live large, and still be frugal. You're not travelling the globe on $46k annual. But then, that's the original point of SSI - keep the elderly poor from being totally poverty stricken. $46k annual should keep a roof over your head and food on the table, but it may not be what you hoped for in retirement.

I mean, my folks are getting by on Dad's IPERs and SSI, and that's probably around that same 50k annual range. They have a little bit of other savings as well, maybe $200k(?) for emergencies. But their house is paid off, they don't live large by any means (Village Inn is their "nice restaurant"). And $50k goes a lot further in Iowa than it does on the coasts. If they were making $1k monthly mortgage or rent payment, it would be a heck of a lot tighter.

The biggest assumption (other than health care) is that SSI continues to exist (and/or exist at the levels it pays now). I am not counting on it, and I am only 10 years away from eligibility.

The Village Inn comment cracked me the hell up. I know older folks just like that.

 

[CascadeClone]

I don't think they should raise the age. Many occupations that take their toll physically and you don't realize when you are young how much wear is being put on your joints, back, neck, etc. When you are 20s and 30s you are immortal.

Thats true, but its a minority of workers now. Easier to do addl benefits for those physical exceptions, imho. E.g. fire and pd get earlier retirement.

 

[KnappShack]

It should be forced saving starting with some X age and younger. What % could be based on income levels.

Thankfully for whatever reason, I paid attention to financial matters starting in high school age. My parents weren't good at saving and investing and my grandparents were products of Great Depression, so they did save, but they didn't ever really put it in stuff that would grow. Like investing all life in CDs and money markets.

My grandpa had one heck of a rail road pension with no out of pocket medical.

 

[qwerty]

And they stole pension access and replaced it with the crooked 401k.

So obviously don't put money in the 401k. Only suckers do that. Real smart money goes into real estate or whatever the person is selling.

But the smartest money goes into crypto, because it only goes up without ever coming down.

 

[cycloneworld]

I am in this age bracket. This past week I turned down an opportunity to farm additional land as it would require me to step away from my job with benefits. If I was eligible for Medicare I probably would have accepted the opportunity....but at my age the idea of paying for health care would offset a large percentage of the additional farming income.

Funny, by my turning down the additional acres, it results in the not hiring of a potential young professional to fill my position while the land will go to a large farming entity that will just add the farm to their portfolio with no additional labor. America!

It's really sad that in America, people cannot retire solely because of health insurance costs. We are the richest nation in the world and yet you have half of the country against a medicare for all system even though they would significantly benefit.

 

[Papajets]

Genuinely curious, how? I'm over the $200k mark at 32 and I feel like I'm behind. Certain professions with pensions maybe I could see it, but anyone who has to live off 401k's, Roth's and other savings plus SS, that number seems extremely low.

In my opinion, at your age you are in great shape. Just keep stashing it away and let it grow, you should be fine. If you have worked for 10 years and have $200K you are ahead of most people.

 

[TitanClone]

In my opinion, at your age you are in great shape. Just keep stashing it away and let it grow, you should be fine. If you have worked for 10 years and have $200K you are ahead of most people.

Being ahead isn't comforting. But appreciate the sentiment

 

[CycloneDaddy]

But the smartest money goes into crypto, because it only goes up without ever coming down.

Bitcoin is up 50% YTD, no idea how fake money can do so well but congrats to those that have profited.

 

[Mr.G.Spot]

And they stole pension access and replaced it with the crooked 401k.

So obviously don't put money in the 401k. Only suckers do that. Real smart money goes into real estate or whatever the person is selling.

Who stole your pension? Is this a joke?

 

[dmclone]

It's really sad that in America, people cannot retire solely because of health insurance costs. We are the richest nation in the world and yet you have half of the country against a medicare for all system even though they would significantly benefit.

Or you could look at it this way. I've been working for 30+ years, if I would have taken the money that I would have paid extra in taxes, I could easily pay for my health care costs pre-medicare. If I was single and wanted to retire at 60, it would cost me approximately $60k.

