Kids playing football

ImJustKCClone

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My sons played flag football in 4th & 5th. They moved to tackle football in jr high. My older son DID get a concussion playing football, but not organized football. He was in 9th grade, and was with a group of friends playing "touch" football in a backyard. Someone "touched" a little too hard and he went down backwards, clunked the back of his head on the ground. He was walking & talking fine, but then they realized he was a little confused about the preceding 10 minutes. They brought him home, and I took him straight up to the emergency room. To this day he doesn't remember his friend tackling him.

He continued to play football until he graduated from high school. He had two more mild concussions in his jr & sr years of high school, both due to wrestling. With one, he passed all the tests and went back for his next match. With the second , he wanted to finish the tournament but I agreed with the trainer that he was done for the day.

Sports can be dangerous, yes. Walking across the street or spending too much time in the sun can be dangerous. Football is getting better all the time at protective gear, and changing or adding rules to keep players from injuring themselves or others. I subscribe to the mindset of letting your children try things, but staying involved in their activities so that you can monitor their relative safety. 00 Clone put it well when he described it as being the bumper pads for your kids to bounce off. Kids are going to eat dirt, get black eyes, bloody noses & bruised shins...they might even break a bone or two along the way to adulthood. All of that will happen just as easily without football as with football.
 

jbhtexas

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That's about where my wife and I are with our son. I love watching football so I guess it might come off as hypocritical, but I just don't want my son put at that kind of risk.

It seems like such a position would be rather confusing for a kid. On the one hand, the parent tells the kid that football is so dangerous that he can't play it. On the other hand, the parent actively supports the serious danger by watching it, and probably cheering it, on TV, and possibly even going to games in person. Are most kids capable of reconciling this in a healthy way?
 

cowgirl836

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I played flag football in 5th and 6th grades, then tackle football from 7th-12th grades. I would do it again. I'm not going to force my future kid to play and I'm not going to stop him from doing so if that's what he wants to do. It's a much safer sport than what it used to be, but I understand the risk. I just don't understand why a parent would tell a boy (or girl) who really wants to play that he/she can't.

because part of being a parent is looking out for their best interests and not just their current interest. Sports and extracurricular are a privilege, not a right. Parents may look at the current data and research and say that is a level of risk and harm I am not comfortable taking with my child. Choosing to ride in a car or crossing the street are everyday necessities in our life. Playing football is not. Maybe had I or close family members played football (beyond my dad who I obviously did not watch) I would feel more on the fence about it. I enjoyed going to high school games and seeing friends play - we were definitely a football town and I always vaguely envisioned that my kids would play someday. But this research is convincing enough for me.
There are plenty of other options. I was more involved with music and drama - of which there is actually significant evidence those improve your brain over time. There is always the chance things will improve over the next few years. I've seen interesting research on helmet design that may change things up for me. I actually agree with Incyte that things are probably headed toward great change. But until then, posts like this (along with the research) are enough for me to say that the long-term effects are not worth it.

I played junior high and high school football. I had two concussions during that time, one serious enough to make me feel a shift in my temperment and just made me feel hazy and depressed for the years following. I remember having dizzy spells and being made fun of by teammates and being regarded as weak because I hated contact after that. I stuck it out until the end, but I hated football all during that time. I always felt that those head injuries had long term effects on me; I just didn't feel as sharp as I should. Over time I got used to it, but now, in my early thirties I have noticed things like a slight tremor and feel anxiety more than I used to. With the link of head trauma and neurodegenerative disorders, I can't help but feel that those concussions were somewhat of a contributing factor.

I do know that every person's experience is different and that some bodies will be more susceptible than others. I have a history of alzheimers in my family, so I don't know if that predisposition to neurodegenerative disease puts me at higher risk to effects of head trauma, or not. That is something research will teach us. Further, as medical science progresses, treatments for things like ALS, Parkinsons, and CTE seem to be just upon the horizon. I love watching football and I would never question any parent's decision to allow their own child to make their own choice. However, because of my experience, I will not allow my kids to play contact sports.
 

Mr Janny

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My son is 5 and I'm guessing by the time he's ready for youth tackle football it will have been phased out due to the injury potential and I won't have to make the decision whether he should play or not.

Youth football will be undergoing dramatic changes/phase-out over the next few years.

I think you may be correct. I could see it taking a little longer, but I think a change is coming. As new research is done, more people will take notice. The big threat might be from insurance companies increasing rates if your kid plays football. Who knows if that will happen, but if enough evidence is accumulated to make insurance companies reasonably confident there's a significantly higher long-term risk, you can bet they'll want people to pay for it.
 

Mr Janny

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It seems like such a position would be rather confusing for a kid. On the one hand, the parent tells the kid that football is so dangerous that he can't play it. On the other hand, the parent actively supports the serious danger by watching it, and probably cheering it, on TV, and possibly even going to games in person. Are most kids capable of reconciling this in a healthy way?

sort of like how I enjoy watching The Hobbit with my kid and then expect them to not go out and kill a dwarf with a sword. Talk about mixed messages!

