**** WBB: Gamethread: Iowa State hosts Utah 5:30 pm ESPN2 ****

[alarson]

Well in the new NIL world how much money do you want to spend on a sport that doesn't break even? I like wbb better than most and even I realize now isn't the time to spend a bunch of money on something that doesn't break even.

With only 2 seasons left on his current contract after this year that's about as low as you're going to get, as eventually you're going to have to extend it for recruiting or announce he's 'retiring'.

Also, based on this fennely is one of the highest paid big 12 coaches. If Pollard's past hiring is any indication, in the event of an opening we'd likely go out and find some up and coming coach. The savings there would likely offset some of whatever buyout exists.

 

[Cymark86]

The rumors were he would go out with this yrs Sophmore class, reality who knows?

With the portal, he could be going out after this year then. You just never know what’s going on behind the scenes.

 

[NWICY]

Honestly…I felt the defense was pretty salty overall after the first five minutes. Let downs here and there just like any team has, but the stops they generated rarely resulted in points at the other end. Fennelly mentioned the rest of the team scored 10 points. Ouch.

Back door cuts and wide open 3s, I was just disappointed, felt pretty good after the KU ga me and today was way too much of what we have seen all season.

 

[CYdTracked]

I mean, but that was also 30 years ago. He raised the bar, but the bar for womens basketball has been raised all over since those days. All the stuff you list was also true 20 years ago, and sports is a very 'what have you done for me lately' business.

Plus declaring us a historical 'doormat' is a really short sample size when womens basketball in general was still basically in its infancy for most of the era prior to him. The big 8 didn't even have an official conference season other than a tournament until 83, and the NCAA didn't expand the tournament to 64 until 94.

"What have you done for me lately?" Well let's see he recruited a McDonalds All American in Addy Brown and Audi who was a 1st team All Big 12 player and honorable mention All American as a freshman. Also have won 20+ games since the 21-22 season and made the Sweet 16 last year and made the NCAA tournament 15 of the last 18 years. Bill's teams has only missed the NCAA tournament 7 of the 28 seasons he's been at ISU.

Going to pull a men's example here... Iowa pushed out Tom Davis because he could not get them past the Sweet 16 and they have yet to make it back there since. Not quite the same comparison as this will be Bill's last stop but you can't be too short sighted and see that 1 season does not make or break a coach. Iowa went from a Sweet 16 team in Davis last season to some dark years under Lickliter and 15 years of mediocrity under Fran for pushing out a legendary coach.

 

[Raiders70]

Yes, at this point in the season is is ridiculous talk. As I said...wait a while. If they don't find more scoring well....

The season is half over. They have shown absolutely no indication they are a tournament caliber team.

 

[AlCyJim]

Outside of her quickness, what else does she bring?

she can hit the three and I like her defense and fighting for rebounds but that is me.

 

[GoClone]

I missed part of the second half, but I was surprised Harris wasn't in during crunch time. She is good enough to start and has Big XII experience. Did something happen to her that I didn't see?

Lily Hansford was getting beat all over the court on screens, drives, and shots. Looking at her form, I have no idea ow she hit the percentage she did a year ago. Hope it comes around soon for her.

The flagrent upgrade on Tanke was egregious. That was a basketball play and basically a clean foul. She is getting better defensively, I think.

Addy Brown, seems to be pushing her threes vs getting enough early lift under them. She does fine if the shot clock is running down and the shot is quick. It looks more natural and relaxed. It is getting into her mentally now it seems to me.

 

[CYdTracked]

With only 2 seasons left on his current contract after this year that's about as low as you're going to get, as eventually you're going to have to extend it for recruiting or announce he's 'retiring'.

Also, based on this fennely is one of the highest paid big 12 coaches. If Pollard's past hiring is any indication, in the event of an opening we'd likely go out and find some up and coming coach. The savings there would likely offset some of whatever buyout exists.

Based on that pay scale I am sure we would have no problem finding money for a big splash hire like Freese or Branacyzk. WBB may not not generate a profit but if we are are already paying top 25 money for a coach we've been paying under market for a lot of years for Bill so I can easily see us dipping into that 7 digit range with our next hire.

