Williams & Blum: The Monday after

[nhclone]

He’s not being an ass. He’s pointing out how idiotic is to resort to claiming false authority in this discussion

He is being an ass, he's always being an ass.

 

[Jeffreyisu]

Yeah, but what could is clawing your way up to a 3 seed if the team is too beat up and gassed by March to capitalize on it?

Great point. Does mean our strength and conditioning program needs to be adjusted to prepare guys better to not be go gassed by March? I don't know, just a thought.

 

[Cyclonepride]

Basketball, like most sports, comes down to playing the actual game.

Many of us sound like getting trounced by them was inevitable, but I think we could have won if we played them again.

What would we be saying if we had won the Mississippi game? I suspect that it would be a much different tone.

Yep, if we had nailed 2 or 3 of the first 5 three pointers that we took once they started helping inside aggressively, they would have had to pick their poison.

Our system allows the open shots that we want the opponent to take and defends the crap out of the shots we don't. Once a team gets cold, even the great opportunities don't go down, but they were hitting the bad but open threes and also hitting the heavily guarded prayers. Once that happened, they got a lot of confidence and became a team of snipers all of a sudden.

 

[rochclone]

No one is saying that the hype wasn't realistic. But part of that hype is people aren't always rationale. So when the injuries and illness hit, it's easy to not take that into account. This site is Cyclone FANATIC. Fanatics aren't always logical. And as soon as we started losing a few games, the talk was kind of "how stupid are the fans that expect them to be a Final 4 team?"

I don’t ever remember anyone saying the fans were stupid for thinking this team was Final 4 caliber in mid-January. I think expecting a Final 4 is the dumbest sh.t in the world. How can you expect something that hasn’t happened in our lifetimes. That is stupid.

But people start saying Brent and Chris should apologize for hyping this team…. what wasn’t there to like in mid-January? The answer was absolutely nothing.

 

[rochclone]

Craziest thing I heard from this entire pod was in regards to Jameel McKay.

The craziest thing is thinking about Monte, Naz, Niang and McKay being forced to sit in a prayer circle with Prohm.

 

[ClonesFTW]

I can't help but look back at Keshon's quote about how we lost to Arizona potentially affecting whether the team will come together or start pointing fingers; went 8-7 afterwards.

 

[Dgilbertson]

The amount of "TJ can do no wrong" on this forum is wild.

He can. And he’s had unmatched success in very short order while starting completely over from near zero.

So there’s a bit of a leash.

Think it’s considered having perspective.

 

[CycloneSpinning]

There’s a lot here that’s kind of new/not easy to navigate.

Reasonable people have always said it’s not fair to student athletes to ask/say some of the things that were said about Gilbert…Jackson to some extent…even others. They’re kids…and they don’t get paid.

But now they do get paid…and sometimes more than we do (for some of us maybe even a lot more). So now is it fair?

But maybe it’s not smart…because we could have cost ourselves an extra $200k (or whatever) in NIL by speaking out…and maybe we lost a guy. But if you’re getting paid and you like playing in front of a passionate fanbase, do you need to just deal with that? You probably have to in the NBA…

And we had hopes/expectations that weren’t met. Some of it might have been because guys just got injured. That’s life/sports. There could be load management issues. Maybe if TJ plays the 10/11…you have better bench development/engagement…and fewer injuries. Maybe not. Are we allowed to ask those questions? Do we scare away our players or coach…or cost ourselves more NIL money by being fans/asking questions?

Fans no doubt have to be respectful…and we shouldn’t assume what we say has no consequences anymore than we would making comments in other area of life. I suspect though that players are going to need to toughen up a bit and show some discretion on whether they go online and read comment boards. That’s just a good life skill that they’re going to need going forward…and while perhaps it’s not fair for fans to get after a guy (especially when there are always things we don’t know), it’s also not fair for a player to perhaps collect hundreds of thousands of dollars and not hold himself accountable for doing what he needs to do to physical and mentally find a way to finish a season. Is that fair for a 20 year old? Probably not. But it also doesn’t make the most sense that they’re making the kind of money they are…yet that’s where we find ourselves.

Oh - and I don’t hold Chris or Brent accountable for expectations anymore than I do my friends. They’re fans with a a microphone. I’m sure they feel a responsibility as professionals…but I listen because I enjoy their opinions/it’s entertaining. They’re good at talking.

Probably should have listened to the podcast before writing this. Chris and aren’t basically said the same thing but better…

 

[Clonefan32]

I can't help but look back at Keshon's quote about how we lost to Arizona potentially affecting whether the team will come together or start pointing fingers; went 8-7 afterwards.

It's time for the Arizona thing to be laid to rest. If a loss 2 months prior is still effecting the team in March then we were in trouble anyway...

 

[goody2012]

Oh come on. We are all (assuming majority of us) are adults. You can choose what you want to believe or not believe or what disappoints you and what doesn’t.

Not singling you out but a handful of people have posted similar comments about being misled and pumped with optimism. I will NEVER understand why people take two podcasters opinions as fact and gospel and if it doesn’t come true then they are the bad guys.

I said after the Marquette game this team could win a national championship..why don’t people come after me? I was wrong.

They're a podcaster with inside knowledge and good friends with the coach, and the other is the bag man for the program. It's not just a couple of random guys.