I'm kidding of course. I didn't enjoy The Hobbit at all.
 

jbhtexas

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sort of like how I enjoy watching The Hobbit with my kid and then expect them to not go out and kill a dwarf with a sword. Talk about mixed messages!

No, it's not really anything at all like that...unless there are actually Hobbit leagues that your kid can take part in, or hundreds of thousands of people heading out to stadiums every Saturday and Sunday in the fall to watch the Hobbit teams compete against each other...
 

1UNI2ISU

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I wish I hadn't played. I shredded all of the muscles that run across the front of my shins which causes me to not be able to lift the front of my foot. I'm now prone to tripping and falling and there is severe arthritis in my future. I'm 32. Not much fun...
 

Mr Janny

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No, it's not really anything at all like that...unless there are actually Hobbit leagues that your kid can take part in, or hundreds of thousands of people heading out to stadiums every Saturday and Sunday in the fall to watch the Hobbit teams compete against each other...

really? There aren't thousands and thousands of movies featuring violence, available at all hours of the day that I can watch with my child, and enjoy together?

I mean, that's what you're talking about, right? How can I enjoy football, but expect my kid to understand that it's dangerous and they're not allowed to play? Yeah, it's called using context. My daughter thinks sharks are awesome. We watch all kinds of shark shows. She loves them. Do I think she's confused when I tell her that they're dangerous and she's not allowed to swim with them?
 

CyArob

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I'm gonna make my kids play football. Start as soon as possible. I don't want them to get smarter than me.
 

jbhtexas

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really? There aren't thousands and thousands of movies featuring violence, available at all hours of the day that I can watch with my child, and enjoy together?

Movies == fantasy

Contact football == A real thing that many people take part in.

I mean, that's what you're talking about, right? How can I enjoy football, but expect my kid to understand that it's dangerous and they're not allowed to play?

If you feel so strongly that you will not let your kid play football because you fear it is so dangerous that it will likely lead to a debilitating brain injury that will reduce the quality of life for your kid, how would you explain to your kid why you enjoy watching other real, live, people engaging in the same activity that could potentially bring the same debilitating harm to them (including probably some of your kid's friends)?

My daughter thinks sharks are awesome. We watch all kinds of shark shows. She loves them. Do I think she's confused when I tell her that they're dangerous and she's not allowed to swim with them?

Is swimming with sharks a common activity that literally millions of kids participate in every year? And sharks are...well...animals that like to eat things like people. They aren't rationale beings that are consciously participating in a sport.
 
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istater7

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For one, safety. Most kids are learning football technique and skills at younger ages and if you don't start until high school, you'd be well behind the others. It's probably a bigger safety risk to throw an inexperienced player out on a high school field than letting them play through middle school. Having an inexperienced kid isn't fun for the kid, other players and coaches. It's a lose lose.
 

besserheimerphat

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For one, safety. Most kids are learning football technique and skills at younger ages and if you don't start until high school, you'd be well behind the others. It's probably a bigger safety risk to throw an inexperienced player out on a high school field than letting them play through middle school. Having an inexperienced kid isn't fun for the kid, other players and coaches. It's a lose lose.

Having coached junior high football for 6 years, I can say this is absolutely false. The BEST thing about coaching is watching the kid's skills and confidence grow throughout the season. But it takes a coach who likes to teach, and a player who wants to learn. The worst combination is an over-competitive, "gut check time all the time" coach (which I've noticed many people on this board seem to love) and a kid who didn't want to be there in the first place.
 

besserheimerphat

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If you feel so strongly that you will not let your kid play football because you fear it is so dangerous that it will likely lead to a debilitating brain injury that will reduce the quality of life for your kid, how would you explain to your kid why you enjoy watching other real, live, people engaging in the same activity that could potentially bring the same debilitating harm to them (including probably some of your kid's friends)?

Because I don't have any emotional attachment to those people. Once the game is over, I forget about them. I sometimes watch base-jumping videos on youtube, or Formula1, or the "stupid acts of science" show. All of it involves real people taking real risks. But I don't know them, and when the show is over I don't think about them anymore. If something happens to them I feel bad for about 10 seconds and then I'm over it. But when it's MY kids, then the severity of an accident or injury is much higher to me and then the risk becomes too high.
 

IAStubborn

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Something to consider, guys, while I like that theoretical concept....human beings in general are horrible at judging situations involving something definitely good now possibly causing something bad later. Children are even worse at it. They just can't grasp the concept of deferred outcomes. Not to say I'm opposed to kids playing football, but if your reasoning is that they made an informed choice...they really likely didn't, since they can't accurately judge that risk. Children regularly are tested in a "Have a piece of candy now, or 3 later" situations, and they take the 1 now.

This is true, except it isn't that kind. of situation where there is a wrong choice like the analogy you presented. It is more about if it is something he really wants to do he needs to understand there is a small degree of risk associated with it so he needs to listen to the coach. Same with driving riding a bike, shooting a BB gun etc. And if he doesn't really want to do it often that risk will be a deciding factor.
 