 

[alarson]

"What have you done for me lately?" Well let's see he recruited a McDonalds All American in Addy Brown and Audi who was a 1st team All Big 12 player and honorable mention All American as a freshman. Also have won 20+ games since the 21-22 season and made the Sweet 16 last year and made the NCAA tournament 15 of the last 18 years. Bill's teams has only missed the NCAA tournament 7 of the 28 seasons he's been at ISU.

20 games is basically the minimum level to make the tournament, and basically a bare minimum expectation as a P5 coach given how many P5 teams get at large bids. Its not a high bar.

Going to pull a men's example here... Iowa pushed out Tom Davis because he could not get them past the Sweet 16 and they have yet to make it back there since. Not quite the same comparison as this will be Bill's last stop but you can't be too short sighted and see that 1 season does not make or break a coach. Iowa went from a Sweet 16 team in Davis last season to some dark years under Lickliter and 15 years of mediocrity under Fran for pushing out a legendary coach.

I mean, Fennelly has made it to the sweet 16 once in the last 15 years. And has had far more early exits despite often having the advantage of home court that you don't get on the men's side. Hell, like 30 of the 32 second rounders last year were from the P5. Its not a high bar due to the lack of parity in the game.

 

[CYdTracked]

Problem is…Wilson is a non-scorer like AJ

Agree with you there. She has been a pass first PG so far. I'm not expecting her to shoot a high volume but just seems she wants to push the ball up the floor and make a pass where with Ryan the ball stalls out while she dribbles to find a shot or pass. When Wilson is in she pushes the ball up and starts the offense quicker IMO

 

[casey1973]

We have an amazing fan base. Sometimes a coaching change is in order. It's time. It just is.

 

[AlCyJim]

I missed part of the second half, but I was surprised Harris wasn't in during crunch time. She is good enough to start and has Big XII experience. Did something happen to her that I didn't see?

Lily Hansford was getting beat all over the court on screens, drives, and shots. Looking at her form, I have no idea ow she hit the percentage she did a year ago. Hope it comes around soon for her.

The flagrent upgrade on Tanke was egregious. That was a basketball play and basically a clean foul. She is getting better defensively, I think.

Addy Brown, seems to be pushing her threes vs getting enough early lift under them. She does fine if the shot clock is running down and the shot is quick. It looks more natural and relaxed. It is getting into her mentally now it seems to me.

I agree with you about the foul call but she had gotten beaten bad on defense on that play. again mho

 

[OWLCITYCYFAN]

Players gotta make plays. Going into this season who would have thought we would have 2 sometimes 3 scoring options. Somebody other than Audi, Emily and Abbi need to score. Losing Hare was huge, Harris is the only other scoring threat and she is streaky and also not a defensive Specialist. AJ needs to score more.

Williams, Tanke, Hansford, Joens are all non existent.

The entire team had 57 FG attempts today and your favored trio of Audi (20 FGA), Emily (12 FGA) and Addy (11 FGA) took 43 of them (75%). Tanke took another five, so that leaves 9 shots spread amongst the remaining seven players who saw the court.

How is another player to establish herself if there are no plays run specifically to get them in a rhythm and it certainly appears the "Big 3" aren't even looking in certain directions? Syd Harris is shooting .492 on three balls and we got her three shot attempts this evening.

Losing Hare was NOT huge, unless shooting .283 on 60 3PTA is considered good in some alternative universe. Her overall shooting percentage of .338 wasn't much better.

I'm sick of people on this board blaming everyone except Ryan, Crooks & Brown. They're the leaders and take the lion's share of the shots, so they're the one(s) who aren't getting the job done.

 

[GoClone]

I agree, she was beaten on that play and then fouled to compensate, but she is anticipating better on the interior than she did back when she was starting earlier in the year. I think she may be learning a bit what motion and rubs to expect at this level of competition.

 

[swclone11]

The entire team had 57 FG attempts today and your favored trio of Audi (20 FGA), Emily (12 FGA) and Addy (11 FGA) took 43 of them (75%). Tanke took another five, so that leaves 9 shots spread amongst the remaining seven players who saw the court.

How is another player to establish herself if there are no plays run specifically to get them in a rhythm and it certainly appears the "Big 3" aren't even looking in certain directions? Syd Harris is shooting .492 on three balls and we got her three shot attempts this evening.

Losing Hare was NOT huge, unless shooting .283 on 60 3PTA is considered good in some alternative universe. Her overall shooting percentage of .338 wasn't much better.

