Maybe some perspective

[gordocyclone]

If we had sustained success through the years I would agree with you. However, since we haven't had sustained success my perspective is we seem to get real close but never seem to get over the hump of being really good.

My perspective of being really good is once in while winning a conference championship in football! Hell, even Kansas has won a conference championship in football!

The lost to West Virginia has basically eliminated us from playing for a conference championship. We did not lose to West Virginia because of the officiating. We played horribly,especially the defense. That is the reason why we lost.

Through the years we always seem to get close to being really good but always fall short. It is frustrating and disappointing. Unfortunately, I believe we are the path to having some maybe decent seasons but never reaching the caliber
of a winning a conference championship.

 

[MartyFine]

If we had sustained success through the years I would agree with you. However, since we haven't had sustained success my perspective is we seem to get real close but never seem to get over the hump of being really good.

My perspective of being really good is once in while winning a conference championship in football! Hell, even Kansas has won a conference championship in football!

The lost to West Virginia has basically eliminated us from playing for a conference championship. We did not lose to West Virginia because of the officiating. We played horribly,especially the defense. That is the reason why we lost.

Through the years we always seem to get close to being really good but always fall short. It is frustrating and disappointing. Unfortunately, I believe we are the path to having some maybe decent seasons but never reaching the caliber
of a winning a conference championship.

 

[jsb]

If we had sustained success through the years I would agree with you. However, since we haven't had sustained success my perspective is we seem to get real close but never seem to get over the hump of being really good.

My perspective of being really good is once in while winning a conference championship in football! Hell, even Kansas has won a conference championship in football!

The lost to West Virginia has basically eliminated us from playing for a conference championship. We did not lose to West Virginia because of the officiating. We played horribly,especially the defense. That is the reason why we lost.

Through the years we always seem to get close to being really good but always fall short. It is frustrating and disappointing. Unfortunately, I believe we are the path to having some maybe decent seasons but never reaching the caliber
of a winning a conference championship.

But that's my point. We have NEVER had sustained success. The past 4 years have been the closest. It doesn't just happen most of the time.

 

[quasistellar]

Complete whiff on my point, but sure.

so what was the point then? You said you think we'll be alright, but history is pretty against that, compared to Clemson and Penn State. THEY'LL probably be alright, but at ISU it's pretty unlikely we'll have the same potential again soon.

I do believe we are trending up though.

 

[NorthCyd]

Unless a team is exceeding expectations fans in general are pissed, especially right after a loss. That's almost universally true. I bet there were people discussing if Saban should be fired after Bama lost to A&M. It's just the nature of fandom. You can't ask fans to be devoted and obsessed with their teams and not be emotional about the outcomes. People aren't wired that way. I'm not saying it excuses all fan behavior, and certainly some are worse than others, but it's not going to change.

 

[NWICY]

A win may make things feel a bit brighter. But for me the CG will not enter the picture again, even if it remains a mathematical possibility. This team is not CG worthy for whatever reason.

Meh we are every bit as much in the race as everyone not named OU. Has this season been disappointing sure, but historically this is still a pretty good team. We all believed into the hype more than we should have, but dreaming is what makes life fun.

 

[isufbcurt]

It's a fan board so the EMOness is expected but many people do take it to extremes.

 

[madguy30]

It's a fan board so the EMOness is expected but many people do take it to extremes.

Like saying it was the worst loss ever?

 

[Gunnerclone]

These are the glory years. Yet misery levels seems to be about the same as any other time. The Fiesta Bowl win will be a pinnacle hard to top, hopefully they do but if CMC leaves time to crawl into a hole and never come back out.

Fiesta Bowl***

 

[isufbcurt]

Like saying it was the worst loss ever?

Yeah and we won't make a bowl game.

 

[Jerms]

so what was the point then? You said you think we'll be alright, but history is pretty against that, compared to Clemson and Penn State. THEY'LL probably be alright, but at ISU it's pretty unlikely we'll have the same potential again soon.

I do believe we are trending up though.

I said it in the original post, and then jsb also touched on it. Sometimes **** happens. That doesn’t change the path we’re on. History doesn’t mean anything. We haven’t had the coaching, commitment from the AD, facilities, etc, etc that we have now. One loss does not mean everything is done forever. Sure we’ll lose a lot of players this year, but Campbell has recruited better, higher rated players since. We’ll be alright.

 

[cyclone1209]

I know we hate to have any perspective around here after a loss, but as I was replying to this comment I started to wonder.

I've read lots of similar comments to the one above after the West Virginia game. Some people think we won't win another game. One person literally thinks it was the worst loss in school history. Some are freaking out that teams have figured us out and the fact that we beat Oklahoma State means nothing. It's all very exhausting.

