*****The Super, Mega, Huge Big 12 Expansion Thread*****

[Sammy11]

ND has zero interest in joining the Big 12. If Baylor wasn't being such a baby, aTm would already be gone and that alone would have greatly increased the likelihood of the Big 12 surviving. Now, their stupid legal threat generated additional uncertainty causing OU to take a more serious look at the PAC. If we're lucky, OU will come back from the ledge. If not, Baylor is in the biggest trouble of any schools currently worried about losing their conference position.

1- You school also declined to sign the waiver so pot meet kettle
2- If anything the additional time has given UT, ESPN, Fox, and the rest of us time to lobby OU with whatever we can about staying.
3- How does retaining a right to sue promote uncertainty? It does not. OU declaring it was looking around led to increased attention to the legal action, not the other way around.

 

[KidSilverhair]

ND has zero interest in joining the Big 12. If Baylor wasn't being such a baby, aTm would already be gone and that alone would have greatly increased the likelihood of the Big 12 surviving. Now, their stupid legal threat generated additional uncertainty causing OU to take a more serious look at the PAC. If we're lucky, OU will come back from the ledge. If not, Baylor is in the biggest trouble of any schools currently worried about losing their conference position.

Hold on, there, cowboy. You're blaming Baylor for this? Methinks you don't remember the sequence of events ...


In August, A&M announces its plans to move to the SEC. Much hand-wringing about everyone getting along, but the general feeling is the Big 12 could invite a new member (perhaps BYU) to replace the Aggies and go right along as a relatively stable (yes, I know, not terrifically stable but relatively) conference with a lucrative TV contract.

Friday, Sept. 2 - OU President Boren (freakin' leader of the search committee to find a replacement for A&M, you recall) says Oklahoma is weighing its options about jumping to a new conference, thereby shaking up the previous general feeling, creating a huge amount of uncertainty, and not really making it very likely that anyone (except SMU) would really want to join the conference.

Wednesday, Sept. 3 - SEC says it will accept A&M only after the legal hindrances are removed, which is apparently Baylor's threat (along with ISU and a couple of others) to keep its rights to pursue legal action should there be a financial hit to the school as the result of the conference shakeup.

Baylor isn't the one causing the Big 12 to look shaky. OU already made that mess when Boren opened his yap on September 2. If anything, Baylor's legal move is directed much more at the Sooners than the Aggies ... if OU would have been happy to stay, and moves were in play to add BYU or another strong team, Baylor wouldn't have put the brakes on the Aggies.

You can't seriously be blaming Baylor for this. Look at Norman instead.

 

[Testing123]

If [the SEC] take Mizzou, they would likely consider KU for the rivalry.

I don't doubt that the SEC wouldn't mind taking Kansas (especially given the options available), but I don't think Kansas wants to go to the SEC. I think that's by far their least-preferred option of the four presumed megaconferences. The only way the Jayhawks go there is if the ACC and Pac-12 go to 16 without them and the Big 10 states they're holding long-term at 12.

 

[swarthmoreCY]

The biggest wildcard is what ND does. Everyone says they will never join a conference. But if all the other teams are wrapped up in super conferences who are interested in playing members of the other superconferences (for TV revenue) ND may be jam. Who are they going to play? Who are they going to play that is significant enough for them to get enough revenue to keep up? They may join whether they want to or not.

The Big 12 (at least for everything but football)?
ND is not already in the Big 10 largely due to emotional reasons. If that ire for the Big 10 has been successfully passed on from previous generations of boosters, there is a chance.

 

[isuno1fan]

1- You school also declined to sign the waiver so pot meet kettle
2- If anything the additional time has given UT, ESPN, Fox, and the rest of us time to lobby OU with whatever we can about staying.
3- How does retaining a right to sue promote uncertainty? It does not. OU declaring it was looking around led to increased attention to the legal action, not the other way around.

He's an idiot for having that opinion. I applaud Baylor myself.

