Kindergarten Bullying

AgronAlum

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I would tend to believe your son. A 6 YO inventing something like this would be extremely rare I feel. Not trying to call out previous posts.

A kid that doesn’t miss a meal coming home with a full meal is what triggered us to start asking questions. Right after was the water bottle sticker thing. He was getting made fun of for the stickers he chose for doing well in class. Right after that was the basketball thing which was ****** because he plays almost every single day and has for years. Absolutely loves it.

It was happening and had been happening since the first week. This has been confirmed by his teacher. It was a known issue with these two kids.
 

Acylum

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A kid that doesn’t miss a meal coming home with a full meal is what triggered us to start asking questions. Right after was the water bottle sticker thing. He was getting made fun of for the stickers he chose for doing well in class. Right after that was the basketball thing which was ****** because he plays almost every single day and has for years. Absolutely loves it.

It was happening and had been happening since the first week. This has been confirmed by his teacher. It was a known issue with these two kids.
Think I’d go into any interaction with teachers/administration loaded for bear at this point.
 

IceCyIce

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Children that age have a flimsy concept of truth but you still need to follow up with the teacher because that's your job as the parent. Shoot an email to the teacher telling them what your son told you and ask her if she's noticed anything.
My wife's been a Kindergarten tacher for over 20 years. Your comment of flimsy is giving too much credit. Nearly everytime somthing like this is alleged it didn't happen. There are mean kids out there, but parents today are way too damn sensitive and demanding to the "needs" of the kid. It's actually quite funny/alarming that an "adult" would request the things they do to a teacher.
 

Tre4ISU

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My wife's been a Kindergarten tacher for over 20 years. Your comment of flimsy is giving too much credit. Nearly everytime somthing like this is alleged it didn't happen. There are mean kids out there, but parents today are way too damn sensitive and demanding to the "needs" of the kid. It's actually quite funny/alarming that an "adult" would request the things they do to a teacher.
While I generally agree that way too many parents want to outsource a significant amount of parenting responsibilities to teachers I think “do something about the kids hitting my kid in the head” is reasonable.

I’m still at the same point. Obviously talk to the teacher but tell your kid to avoid those kids if possible but if they insist on continuing you will have his back. You talked about confidence and I think it’s a pretty big deal for a kid to have their parents support in a situation like this where it’s not his fault.
 

AgronAlum

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My wife's been a Kindergarten tacher for over 20 years. Your comment of flimsy is giving too much credit. Nearly everytime somthing like this is alleged it didn't happen. There are mean kids out there, but parents today are way too damn sensitive and demanding to the "needs" of the kid. It's actually quite funny/alarming that an "adult" would request the things they do to a teacher.

While I somewhat agree, we’re not new to the district, not new to how the district operates and not new to bullying. We are also not new to the teacher since she was a teacher to our oldest in a different grade. I’m not putting this on her shoulders. There is a culture brewing within the Ankeny school district of parents that don’t give a ****, overworked teachers and teachers/administrators that are handcuffed.

You can criticize our “needs for the kid” but we are involved and know what our kid needs to be successful in school. It certainly isn’t getting bullied consistently starting the first week of kindergarten. This isn’t a one off incident. It’s repetitive behavior that has been confirmed by his teacher.

The original post was centered around what we should tell him to do. He’s able to stick up for himself from a size/strength standpoint but I’m not sure it’s the best way to go about things. I was just seeking advice on how to make things successful for him going forward.
 
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CYdTracked

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I may need to elaborate on what I mean by that as I probably didn't write it clearly. I don't want to nor do I plan to say something to the parents of the girl that was spitting water at my child. I want to compliment the parents of the girl that told my daughter that the other girl was trying to put grass in her water bottle and told my daughter about it because she was playing on the field when it happened. I think her parents should be proud that their daughter did the right thing and was looking out for my daughter. Too often acts of kindness go unnoticed and I told my daughter I hope she thanks that girl for doing the right thing and looking out for her like she did.

So an update on this issue as I witnessed something tonight. This same girl my daughter had an issue with last week at practice with her water bottle put ice down her shirt and was flicking water at her this evening which my daughter did not like. I didn't react but I caught it just as it happened and my daughter looked my way then said "what the heck!" to the girl and then walked away. She got a little emotional with me when she told me about it tonight after practice. I told her I saw it and I thought she handled it the right way by removing herself from the situation and told her I couldn't tell if she did it because she was just playing around like kids do at that age or if she was just being mean but if this girl keeps doing things she needs to tell her in a calm way she doesn't like it and ask her to stop and walk away.