So I thought I'd go back and look at our conferences losses since 2017. I'm not taking into account non-conference losses (Iowa) because that is its own can of worms and frankly I don't give a **** if we lose to Iowa.

2017, we lost to:
Texas (was the Jacob Park game, so this one hardly counts, I don't think the Campbell era really started until the next week)-Texas finished the season with 7 wins
West Virginia-finished the season with 7 wins (and Kempt was hurt)
Oklahoma State-finished the season with 10 wins
Kansas State-finished the season with 8 wins (and that was the picked up flag game)

2018, we lost to:
Oklahoma-finished with 12 wins
TCU-finished with 7 wins (again this was a Zeb game, before Brock took over)
Texas-finished with 10 wins

2019, we lost to:
Baylor-finished with 11 wins
Oklahoma State-finished with 8 wins
Kansas State-finished with 8 wins
Oklahoma-finished with 12 wins

2020, we lost to:
Oklahoma State-finished with 8 wins (and played less than 12 games)
Oklahoma-finished with 9 wins (and played less than 12 games)

AND THAT IS IT. We aren't the team like CyBobby claims loses to 3 win teams any more. We just aren't. All of the teams that we lost to in that stretch made bowl games. Some weren't great teams, but they were all solid teams. Some of the time, we lost to those not-great teams for understandable reasons. And in all of those seasons (except for maybe 2019), we also managed to BEAT very good teams. We beat top 10 teams in Oklahoma and TCU and West Virginia and Oklahoma State. We beat ranked teams in Oklahoma and I think Texas Tech in 2017 and our nemesis Kansas State. And we ALWAYS beat the teams that we were clearly better than.

Saturday sucked. It sucked that it happened when the Big 12 championship was a big possibility. It sucked that it happened with this senior class that has brought us so much fun and success. But part off becoming a truly great program means that occasionally you are going to have a what the **** loss. You don't have those types of losses unless you are a program that expects to win.

I have no idea what will happen the rest of the way. Maybe the team is tired and kind of tosses the rest of the season. Maybe ******* West Virginia really did reveal how to beat us. Maybe we will win the next 4 and get to 9 wins. Or maybe it will be a mix.

But either way, this game was bound to happen at some point and I appreciate the fact that we've had so few of them over the last 5 years. Pretty damn cool if you ask me.

Well written post. If we look at our losses - Baylor, Iowa, and WVU. None of these teams are poor and Baylor and Iowa will make a really good bowl, those two in particular are not bad losses.

What's most disappointing this year is that we thought this could be another step forward, mainly because we returned EVERYTHING on both sides of the ball. It was an opp to make another NY 6 bowl. But what i've learned in CFB watching over the years is that sometimes your breakout season doesn't happen when you expect, and sometimes can occur when you don't expect it to.

Next year is going to show us a ton about our recruiting. Can we replace Brock, W McDonald, Anthony Johnson, Rose and others successfully. If our depth is for real and our recruiting has been solid, we shouldn't take a big step back. I see a lot of positives going into next year, including:
- an Offensive Line that is straight talented: Downing, Hufford, Simmons, and Remsburg and others will be good
- we have quality backs outside of Breece. Jirehl Brock has shown to be strong, and in mopup/garbage time Silas has actually looked dominant
- the backup linebackers like Gerry Vaughn, Aric Horne, Daeshawn Davis, Hunter Zenzen and others have all shown major promise (last weekend was an exception to that obviously)
- Hunter Dekkers looks like a Joel Lanning runner with a Jacob Park arm. I don't know how good he will be, but the physical tools are there, and I would argue special. How big of a jump can he make?

If I were Campbell and crew I would be actively scouting the transfer portal market for a DE, WR's, LB'ers, and a corner.

 

[t-noah]

I know we hate to have any perspective around here after a loss, but as I was replying to this comment I started to wonder.

I've read lots of similar comments to the one above after the West Virginia game. Some people think we won't win another game. One person literally thinks it was the worst loss in school history. Some are freaking out that teams have figured us out and the fact that we beat Oklahoma State means nothing. It's all very exhausting.

So I thought I'd go back and look at our conferences losses since 2017. I'm not taking into account non-conference losses (Iowa) because that is its own can of worms and frankly I don't give a **** if we lose to Iowa.