 

[oldwiseman]

I don't doubt that the SEC wouldn't mind taking Kansas (especially given the options available), but I don't think Kansas wants to go to the SEC. I think that's by far their least-preferred option of the four presumed megaconferences. The only way the Jayhawks go there is if the ACC and Pac-12 go to 16 without them and the Big 10 states they're holding long-term at 12.

KU to the SEC? Are you kidding? They may win a football game once every 5 yrs! They will NOT go to the SEC.

 

[Die4Cy]

My contention did not mention the other three conferences stopping at 14. It has nothing to do with an unbalanced league scheme. The Big 10 may prefer to wait until 2014, but only if they want last pick.


The ACC did not need to expand, they were stable, and had just redone their TV deal. The SEC is the most stable, and yet plans to expand. It is about market share (both TV sets and of the NCAA). The Pac-12 grabs the Texas market with programs like OU and UT. The SEC expands into Texas and perhaps another market. The ACC owns the entire east cost and part of the southeast. Look at the past decade of results for the Big 10- it needs new blood.

That assessment is incorrect. ACC was not in a stable situation. Meeting to adjust exit penalties, FSU announcement they were setting up a committee to address realignment, and their border with an SEC that has vowed to add a 14the team are proof of that. They were in a poach or be poached situation.

The SEC is very stable, and adding the Texas market is key. There is nothing like the Texas market available to the Big 10 when adding KU MU or ISU.

 

[fwiw]

ND has zero interest in joining the Big 12. If Baylor wasn't being such a baby, aTm would already be gone and that alone would have greatly increased the likelihood of the Big 12 surviving. Now, their stupid legal threat generated additional uncertainty causing OU to take a more serious look at the PAC. If we're lucky, OU will come back from the ledge. If not, Baylor is in the biggest trouble of any schools currently worried about losing their conference position.

Sorry, nice try, but OU is to blame for the current state. Boren opened his big mouth about looking at options, and that's what started the freakout. And they could stop it today if they wanted. If the B12 blows up, it's on his hands.

ISU also declined to waive our legal rights, so by that logic you would have to say that we are being "babies" too.

 

[Al_4_State]

I don't doubt that the SEC wouldn't mind taking Kansas (especially given the options available), but I don't think Kansas wants to go to the SEC. I think that's by far their least-preferred option of the four presumed megaconferences. The only way the Jayhawks go there is if the ACC and Pac-12 go to 16 without them and the Big 10 states they're holding long-term at 12.

If the Big 10 stays at 12 long term, it makes a Big 12/East merger a lot more viable. I think Kansas would rather compete than make a little more money and get slaughtered. Stability wouldn't really be an issue in that league.

 

[acgclone]

The threat of litigation is a straw man for OU et al to blame, when in fact they have been trying to go to the Pac 10 all along.

Why should OU care if Baylor/ISU threaten to sue A&M? They should be happy....UNLESS they want to leave the B12 as well.

 

[Testing123]

If the Big 10 stays at 12 long term, it makes a Big 12/East merger a lot more viable. I think Kansas would rather compete than make a little more money and get slaughtered. Stability wouldn't really be an issue in that league.

I tend to agree that Kansas is more likely to stay in the Big East/Big 12 than go to the SEC if that happens. But I think that's the only situation in which there's any possibility KU goes to the SEC.

That said, I'm not sure how stable that league would be if the SEC's at 14. The SEC could grab a couple ACC schools for 16, and ACC would probably poach a couple Big East/Big 12 schools to get back to 16.

 

[swarthmoreCY]

That assessment is incorrect. ACC was not in a stable situation. Meeting to adjust exit penalties, FSU announcement they were setting up a committee to address realignment, and their border with an SEC that has vowed to add a 14the team are proof of that. They were in a poach or be poached situation.

The SEC is very stable, and adding the Texas market is key. There is nothing like the Texas market available to the Big 10 when adding KU MU or ISU.

Bordering the SEC is proof that it was not stable? LOL. The SEC expanded first, before ACC. Which direction did they go again? I did not see an ACC team join. Did you?

