Yeah it's pretty well documented that Fran didn't do sh!t for the Murrays development wise. That was all done outside Iowa City, just like Garza.
Tough day for EIU hoops hopes
- Thread starter MuskieCy
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Yeah it's pretty well documented that Fran didn't do sh!t for the Murrays development wise. That was all done outside Iowa City, just like Garza.
Just great that the head coach gets zero credit for the Murray's and Garza. That is unreal to me. Every basketball player gets outside help nowadays, but the head coach still deserves some credit at the same time.
I think you have to give Fran credit for being a good offensive coach. His teams are always good in transition (even with a bunch of athletically-challenged white guys) and they run good half court stuff. The thing that’s been amazing for Fran is the number of legacies and local kids that he’s been able to rely on to stay afloat. That luck seems to have run out so if Fran can stay in the upper half of the Big 10 the next 3-4 years then he’s better than we think, else the conference is much worse than we think. I think his recruiting deficiencies are about to be exposed, finally.
He gets credit for them IMO. Like you said, everybody works with outside people. How much of that is his development, or just making a great read in recruiting, I don't know. He also gets credit for guys like Mulvey, Ogundele, Joe T, and others that don't appear to have developed under him at all. Like with all coaches he wears it all.
The criticism of Fran seems totally misdirected. His recruiting isn't an issue. The kids fit what he wants to do on the offensive end.
The problem with Fran is similar to Prohm, they can ONLY win one way- they need to put up big points. Would be curious to see data on Fran's win % where Iowa scores: < 65, 66-75, 76-85 & 85+.
Good coaches find ways to win if they score 65 or 85. Because their teams can defend, rebound, be physical, etc.
The problem with Fran is similar to Prohm, they can ONLY win one way- they need to put up big points. Would be curious to see data on Fran's win % where Iowa scores: < 65, 66-75, 76-85 & 85+.
Good coaches find ways to win if they score 65 or 85. Because their teams can defend, rebound, be physical, etc.
They showed Kris’s ppg freshman year on the draft coverage and it’s insane Fran played his kids instead those first two years.
He very obviously slow rolled both of them or you’d have had 3 total seasons instead of 5 total.
It's unreal Patrick started over Kris. It made literally zero sense. Kris is / was better in every facet.
At this point you could make a list of guys. He gets credit for his record at this point. He's 64, he's been at Iowa for 13 years, and he hasn't advanced further than Wayne Morgan did in the tourney. Individual players really aren't important at this juncture.
Franny gets zero credit….Garza and his dad had to go else to improve, Murray’s had to go prep school…arranged by dad and personal BB trainers to help them. The prep school year did more than Franny ever did…
Frann is an idiot….. iahawks is a close 2nd behind fran
Frann is an idiot….. iahawks is a close 2nd behind fran
Only importance of them is he’s had some insane talent and has one piece of hardware to show for it.
I'll give Fran credit for getting Garza to Iowa City as he actually had other major offers. The Murray twins? LOL no. There's zero chance Fran throws a hail mary at those two without the Iowa connection. They didn't develop because of Fran, they developed because their dad invested a sh!t ton of money into their training and it paid off.
Several facts:
-The Murray’s were 6’5” and 6’4” when they graduated from Prairie- when they arrived in IC roughly 14 months later they had grown about 4 inches- Fran had nothing to do with that but it did enhance their development/draft status
-Give Fran credit for player development if you want…but then he’s a terrible game prep coach/in game coach because, bottom line, he hasn’t made it past the first Sunday of the tournament in 13 years, nor has he won a regular season title. Yes, he has a conference tourney title but his path was clearly made easier based on how that weekend played out
-His strength is his offensive coaching- he has great actions that put his best scorers in their best spots, he has great counters to these actions, and his teams execute them well. But his refusal to address the other end of the floor AT ALL more than diffuses the offensive efficiency, especially on the road and in March where defense is required
-The Big 10 of Fran’s era is nowhere near the Big 10 of 1975-2000
-Fran is exactly what opponents’ fanbases want him to be- good enough to keep his job but not really good enough to ever win anything of consequence at a consistent level. Time will tell if he can coexist with a new AD and if people will wear out on the Fran/Margaret schtick- one thing is for certain- he ain’t changing.
-The Murray’s were 6’5” and 6’4” when they graduated from Prairie- when they arrived in IC roughly 14 months later they had grown about 4 inches- Fran had nothing to do with that but it did enhance their development/draft status
-Give Fran credit for player development if you want…but then he’s a terrible game prep coach/in game coach because, bottom line, he hasn’t made it past the first Sunday of the tournament in 13 years, nor has he won a regular season title. Yes, he has a conference tourney title but his path was clearly made easier based on how that weekend played out
-His strength is his offensive coaching- he has great actions that put his best scorers in their best spots, he has great counters to these actions, and his teams execute them well. But his refusal to address the other end of the floor AT ALL more than diffuses the offensive efficiency, especially on the road and in March where defense is required
-The Big 10 of Fran’s era is nowhere near the Big 10 of 1975-2000
-Fran is exactly what opponents’ fanbases want him to be- good enough to keep his job but not really good enough to ever win anything of consequence at a consistent level. Time will tell if he can coexist with a new AD and if people will wear out on the Fran/Margaret schtick- one thing is for certain- he ain’t changing.
Fran was waiting for that credit. Take another drink of BudLight
There’s a lot of evidence he purposefully slowed down the Murray development x2.
Garza is the example of a guy developing from a project into a star.
Anyone in a D1 program for 15 years is going to improve his dribbling
I think he has a map of Iowa hanging in his office labeled recruits. He noticed this area on the map that is spill over and asked what it was so he added Moline to the potential areas.
I started at the 2012-13 season (most of Lick's recruits were gone). Here are the totals from 2012-2023: Total W-L = 223-139
Less than 50pts = 0-4
50-59 = 3-18
60-69 = 19-46
70-79 = 70-44 (he is only 50% since 2016-17 season)
80-89 = 76-20
90+ = 55-7
22 TOTAL WINS when scoring less than 70 points.
I then did the same for Iowa State (again, starting at the 2012-13 season). I also broke down our 3 coaches' totals.
Total W-L = 215-149 (CFH= 76-29; CSP= 98-94; Otz= 41-26)
Less than 50pts = 1-6 (H= N/A; P=0-1; Otz= 1-5)
50-59 = 6-29 (H=0-2; P= 2-18; Otz= 4-9)
60-69 = 23-40 (H=5-5; P= 9-26; Otz= 9-9)
70-79 = 67-59 (H=20-16; P= 31-40; Otz= 16-3)
80-89 = 81-12 (H= 35-5; P= 35-7; Otz= 11-0)
90+ = 37-3 (H= 16-1; P= 21-2; Otz= N/A)
30 TOTAL WINS when scoring less than 70 points. (Only 2 of those wins came during Prohm's final TWO years). Still, although we have had 8 fewer total wins than Iowa, we have 8 more wins than they do when scoring less than 70 points.