2017, we lost to:
Texas (was the Jacob Park game, so this one hardly counts, I don't think the Campbell era really started until the next week)-Texas finished the season with 7 wins
West Virginia-finished the season with 7 wins (and Kempt was hurt)
Oklahoma State-finished the season with 10 wins
Kansas State-finished the season with 8 wins (and that was the picked up flag game)

2018, we lost to:
Oklahoma-finished with 12 wins
TCU-finished with 7 wins (again this was a Zeb game, before Brock took over)
Texas-finished with 10 wins

2019, we lost to:
Baylor-finished with 11 wins
Oklahoma State-finished with 8 wins
Kansas State-finished with 8 wins
Oklahoma-finished with 12 wins

2020, we lost to:
Oklahoma State-finished with 8 wins (and played less than 12 games)
Oklahoma-finished with 9 wins (and played less than 12 games)

AND THAT IS IT. We aren't the team like CyBobby claims loses to 3 win teams any more. We just aren't. All of the teams that we lost to in that stretch made bowl games. Some weren't great teams, but they were all solid teams. Some of the time, we lost to those not-great teams for understandable reasons. And in all of those seasons (except for maybe 2019), we also managed to BEAT very good teams. We beat top 10 teams in Oklahoma and TCU and West Virginia and Oklahoma State. We beat ranked teams in Oklahoma and I think Texas Tech in 2017 and our nemesis Kansas State. And we ALWAYS beat the teams that we were clearly better than.

Saturday sucked. It sucked that it happened when the Big 12 championship was a big possibility. It sucked that it happened with this senior class that has brought us so much fun and success. But part off becoming a truly great program means that occasionally you are going to have a what the **** loss. You don't have those types of losses unless you are a program that expects to win.

I have no idea what will happen the rest of the way. Maybe the team is tired and kind of tosses the rest of the season. Maybe ******* West Virginia really did reveal how to beat us. Maybe we will win the next 4 and get to 9 wins. Or maybe it will be a mix.

But either way, this game was bound to happen at some point and I appreciate the fact that we've had so few of them over the last 5 years. Pretty damn cool if you ask me.

Not atypical fandom: horrible after a loss, worldbeaters after a good win.

 

[Thomasrickj]

*raises hand*
I don't think WV is that bad as they've been close in most games and put it together Saturday.

I'd guess they get at least two more wins and get into a bowl.

Let's see what Saturday brings.

I don't think WVU is terrible, but they are not a good offensive team. They have very good receivers, but Doege is not good at all and our defense let him walk all over us. That's what's so upsetting about this loss. I was at the game and was thinking "despite how poorly we've played, we're tied at the half. The defense and offense always tighten up at halftime so this should be one we can easily win." Instead we came out completely flat in the second half, defense looked awful, and we have an offensive line that can't do anything right this year.

 

[madguy30]

I don't think WVU is terrible, but they are not a good offensive team. They have very good receivers, but Doege is not good at all and our defense let him walk all over us. That's what's so upsetting about this loss. I was at the game and was thinking "despite how poorly we've played, we're tied at the half. The defense and offense always tighten up at halftime so this should be one we can easily win." Instead we came out completely flat in the second half, defense looked awful, and we have an offensive line that can't do anything right this year.

Yeah the 2nd half surprised me. I posted in the game thread that it looked like ISU was gaining some traction and I didn't think WV would be able to sustain things. Whiffed on that one.

ISU looked ragged and depleted on Saturday and for all we hear about depth etc. it was surprising.

 

[tolfbfan]

terrible comparison. PSU and Clemson can reload way easier.

We can reload just like those teams, our reloading will be with high three stars (exceptions noted) who have five star attitudes. I believe that is how it will always be. At least we hope it will.

 

[JM4CY]

Yeah the 2nd half surprised me. I posted in the game thread that it looked like ISU was gaining some traction and I didn't think WV would be able to sustain things. Whiffed on that one.

ISU looked ragged and depleted on Saturday and for all we hear about depth etc. it was surprising.

Woody talked about it on the FART that I don't think we really understand how great Rose is. There is no excuse for some of that piss poor pass coverage. But Rose is the lynchpin in many ways for how our defense works and why it is effective. Without the lynchpin, there are issues in how everything works. This was clearly on display Saturday. My thinking is that we REALLY need to be working to develop some of those other LB's for next year or we need to make some adjustments to our scheme. Or probably both.

 

[iowa_wildcat]

Kansas has never won the Big 12 Conference title in football. They have won one divisional title. Kansas last won a Big 8 football title in 1968.

 

[madguy30]

Woody talked about it on the FART that I don't think we really understand how great Rose is. There is no excuse for some of that piss poor pass coverage. But Rose is the lynchpin in many ways for how our defense works and why it is effective. Without the lynchpin, there are issues in how everything works. This was clearly on display Saturday. My thinking is that we REALLY need to be working to develop some of those other LB's for next year or we need to make some adjustments to our scheme. Or probably both.

Perhaps if Rose isn't back they have some more time to revamp things to help fill in the gaps with a better plan.