The FSU committee? Again, the SEC expanded, and no ACC teams.
Hmm, perhaps FSU had their own expansion to worry about (see Pitt and Syracuse).

Adjusting exit fees is proof of nothing except having strong lawyers. Have you ever spent time in ACC country? They are very enthralled with each other.

 

[Stormin]

Baylor isn't to blame. It is all about the Texas schools and Oklahoma.

The crazy part of this whole thing is that if the Pac 16 comes to be that each school will get about $16 million each plus their 3rd tier rights. Texas will get to keep their LHN and if the revenue falls short of a 1/16 share of the Pac 16 rights then they will get the higher value of the two.

So Oklahoma's argument about the LHN is just a bunch of BS.

I say we get the $100 million plus from the schools leaving and take the teams we want from the BE football conference. We would have the contract signed for Tier 2 plus the remaining contract for another for years. That is $150 million split amongst the 10 to 12 teams you get.

One thing to remember is that these mega-conferences will cannibalize themselves. It ALWAYS happens that way. There are always 2 or 3 teams in each conference that rise to the top. Face it. That is HOW teams like BSU and TCU can rise from their weak conferences and gain a BCS Bowl. BYU did the same thing in the '80's and won a NC and the toughest game they played was a mediocre Michigan team in a mediocre bowl.

ISU, KU, KSU, Mizzou, Baylor, TCU, Louisville, Cincinatti, South Florida, plus another 1 to 3 schools would not be that bad of a conference. It would not have the heavyweight team. But the former Big East didn't either and it was an AQ conference. And ALL are BCS conference schools so I doubt that the league would lose AQ status.

Take the exit fees, keep the Big XII name and the contracts, and ride the storm out.

 

[Pseudonym]

Does anybody know anything about the exit fees and disbanding the conference? In terms of, do schools still get a vote if they've already told us they're leaving(texas a&m)? What happens if this blows up the league, and theres no league left to collect the exit fees?

My guess if there are 10 teams still allowed to vote, you'd need 6 to disband the conference, if there are 9 voting, you'd need 5.

 

[BCClone]

So are we at least all calmed down now that worst case is a 12/east combo. While not sexy, a decent base. No more of this mvc or Mac crap.

IMO, we will be in the big XII for nezt year and on.

 

[State43]

Man there is gonna be a lot of lawsuits when this is all said and done.

 

[Al_4_State]

I tend to agree that Kansas is more likely to stay in the Big East/Big 12 than go to the SEC if that happens. But I think that's the only situation in which there's any possibility KU goes to the SEC.

That said, I'm not sure how stable that league would be if the SEC's at 14. The SEC could grab a couple ACC schools for 16, and ACC would probably poach a couple Big East/Big 12 schools to get back to 16.

I don't think the SEC gets an ACC schools. They're stable.

I think the SEC will take either WVU or Missouri to get to 14. Further expansion would come from the Big 10, and that would likely include us, Mizzou, and KU.

I think KU and Mizzou would both be more likely to bide their team in a Big 12/East merger either running their own show, or waiting for a Big 10 call up.

 

[NobodyBeatsCy]

Commish of the ACC will be on this radio show at the top of the hour 10 AM Central, and then Chip Brown at 10:30 - FYI

Sports Radio 790 The Zone|Listen Live

 

[BCClone]

Just got a tweet from a source. Bad news!!! UT and OU are moving. They are so enthralled with the west coast that they are literally moving the universities to Cali. One to San Diego and other LA not sure which one where though.

 

[isuno1fan]

I don't think the SEC gets an ACC schools. They're stable.

I think the SEC will take either WVU or Missouri to get to 14. Further expansion would come from the Big 10, and that would likely include us, Mizzou, and KU.

I think KU and Mizzou would both be more likely to bide their team in a Big 12/East merger either running their own show, or waiting for a Big 10 call up.

How much would it suck if the B10 decided to go to 14 and picked up Mizzou and KU. We would be in the middle of everything B10 without a place at the table. I might have to move if that happened.