 

[NoCreativity]

Now take a couple of seeding spots away and Iowa State could have ended up getting bounced in the Round of 64. Just imagine, this board, if this team would have been bounced in the Round of 64.

It wouldn't have mattered either way. It was obvious once the Keshon news was finalized that this team wouldn't go very far.

Let's be honest, a majority of us were holding out hope he'd just rest for 8 or 9 days and be good to go for the tournament. Same with Lipsey. Those were both longshots to happen and once it was confirmed you'd have to be completely out of touch to still think this team had potential for a deep run.

 

[ClonesFTW]

It's time for the Arizona thing to be laid to rest. If a loss 2 months prior is still effecting the team in March then we were in trouble anyway...

I mean yes, it's water under the bridge but this whole thread is discussing what happened this season. It was one of the more notable events that happened.

 

[Jeffreyisu]

There’s a lot here that’s kind of new/not easy to navigate.

Reasonable people have always said it’s not fair to student athletes to ask/say some of the things that were said about Gilbert…Jackson to some extent…even others. They’re kids…and they don’t get paid.

But now they do get paid…and sometimes more than we do (for some of us maybe even a lot more). So now is it fair?

But maybe it’s not smart…because we could have cost ourselves an extra $200k (or whatever) in NIL by speaking out…and maybe we lost a guy. But if you’re getting paid and you like playing in front of a passionate fanbase, do you need to just deal with that? You probably have to in the NBA…

And we had hopes/expectations that weren’t met. Some of it might have been because guys just got injured. That’s life/sports. There could be load management issues. Maybe if TJ plays the 10/11…you have better bench development/engagement…and fewer injuries. Maybe not. Are we allowed to ask those questions? Do we scare away our players or coach…or cost ourselves more NIL money by being fans/asking questions?

Fans no doubt have to be respectful…and we shouldn’t assume what we say has no consequences anymore than we would making comments in other area of life. I suspect though that players are going to need to toughen up a bit and show some discretion on whether they go online and read comment boards. That’s just a good life skill that they’re going to need going forward…and while perhaps it’s not fair for fans to get after a guy (especially when there are always things we don’t know), it’s also not fair for a player to perhaps collect hundreds of thousands of dollars and not hold himself accountable for doing what he needs to do to physical and mentally find a way to finish a season. Is that fair for a 20 year old? Probably not. But it also doesn’t make the most sense that they’re making the kind of money they are…yet that’s where we find ourselves.

Oh - and I don’t hold Chris or Brent accountable for expectations anymore than I do my friends. They’re fans with a a microphone. I’m sure they feel a responsibility as professionals…but I listen because I enjoy their opinions/it’s entertaining. They’re good at talking.

Well said.

 

[CapnCy]

If Jefferson hits both free throws at the end of regulation against Arizona- Iowa State gets the double bye.

Yeah, i was going to say the same in terms of SOME of the drop off wasn't due to injuries. The reality is we might have truly just been a mid big 12 team this year.....sure, we were #2 and had Auburn on the ropes...but we didn't finish them off. The K-State home loss still is a "WTF" type of deal.

 

[madguy30]

Not scoring for about eight minutes in the first half and trailing the entire game is simply flinching....interesting assessment.

Your takes are the best takes.

 

[Cyclonepride]

I mean yes, it's water under the bridge but this whole thread is discussing what happened this season. It was one of the more notable events that happened.

That loss and the way it happened definitely marked a shift in momentum and confidence (though I think Keshon's comment was what most players would say in that place), though I think it was obviously combined with injuries and wear and tear starting to take their toll too.

 

[ClubCy]

They're a podcaster with inside knowledge and good friends with the coach, and the other is the bag man for the program. It's not just a couple of random guys.

So those things shoud lead to anger and feeling misled by fans because they were rightfully optimistic and had high hopes?

As I said in my post people have right to choose what opinions they listen to and don’t listen to. People are angry and feel betrayed at podcasters because we’re “leading the charge” and had high optimism about the team and in the end the team didn’t ultimately meet those heights. Boo hoo.

My advice for anyone feeling that way grow up or find some new people to listen to.

 

[Dgilbertson]

It'd be nice if this podcast could at least acknowledge the role they played in leading the charge on the hype/expectations all last offseason and during the hot start at the beginning of the season. To now listen to them discuss all that in the passive voice, as if they were just witnesses to it rather than primary contributors, is disappointing.

It isn't their fault that the team didn't meet expectations, but we were wildly misled on the team's depth and development.

This wasn’t a bill of good situation. The team started hot. Heise took a bit to come on despite what they were seeing at practice. Were ranked in top ten nearly all season. Injuries happened and the pistons didn’t fire at the right time as a result.

 

[VeloClone]

Iowa State started 17-2 and was ranked #2. I guess I don’t see how we were primary contributors to that hype/expectation. Appreciate the feedback.

You shouldn't have made them win so many games.

 

[goody2012]

So those things shoud lead to anger and feeling misled by fans because they were rightfully optimistic and had high hopes?

As I said in my post people have right to choose what opinions they listen to and don’t listen to. People are angry and feel betrayed at podcasters because we’re “leading the charge” and had high optimism about the team and in the end the team didn’t ultimately meet those heights. Boo hoo.

My advice for anyone feeling that way grow up or find some new people to listen to.

Absolutely!