My daughter tells my wife about this when we get home and my wife tells me I should say something to the coach which I don't think we are even close to that point yet. I pointed out when he has up to 15 kids at practice he likely is not going to see it especially when they are scrimmaging another team like they were tonight where his focus is on coaching the girls on the field and not being babysitter on the sideline. Even if I say something to him I am not putting my daughter in a position where if he says something to the team it could make things worse if the girl thinks he is singling her out. Told my daughter tonight as I put her to bed I was proud of the way she handled the situation and never be scared to tell me when something happens as I have experienced bullies too and can help her through ways to deal with it.
 

JP4CY

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Those that have had kids do martial arts, what's the youngest you've seen in class?

No bullying that I know of in our household but the martial arts might be something to check into to see if they're interested.
 

NWICY

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Those that have had kids do martial arts, what's the youngest you've seen in class?

No bullying that I know of in our household but the martial arts might be something to check into to see if they're interested.
@CascadeClone i think this is up your alley, if I'm remembering correctly.
 
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Tre4ISU

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So an update on this issue as I witnessed something tonight. This same girl my daughter had an issue with last week at practice with her water bottle put ice down her shirt and was flicking water at her this evening which my daughter did not like. I didn't react but I caught it just as it happened and my daughter looked my way then said "what the heck!" to the girl and then walked away. She got a little emotional with me when she told me about it tonight after practice. I told her I saw it and I thought she handled it the right way by removing herself from the situation and told her I couldn't tell if she did it because she was just playing around like kids do at that age or if she was just being mean but if this girl keeps doing things she needs to tell her in a calm way she doesn't like it and ask her to stop and walk away.

My daughter tells my wife about this when we get home and my wife tells me I should say something to the coach which I don't think we are even close to that point yet. I pointed out when he has up to 15 kids at practice he likely is not going to see it especially when they are scrimmaging another team like they were tonight where his focus is on coaching the girls on the field and not being babysitter on the sideline. Even if I say something to him I am not putting my daughter in a position where if he says something to the team it could make things worse if the girl thinks he is singling her out. Told my daughter tonight as I put her to bed I was proud of the way she handled the situation and never be scared to tell me when something happens as I have experienced bullies too and can help her through ways to deal with it.
Not bullying but I was told of a story where a kid threw a fit after being thrown out in a baseball game and his dad yanked him from the dugout and took him home.

About brought a tear to my eye.
 
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CascadeClone

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Those that have had kids do martial arts, what's the youngest you've seen in class?

No bullying that I know of in our household but the martial arts might be something to check into to see if they're interested.
It depends a LOT on the individual kid - their ability to pay attention for most of an hour, and their desire to be there. In 15 years, I have probably had only two 5yo that were able, and a few 8-9yo that weren't ready. Our official cutoff is 7, but we have a a new 6yo right now that seems ok. If your kid can sit thru an hour of school without wandering off, or can play outfield a few innings without completely picking dandelions, they probably can start. Just be patient they might not test every time, learn at a slower rate to start.

Biggest thing is make sure your kid has fun - if they do, they will keep coming back and practice more, and grow into it. It takes time, and that requires desire to do it. No different than soccer, t-ball, et al.

The other thing I would mention is getting a good fit with the school. Some are very competition oriented, some are more boot-camp, some are more family friendly. e.g. we are very family friendly, but if we had a kid who wanted to do national competitions and really try to push their abilities, I would probably recommend a different school.

I'm a huge proponent of martial arts for kids, it helps so much with confidence, but also mental focus and of course physical coordination.
 
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OtownClone

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I can’t believe I have to ask this but I’m at a loss. Some of you may remember my oldest (12) being threatened to be stabbed last year and nothing happening about it.

Well now my middle one is in KG and has been dealing with bullies since the first week. We found out last week when he came home with a full lunch and said he couldn’t eat. He said he was too upset about two other kids in his class punching him in the head during lunch. The lunch monitors did nothing. They do it in class and his teacher told him “tell them to stop”. He won’t bring his water bottle anymore because the kids made fun of him. A kid at recess told him he couldn’t play basketball or he’d “kick him in the nuts”.

I know kids were never immune to bullying but it seems the school system can’t do anything about it anymore. He’s a really gentle kid most of the time but he’s absolutely big and strong enough at his age that he could really hurt someone retaliating.