IAStubborn

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Do 1 in 5 kids who drive sustain a concussion? Of those, do 33% report at least one more driving-related concussion within a year?

High-school football accounts for 47% of all sports-related concussions. To say that football isn't a huge problem is just false.

HS Football produces 11 concussions per/10,000 "events" (games or practices). Soccer is over 6, so is girls basketball, lacrosse is over 7 every sport including swimming produces risk if brain injury (.2/10000). If you are suggesting that driving is even remotely safer than playing football you are wrong. Compare death and serious injury stats of the two. Driving is a risk we all take because the reward is greater. I was where you are at with a kid in the 10th percentile for height through age 4 (by the way he is 90th the now at 9), felth the same way. But seeing him play and want to play and enjoy it I can say that the reward is about him enjoying life with his friends not monetary. You have no way of knowing now the reward factor in your equation until your kid gets older and shows an interstate or not. Odds are he won't want to play or try it and not like it. But if he does? Yeah I am not going to ban it. But I am really worried about driving alone as a teen and not sure what I will allow.

What if your son wants to be a cheerleader?
Unfortunately, a cheerleader is 18 times at greater risk of being injured than a football player (craziest stat of the day, granted this has no info on severity but the report was using hospital admission data, I had no idea)
 

Tailg8er

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For an 18-year-old, there is a 48 in 1000 risk of being in a car accident. That is 5%.

For a high school football player, there is a 1 in 5 risk of having a concussion. That is 20%.

I'm not trying to doubt your facts as I'm sure you got them somewhere, but can I ask where? 1 in 5 seems ridiculously high. Over my 4 years of high school football, there were 2 concussions on our ~50 member team. I understand that's only MY experience, but I didn't hear of many other local concussions either. Is it maybe more common somewhere like Texas or Alabama where the skill & competitiveness is at another level?

And to make your comparison more accurate, wouldn't you have to look at chances of a 15-18 year old being in an accident? Unless that's what you did & just worded it differently.
 

IAStubborn

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The problem is not concussions. It's multiple sub-concussive hits over the course of the season - playing on the line, doing Oklahoma drills, head hitting the ground, etc - that puts a person at greater risk. Muhammad Ali was never knocked out, but he took a lot of blows to the head. Younger kids are at greater risk because even though they are slower and lighter, their neck muscles aren't as developed and their heads are a larger percentage of their body weight. That leads to larger accelerations and harder brain/skull impacts. It's one thing to have a bad shoulder or knee or whatever because you can figure out how to work around it. But when you start losing cognitive ability there is really no way to adapt to that.

I played tackle football from 7th - 12th grade as a center. I do wonder if I'll have issues as I get older. And if I do, will it be because I played football? I've got all daughters so I don't have to worry about them playing football, but I do wonder about them playing soccer because it's been shown that heading the ball for years on end can have effects.

The only longitudinal data we have though suggests it doesnt. If my kid was a hell of a center I would have a serious talk as it isn't something I think anyone should do for 20 years. Playing wide reciever in youth football I have no problem.
 

Al_4_State

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I played football from 7th through 12th grade, just like everyone I knew growing up. I don't think any of those guys had head injuries (although there were definitely knee injuries). I had a concussion as a kid, but it was from launching a sled 10 feet in the air and hitting my head upon landing.

I will definitely let my kids play football if that's what they want to do. It was some of the most fun I had during those years. But I do think starting tackling in 3rd grade is excessive. I wanted to play tackle football at that age, but the school district/town I grew up in was way too small to have any kind of pee wee or Pop Warner ball, so we didn't start actually playing until the school offered it, which was 7th grade. Perhaps starting at that age, and not playing at the college level (I wasn't good enough for that anyway) creates a window of time to play the game with lower risk of head injury.
 

BCClone

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Oldest boy is a freshman. Fullback and middle backer. Could see some varsity as a freshman, if he chooses to play college, that will be decided then. I played all the way through high school. Played line both ways most of high school. Never got a concussion that I recall. Only one kid in al 6 years that I remember. So over 7 grades that I played along side....one. The 1 in five sounds extremely high, since I thought wrestling had way higher concussions than football. I've seen a couple concussions just watching HS and youth wrestling. 2 at the same time in fact.

im a farmer and have taken a lot worse blows loading out hogs. Been whacked harder there then anywhere. Announced HS baseball games this year, can't remember how many kids took a heater to the noggin. I cringe more when my son was hitting then playing football.
 

ISUalum2012

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For one, safety. Most kids are learning football technique and skills at younger ages and if you don't start until high school, you'd be well behind the others. It's probably a bigger safety risk to throw an inexperienced player out on a high school field than letting them play through middle school. Having an inexperienced kid isn't fun for the kid, other players and coaches. It's a lose lose.

Where I played football in high school we would start every summer camp by learning proper tackling technique. No one cared if you had been playing tackle football for many years or if you were just starting as a freshman. EVERYONE went through the same learning and the same drills. Teaching proper tackling technique should never be a burden to a coach it should be an obligation each and every year.