I'm sick of people on this board blaming everyone except Ryan, Crooks & Brown. They're the leaders and take the lion's share of the shots, so they're the one(s) who aren't getting the job done.

I understand your point here and agree to an extent, but how would you explain them consistently dumping the ball off on those 3 players rather than shooting? There were some semi good looks for other players that aren’t being taken. Crooks and Ryan scored a huge amount of points today with fairly efficient scoring. From what I can tell, people are being fairly critical of Audi and Addy today, and have been very critical of Emily in past weeks. It seems like there’s more going on, even with valid criticism of that trio. We say that people aren’t getting plays run for them - but is that true or are they not taking a chance on shots like Addy and Emily do (for better or worse?)? I admit I don’t fully know the answer there and it could be a bit of both.

 

[BoxsterCy]

I missed part of the second half, but I was surprised Harris wasn't in during crunch time. She is good enough to start and has Big XII experience. Did something happen to her that I didn't see?

Lily Hansford was getting beat all over the court on screens, drives, and shots. Looking at her form, I have no idea ow she hit the percentage she did a year ago. Hope it comes around soon for her.

The flagrent upgrade on Tanke was egregious. That was a basketball play and basically a clean foul. She is getting better defensively, I think.

Addy Brown, seems to be pushing her threes vs getting enough early lift under them. She does fine if the shot clock is running down and the shot is quick. It looks more natural and relaxed. It is getting into her mentally now it seems to me.

Wasn't a great call to upgrade the Tanke foul but it was really no factor in the game. The extra procession only gained them one point and lost us maybe ten seconds.

 

[BoxsterCy]

Look at some of greats who left coaching as this new era got here. Coach K, Roy, Saban, Tara in wbb just to name a few. Having to replace half your team in bball year after year isn't something these people got into coaching for.

Coach K was 75, Saban was 72, Roy was 70 and Tara was 71. Not like they got feed up and left a job when they were 55. They were all WELL into retirement age. We are so used to seeing coaches hang on forever that it's shocking when one actually retires at 63 like Lisa Bluder did and not a coerced "retirement" like Cole at Oklahoma.

 

[Tpups21]

"What have you done for me lately?" Well let's see he recruited a McDonalds All American in Addy Brown and Audi who was a 1st team All Big 12 player and honorable mention All American as a freshman. Also have won 20+ games since the 21-22 season and made the Sweet 16 last year and made the NCAA tournament 15 of the last 18 years. Bill's teams has only missed the NCAA tournament 7 of the 28 seasons he's been at ISU.

Going to pull a men's example here... Iowa pushed out Tom Davis because he could not get them past the Sweet 16 and they have yet to make it back there since. Not quite the same comparison as this will be Bill's last stop but you can't be too short sighted and see that 1 season does not make or break a coach. Iowa went from a Sweet 16 team in Davis last season to some dark years under Lickliter and 15 years of mediocrity under Fran for pushing out a legendary coach.

Agree. Be careful what you wish for.

 

[acoustimac]

The entire team had 57 FG attempts today and your favored trio of Audi (20 FGA), Emily (12 FGA) and Addy (11 FGA) took 43 of them (75%). Tanke took another five, so that leaves 9 shots spread amongst the remaining seven players who saw the court.

How is another player to establish herself if there are no plays run specifically to get them in a rhythm and it certainly appears the "Big 3" aren't even looking in certain directions? Syd Harris is shooting .492 on three balls and we got her three shot attempts this evening.

Losing Hare was NOT huge, unless shooting .283 on 60 3PTA is considered good in some alternative universe. Her overall shooting percentage of .338 wasn't much better.

I'm sick of people on this board blaming everyone except Ryan, Crooks & Brown. They're the leaders and take the lion's share of the shots, so they're the one(s) who aren't getting the job done.

Too many of the other players are not taking shots when the ball comes to them. And please don’t offer the hypothesis that they are being told not to shoot. Some are just plain passing up shots. There were several times tonight I saw players like AJ with an open look and she chose to pass it up.

 

[acoustimac]

The season is half over. They have shown absolutely no indication they are a tournament caliber team.

Look at the schedule before you jump to conclusions. There are lots of very winnable games in the second half. Yes, if they keep playing like what we saw today on offense there are very few they will win.