If you're 25 and you put $1k/year in an account dedicated to health care, it earns 8%, and you retire at 60, you'll have $172k.

 

[qwerty]

Bitcoin is up 50% YTD, no idea how fake money can do so well but congrats to those that have profited.

I forgot the jimlad pirate. I have stayed far away from crypto since I don't know how it floats along either. I see how the blockchain can be used, etc. but how it gets value, no idea.

 

[CascadeClone]

Who stole your pension? Is this a joke?

Yes, there is a running joke commentary wrt the folks that think 401ks are a scam.

 

[CascadeClone]

I forgot the jimlad pirate. I have stayed far away from crypto since I don't know how it floats along either. I see how the blockchain can be used, etc. but how it gets value, no idea.

My theory is that crypto becomes more valuable as sanctions vs russia, china, etc, as well as crackdowns on criminal gangs in the financial system, are ramped up.

Quite simply, demand and usage by nefarious groups is BY FAR the biggest driver for cryptocurrency existence. What other user for it has any level of volume beyond an absolute sliver of a niche?

Thats my theory anyway.

 

[JustAnotherTimeline]

My theory is that crypto becomes more valuable as sanctions vs russia, china, etc, as well as crackdowns on criminal gangs in the financial system, are ramped up.

Quite simply, demand and usage by nefarious groups is BY FAR the biggest driver for cryptocurrency existence. What other user for it has any level of volume beyond an absolute sliver of a niche?

Thats my theory anyway.

Nope. Recent chain-analysis estimates from 2024 suggest .34% of crypto transaction volume to be illicit.

The purpose of Bitcoin is to provide a global peer to peer medium of exchange independent of government control. It's that simple.

Satoshi invented a way through cryptography to remove trust from financial transactions. He removed counterparty risk and established a system with a fixed and predictable monetary policy. If he were not anonymous he would probably deserve the Nobel Prize.

The only people I have met that continue to fade bitcoin are those who don't understand it, or 40+ year olds that are so entrenched in the legacy system they are blind to it's problems.

 

[yowza]

It's really sad that in America, people cannot retire solely because of health insurance costs. We are the richest nation in the world and yet you have half of the country against a medicare for all system even though they would significantly benefit.

We would have an even more massive labor shortage of the most experienced people. We need the immigration, maybe just in a different way than most of it is happening currently.

I do agree if Medicare started at say 60, there would be many in that 60-64 age range and maybe even quite a number in the 58 and 59 age headed for the exits.

 

[yowza]

Or you could look at it this way. I've been working for 30+ years, if I would have taken the money that I would have paid extra in taxes, I could easily pay for my health care costs pre-medicare. If I was single and wanted to retire at 60, it would cost me approximately $60k.

If you're 25 and you put $1k/year in an account dedicated to health care, it earns 8%, and you retire at 60, you'll have $172k.

I wish the HSA's were around in my much younger days. Back when rarely saw a doctor and had no issues so high deductibles and OOP max would be no issue. Money would have piled up in there.

 

[Max57]

Seriously folks ... if you think 401ks are a scam we just need to have a conversation. I'm pretty conservative, almost 67, retiring in a few months. I don't have a pension and my 401k(s), which I've been contributing to since they were available (with the company match), will provide a comfortable retirement. I'm very happy where I am at. Maybe I've been lucky with my employment -- my I-State degree for sure didn't hurt.

What's wrong with working a little longer? I think that's the key -- keep fricking working at something. Retire at 60? I would have missed the best earning years.

 

[cycub51]

I wish the HSA's were around in my much younger days. Back when rarely saw a doctor and had no issues so high deductibles and OOP max would be no issue. Money would have piled up in there.

I just don't understand how HSA's aren't universally available. It makes no sense to me that someone with a copay for regular visits but still a relatively high deductible for hospital costs is any better off than someone with a high deductible.