Two Things Can Be True...Yet Seem Contradictory

[Cyclonepride]

Like, I'm reading on here most every day but post once or twice a year. Or this forum has what some would call "Sunshine Pumpers" who are just happy we are out of the Prohm days and winning more than 2 games and trust TJ implicitly. And there are those who are "cliff jumpers" after every loss, and never see the positives. Here are my two things can be true:

• There are very few coaches in the country who could've had the success TJ has had these past two years with the talent he has had. TJ may also be the worst "In-game" coach in the Big 12.
• TJ's philosophy of playing to your daily habits is inherently true. You play like you practice. Yet if you play 100% as hard in practice, every day, as you do in games, then inevitably in the dog days of February the team will hit a wall with dead legs.
• TJ knows his personnel, attitudes, etc... better than anyone and should sub accordingly. Yet subbing by time (at the 17 minute mark of every game for example) is not a coach who has a feel for the game. Coaches sub, because of mistakes, or as an adjustment, or injuries, or a player is exhausted after 3 minutes. Not time.
• Coaches may have the team practicing free-throws every day, yet still be bad in the games.
• Teams can struggle down the stretch of a season and still make a run in the tournament.

Oddly, last night gave me hope. We played hard, seemed to be getting our legs back, and played a very good and desperate WVU team toe to toe. I don't expect much the next 2 games (Baylor & Big 12 Tourney), but I think we are gonna be a hard out in the NCAA Tourney. Two things can be true.

I agree completely. I think that maybe this team maxed out their potential early, and have struggled to maintain that level of play (which is understandable given the high floor of Big 12 teams this year). I would love to see them have a little success before the tournament, but if they don't, I don't think it automatically means that they will be one and done in the tournament.

 

[BCClone]

I wouldn't be so certain. My belief (hope) is that TJ is 100% defense first last season, and this season, because he knows they don't have the offensive fire power. He absolutely tried to get AJ Green, who would not have been good defensively, but a guaranteed upgrade in offense, so he was willing to adapt to what he would have had.

As it is, Green didn't come, and TJ saw that offense might be lacking, so he basically decided to "run it back" from what worked last season. I do think the staff thought they had more offense coming in the post from Osun, and they have run more thru him, but I don't think it's been as much as they hoped.

It certainly helps that the best recruit, Bilew, is also supposed to be very aggressive, and good on defense. Milan is going to be the real barometer. I think he might be closer to a Niang than a Hogue defensively. So we'll see if TJ is willing to stay with him for his offense, despite some lapses on defense.

And that kinda fits my one fresh will play a lot, one will be spot and two will be bench years next year. We need major portal help then.

 

[Malty Flannel]

I agree TJ has done a great job bringing us back to relevance. Back-to-back tournaments (I think...?) with where we were with Prohm is nothing short of a miracle.

I think my greatest frustration is not addressing our offensive issues. We lost our two best scorers from last year's team and we replaced them with a shot blocker (Shoon), three freshman that can't shoot, a good defender with no offensive game (Ward) and two guards who came into the year with bad jumpshooting numbers (Williams and Holmes). He just placed absolutely no priority on getting guys who could score.

I appreciate an emphasis on defense, but we have so much redundancy on our roster. I can understand valuing length and athleticism, but someone has to put the ball in the basket and that was just completely ignored this offseason.

Hey placed priority on AJ Green and missed out

 

[Die4Cy]

I was cool with the praise the team was earning in December and January so I don't have any problem with hard critiques of how things are going now. Probably just me though.

 

[Clonefan32]

Hey placed priority on AJ Green and missed out

And that's fine, but we had plenty of scholarships to give out and there just wasn't an emphasis placed on scoring.

 

[Jayshellberg]

Some have suggested that TJ did not prioritize getting a scorer this off-season. Actually, TJ offered scholarships to several scorers, including AJ Green, Grant Basile, and Baylor Scheierman. Any one of the three would have been a difference maker. Unfortunately, Green decided to go pro and Basile and Scheierman sought out NIL money. To insinuate that TJ did not emphasize offense during the off-season is just plain wrong. He just struck out on the players he tried to get.