Where is the line between sticking up for himself and walking away? What can we pressure the school to do if this keeps happening? I don’t know what to tell him.
TLDR Version: Take a rational reasonable approach with school staff and leadership, trying to separate past events from current events. Try to uncover the whole truth as kids have just their personal perspective. Understand your options if true physical violence is not being addressed. Recognize that your child could use more support to be more socially prepared to navigate challenging or new situations. Their level of sensitivity could be a piece of the root cause. Seek more support for yourself to understand how to help your child grow up mentally tough and resilient.

Long version:
I have a 6 year old in 1st grade and a 4 year old that will be in in kindergarten next year. I was bullied at times when I was younger. Most kids have experienced it on some level. I am aiming to help my kids in ways my parents struggled to do. I was shy and lacked some confidence when I was young. Most bullying I experienced was verbal. The part of your post I would dig into is the accusation of physical violence. Even truthful kids may embellish or exaggerate events when they feel victimized. Seeking to understand the full truth first is important, even if you are inclined to believe your kid. Also understanding the school's policies and their role in creating a safe environment for all students is important. Ankeny, like most school districts, has anti-bullying policies and can take disciplinary action on kids if true bullying or violence occurs. I suggest taking an approach to positively engage with teachers and school leadership, understand their perspective, and gain their support and advocacy. They will be more likely to take you seriously if you walk in with the understanding that you probably don't have the full picture by just talking to your child. The more you assume these individuals will be guilty by association due to your previous experience, the less productive of a relationship you will have.

Now as for how to handle it with your child:
For me, it was important to learn WHY bullying happens at all, and how bullies choose their targets. Bullies often lash out because of their own insecurity and low self-esteem. They may have challenging home lives, poor role models for parents or guardians, or other underlying behavioral issues. If kids understand the bully's behavior is more about how the bully feels about themselves than anything truly personal about the kid they are targeting, it can help them not get torn down so much by it. Bullies come back to keep bullying the kids that seem to react the most to their bullying. If a kid crumbles, they feel the control and power that they may lack in other parts of their lives. It is also possible the kid just doesn't know how to act. My kid was a bit disruptive in a non-aggressive way in kindergarten. Some additional group sessions with the guidance counselor and maturing and adjusting to the situation ended that pretty quickly. Labeling this as bullying without full understanding or context may be premature.

As with all things, it is better to start by looking internally. I agree with the poster that laid out a plan to raise tough, strong, resilient children. The bullying may seem to be the root cause in your situation, and truly, it is not acceptable for teachers and staff to do nothing if they observe bullying, especially physical. But these are still young kids and what one child may interpret as bullying could be intended as something else entirely. It is not just the child's truthfulness, but also their interpretation of the events that we should consider. Their social ability to navigate situations, set boundaries with others, and problem solve in the moment are the things they can control and that you can influence. Imagine for a moment that the bully is displaying similar behavior to other kids. Do all the kids bullied decide to avoid eating lunch entirely? Do you believe that your child is the only one being targeted and the bully in question shows no behavior issues with anyone else? It is likely that if this is truly bullying, teachers and staff will have noticed a pattern with the bully's behavior. Engage with them to understand to what level your kid might be being too sensitive or perhaps there is troubled child they will need to learn to avoid and cope with.

I would want to empower your child with options on what to do in the moment. The first thing I would want my kid to do is to ask why they are doing that, and then tell them to stop if they don't like it. If the behavior persists, it is appropriate to tell a teacher or staff member. Then move on and do what they want to do, for example, finish their lunch, perhaps sitting somewhere else. Physically stopping kids from touching them while verbally standing their ground to knock that behavior off is also a fair response. The more assertive a child is, the less others will try to pick on them or take advantage of them.

While it may be easy to have the thought in your mind that your kid should not have to deal with bullies in kindergarten, in reality, all of us will have to navigate situations where others are unkind, don't care about us individually, or just don't know how to act. Young kids have the same challenges, just add immaturity to the mix. It is impossible for the adults present to see and hear everything. And even if they stop it in the moment, they are still fighting against the current with some kids. They should continue to take appropriate action, but it is unrealistic to expect an utterly sterile environment where nothing negative ever happens. While not excusing any bullying behavior, you have to know there will be so much more adversity in your child's life, and you cannot always be there to protect them from it. Better to help them and teach them how to face it and overcome it. Your fear that early negative experiences will turn your kid off from school entirely gives these bullies far too much power. You might consider counseling for your child, but also for yourself on ways to help build resilient and confident children.
 