 

[CloniesForLife]

Some have suggested that TJ did not prioritize getting a scorer this off-season. Actually, TJ offered scholarships to several scorers, including AJ Green, Grant Basile, and Baylor Scheierman. Any one of the three would have been a difference maker. Unfortunately, Green decided to go pro and Basile and Scheierman sought out NIL money. To insinuate that TJ did not emphasize offense during the off-season is just plain wrong. He just struck out on the players he tried to get.

Everyone acting like TJ is totally unaware we need offense is hilarious. I'm sure TJ is well aware we need to get better offensive players. He's not a ******* idiot and it's extremely obvious. He's definitely going to try and bring our offense up while trying to maintain a good to great defense. Whether or not he can do it we will see but to act like he just isn't or hasn't tried to improve our offensive players is silly.

 

[GetAwesome]

I'm surprised by this assessment. I think that Ward was pretty clearly a good individual defender across the board; he's probably the best big man at switching onto guards. His status as a team defender, though, might still be in question. For offense, his numbers are efficient, but that's only because most of his touches came on dunks or offensive rebounds. If he were asked to do the same thing that Osun or Jones do, he wouldn't have close to the same efficiency numbers.

My assessment was entirely predicated on the minutes he's been given, which is basically zero the past month. So none of us have a great idea of where his strengths lie if given extended minutes.

And yeah, the minutes he did play early in conference play resulted in a lot of efficient touches around the rim, which means he is doing exactly what a big man is supposed to do. You can't discredit the importance of that efficiency, especially when we have the other backup big who gets a lot of minutes who is pretty atrocious around the rim.

 

[CyNews]

Like, I'm reading on here most every day but post once or twice a year. Or this forum has what some would call "Sunshine Pumpers" who are just happy we are out of the Prohm days and winning more than 2 games and trust TJ implicitly. And there are those who are "cliff jumpers" after every loss, and never see the positives. Here are my two things can be true:

• There are very few coaches in the country who could've had the success TJ has had these past two years with the talent he has had. TJ may also be the worst "In-game" coach in the Big 12.
• TJ's philosophy of playing to your daily habits is inherently true. You play like you practice. Yet if you play 100% as hard in practice, every day, as you do in games, then inevitably in the dog days of February the team will hit a wall with dead legs.
• TJ knows his personnel, attitudes, etc... better than anyone and should sub accordingly. Yet subbing by time (at the 17 minute mark of every game for example) is not a coach who has a feel for the game. Coaches sub, because of mistakes, or as an adjustment, or injuries, or a player is exhausted after 3 minutes. Not time.
• Coaches may have the team practicing free-throws every day, yet still be bad in the games.
• Teams can struggle down the stretch of a season and still make a run in the tournament.

Oddly, last night gave me hope. We played hard, seemed to be getting our legs back, and played a very good and desperate WVU team toe to toe. I don't expect much the next 2 games (Baylor & Big 12 Tourney), but I think we are gonna be a hard out in the NCAA Tourney. Two things can be true.

A tough rebuild but TJ has done it. Progress is painful.

 

[MJ271]

My assessment was entirely predicated on the minutes he's been given, which is basically zero the past month. So none of us have a great idea of where his strengths lie if given extended minutes.

And yeah, the minutes he did play early in conference play resulted in a lot of efficient touches around the rim, which means he is doing exactly what a big man is supposed to do. You can't discredit the importance of that efficiency, especially when we have the other backup big who gets a lot of minutes who is pretty atrocious around the rim.

Per Barttorvik, 31 of Ward's 39 2-point attempts have been at the rim, while 84 of Jones's 152 attempts have been at the rim (I assume many post shots aren't counted officially as "at the rim"). Maybe you can credit that to Ward being better at finding open spaces to get to the rim for an easy shot, but I think most of it is simply due to Ward never posting up and rarely being asked to hold the ball for longer than it takes to dunk it, lay it in, or pass it on the perimeter. I'd also venture to guess that Ward's shots around the rim have been a lot more open, on average, than Jones's have.

Whether Jones should be taking that many post shots is a different discussion, but I'm just saying that if Ward were asked to do that, it would greatly lower his efficiency numbers, because I don't think he's capable of doing it at even Jones's level (as of right now).