Cyclone06

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I would want to empower your child with options on what to do in the moment. The first thing I would want my kid to do is to ask why they are doing that, and then tell them to stop if they don't like it. If the behavior persists, it is appropriate to tell a teacher or staff member. Then move on and do what they want to do, for example, finish their lunch, perhaps sitting somewhere else. Physically stopping kids from touching them while verbally standing their ground to knock that behavior off is also a fair response. The more assertive a child is, the less others will try to pick on them or take advantage of them.

Both my first grader and kindergartner have made casual comments about people saying mean things, they go the before and after school care which consists of all the ages. A dead pan look back at a mean comment with a "Why are you saying that?" seems incredibly powerful. Make the bully question themselves, I like this a lot.

Like you said, I truly believe those who are bullying is projection of something unseen in their life not being so good or its pure jealousy on their part.
 
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OtownClone

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My advice is for outside of school. My wife and I are pretty introverted. Don’t really want that for our kids, doesn’t mean it won’t though. My wife was bullied quite a bit growing up, myself not as much. What we try and do for our kids is give be them as much positive interactions with others as possible in multiple situations. I have a 6 year old in kindergarten and a 3 year old. I make both of my kids do the interaction around town like ordering at a restaurant so they gain confidence in speaking for themselves. It has done wonders for the 3 year old who was late talker. We rehearse what they are going to say so no surprises. Most find it cute. We also belong to a church small group so they see us interacting positively with others. Doesn’t have to be church just somewhere they see us interacting on a regular basis.
One other thing we do is make our kids responsible for things at home. They do quite a few chores that are age appropriate. I think it proves they are capable and builds confidence. I don’t let them get away with not doing something they can do for themselves. It is a process but we slowly add to their skills. Folding clothes, setting the table and clearing it afterward, and tying their shoe. Takes time but it is great time saver when they get the hang of it. Make your own sammich, get your own snack.
The 6 year old we waited a year before starting school. Hopefully he will be one of the older more mature kids in his class. So he is the one setting the example vs learning bad habits from others. He also did transitional kindergarten. Small class size was great. There were a few behavioral kids in the class but the teacher spent a lot of time on emotional intelligence. So he a plenty of practice dealing with situations and the teacher had the class size to do it. The TK program was great but our school district is wanting to get rid of it. I don’t think they really promote it either or utilize it.
I would like my kids to do martial arts because they are both on the small side. Sounds bad but I think there is confidence in walking in a room and knowing you can kick someone‘s ass. Just not ready for the time commitment. I want them to learn to swim first.
I love your approach to preparing your kids for the world and not expecting the world to adapt around them. Model the right behaviors, create situations where the kids can observe you thriving, and ensure they have consistent challenges to positively overcome. Some might worry that if you push your kids too fast to act like a grown up in some ways, they might lose the innocence that is so precious to keep as a child. I believe that their childhood will be that much better as a result of your approach. Their heightened confidence and capability will allow them to create better relationships with other kids, teachers, coaches, etc. Things get easier when resilience is built early.
 
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ISUTex

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My kid got punished by the school for bullying because he stuck up for one of his friends who was actually getting bullied. It wasn't physical, he just started making fun of the bully in front of a group of people. Only did it that one time, but the bully went home and told his mom and she went to administration. He had to go see a counselor once a week for several weeks. He isn't one to get in trouble either. He was in 6th grade and he was pretty upset about it.
 

CascadeClone

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My kid got punished by the school for bullying because he stuck up for one of his friends who was actually getting bullied. It wasn't physical, he just started making fun of the bully in front of a group of people. Only did it that one time, but the bully went home and told his mom and she went to administration. He had to go see a counselor once a week for several weeks. He isn't one to get in trouble either. He was in 6th grade and he was pretty upset about it.
It's always the second guy that draws the flag...
 

mynameisjonas

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I’m a firm believer in eye for an eye. If kids don’t stand up for themselves it’s an invitations for the bullying to get much worse. If that doesn’t work, then you go to the teachers. If that also doesn’t work, then I’m gonna storm my ass up to the bullies parents house unannounced to have a little face to face. And if that doesn’t work, you stop holding the child responsible, and you start holding the parent responsible. And you take it from there. If the bullies parents don’t shut it down, this situation could seriously escalate, but you have to protect your children.
 

Billups06

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My kid got punished by the school for bullying because he stuck up for one of his friends who was actually getting bullied. It wasn't physical, he just started making fun of the bully in front of a group of people. Only did it that one time, but the bully went home and told his mom and she went to administration. He had to go see a counselor once a week for several weeks. He isn't one to get in trouble either. He was in 6th grade and he was pretty upset about it.