I actually do think that Ward should have gotten some minutes in this losing stretch, but only in a press/havoc defense mode, because he can't be expected to do the same things that Osun and Jones do.

 

[cyclonehomer]

Wasn't Eli supposed to be the shooter? Not saying he should play, but just thinking he was supposed to be our shooter. I know it doesn't help, but kinda supports your point that we didn't mix our HS and portal recruiting very well together.

As far as I know, there wasn't really much reason to believe he'd be a shooter. Watson was the best of the bunch at it, but yeah, King and Lipsey both primarily did their damage in highschool from inside the arc.

 

[SouthJerseyCy]

And that kinda fits my one fresh will play a lot, one will be spot and two will be bench years next year. We need major portal help then.

I already can't understand some of the things TJ does personnel-wise but if Omaha and Milan are not both playing a ton, then I might really lose it.

 

[t-noah]

I'm happy with what TJ has done the past two years. At the same time I would like to see the bench players play more.

I can understand less use of the bench during conference play, sure, to a degree. But during the noncon games, or games where we are losing or winning big, I guess I don't understand it. Now we may be paying for it with tired legs. And why not reward all the players on the team, more often, through playing time?

We shouldn't expect too much from the freshmen, consistently through next year. They will be freshman. I do hope he plays Hamilton significant minutes (I think he will), and Fish as well. All of them will need playing time and experience. We will also need transfer help.

 

[Malty Flannel]

I already can't understand some of the things TJ does personnel-wise but if Omaha and Milan are not both playing a ton, then I might really lose it.

I think you could safely pencil both in as starters next year.

Maybe I'm just grasping for any optimism, but compare Milan's 247 profile with Grady ****'s. Different positions, but almost identical ranking, grading, and written report. Milan could easily be our leading scorer next year

 

[cycjob]

When Holmes and kalscheur were hot and grill was playing better we were good. They are not now and we are still decent. Great thing about basketball is they can get hot again and our defense will still be there.

Very true. In January, we were one of the best teams in the conference. In February, I don't see any way not to classify the Clones as easily the worst team in the conference. Same players. Hot streak in the beginning and as last year in the 2nd half of the season, everyone had us figured out. Based on their current play alone it would be hard to say they are a tournament worthy team.

 

[cyclonehomer]

I think you could safely pencil both in as starters next year.

Maybe I'm just grasping for any optimism, but compare Milan's 247 profile with Grady ****'s. Different positions, but almost identical ranking, grading, and written report. Milan could easily be our leading scorer next year

I been trying to tell people Milan is nearly as big of an outlier as Omaha for ISU recruiting history. He'd probably be the most talented player offensively on the roster if he stepped on the court against Baylor.

No guarantees but I'd be very surprised if Milan and Omaha don't both play huge roles next year. If the talent level is really as low as people say it is this year, I don't see how they aren't starting from day 1.

 

[heitclone]

I agree completely. I think that maybe this team maxed out their potential early, and have struggled to maintain that level of play (which is understandable given the high floor of Big 12 teams this year). I would love to see them have a little success before the tournament, but if they don't, I don't think it automatically means that they will be one and done in the tournament.

The thing that contradicts this is the injury and lineup restructure. We were pretty average in the non con, bc of an injury we retooled the lineup and rotation, then went on to play our best bball of the season. The dropoff came when the injured player came back and we trashed the rotation we had been wildly successful with and went back to what had made us average in the non con. The group that was playing well didn't burn out, they were replaced before they ever had a chance to burnout.

 

[madguy30]

If Milan is like Grady I can be OK with a guy just running around getting buckets.

 

[Marcelason78]

I think you could safely pencil both in as starters next year.

Maybe I'm just grasping for any optimism, but compare Milan's 247 profile with Grady ****'s. Different positions, but almost identical ranking, grading, and written report. Milan could easily be our leading scorer next year

Agree. So we’ve got Omaha, Milan, Tamin, Caleb, and who’s our fifth?

 

[CyBobby]

And that's fine, but we had plenty of scholarships to give out and there just wasn't an emphasis placed on scoring.

An Old Sage said one time..."The team that makes the most baskets always wins!!"
You can have the best defense and still lose a bunch of games!