I've heard similar stories. Leads me to believe schools/administrations have some apprehension in dealing with certain parents. Those same parents almost always elicit a favorable response (favorable for them) from the school/administration.
 

VeloClone

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I was the baby of 5 kids and was short and skinny. I went to a rural school and in 6th grade I had to ride a bus from one town to another. There was a kid on that bus that was a bully and started targeting me. I put up with a lot because I was small, scared, and didn't really know how to fight back. One day I had had enough and when he said he wanted to fight me but I was going to be chicken again I said, "Yeah, I'll fight you." After we got off the bus we took a couple of swings at each other and ended up pretty much just wrestling around on the ground. It was the best decision I ever made. He knew I wasn't an easy target anymore and he left me alone.

I moved that next year and ended up starting at the new school in a bigger town a couple of weeks late. Of course that puts a big target on you - new kid, small, quiet, in the lowest grade at the school, and starting school late. It was a junior high with 7th through 9th grade in the same school. There was a group of 4 or 5 9th graders who picked me out and started bullying me every day at lunch. I put up with it for weeks. One day in one of my classes some kids around me were screwing around and the teacher held them and me after class and went absolutely ballistic on us. I probably wasn't totally innocent, but he also singled me out and yelled that he didn't know what I got away with in my old school but he wasn't going to put up with it in his classroom. Later that week when one of the 9th graders shoved me from behind I turned around and shoved him back then walked away. He and his cohorts followed me down the hall and the kid started wailing on me. I wasn't a fighter and was also afraid after the incident in class earlier that week that I was going to get kicked out of school if I was fighting in school so I just tried to defend myself without throwing any punches. I wish I hadn't. I ended up with a huge shiner but at least the kid got kicked out of school (again). I had to wear the shame of that shiner for a couple of weeks at school but those kids really didn't bother me much again. My bike which was my transportation to school since I lived a couple of miles away got vandalized at school soon after which I think one of them did but the physical stuff stopped for the most part.

Funny thing is I rarely ever got back to the towns where I first went to school but I saw that first kid at a park with his daughter probably 10 years after graduation. I talked to him for a couple of minutes but I'm not sure he even remembered our fight. I felt sorry for him, he never really got to do much with his life up to that point. He had a couple of older siblings who were trouble and he was pre-destined for it. He even had a nickname that everyone knew him by that probably put a trouble label on him before people even gave him a chance. As I think back on it it reminds me of the character Chris in Stand By Me. He was slotted as a bad kid due to his circumstances and his older brother being nothing but trouble. Some kids overcome that, most don't.

TLDR version: Sometimes kids need to stand up and show they aren't an easy mark, but that's not easy. My feeling is that kids shouldn't have to do that in kindergarten.
 

madguy30

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Both my first grader and kindergartner have made casual comments about people saying mean things, they go the before and after school care which consists of all the ages. A dead pan look back at a mean comment with a "Why are you saying that?" seems incredibly powerful. Make the bully question themselves, I like this a lot.

Like you said, I truly believe those who are bullying is projection of something unseen in their life not being so good or its pure jealousy on their part.

In some cases basically the person feels torn down and the only way out that they can immediately control is to tear it all down with them.

That doesn't excuse it, doesn't mean there shouldn't be some boundaries set for them etc., it's just how they're feeling.
 
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madguy30

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It depends a LOT on the individual kid - their ability to pay attention for most of an hour, and their desire to be there. In 15 years, I have probably had only two 5yo that were able, and a few 8-9yo that weren't ready. Our official cutoff is 7, but we have a a new 6yo right now that seems ok. If your kid can sit thru an hour of school without wandering off, or can play outfield a few innings without completely picking dandelions, they probably can start. Just be patient they might not test every time, learn at a slower rate to start.

Biggest thing is make sure your kid has fun - if they do, they will keep coming back and practice more, and grow into it. It takes time, and that requires desire to do it. No different than soccer, t-ball, et al.

The other thing I would mention is getting a good fit with the school. Some are very competition oriented, some are more boot-camp, some are more family friendly. e.g. we are very family friendly, but if we had a kid who wanted to do national competitions and really try to push their abilities, I would probably recommend a different school.

I'm a huge proponent of martial arts for kids, it helps so much with confidence, but also mental focus and of course physical coordination.

Same with nature based activities or anything that takes real time to learn, practice or perform.

The bully type could often also use this as an avenue.
 
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