Is ISU better off going to a Pro-style offense?

[Win5002]

I'm not sure the answer but I wonder if ISU is better off going with a pro-style offense that can run the ball and set up the play action. I doubt ISU is ever going to have the athletes to be better at the spread than the rest of the conference. This would also create a different scheme for most teams to try and defend that they do almost every other week in this league.

The argument to this I can imagine is kids are not going to want to come play for ISU because everyone else plays the spread, but the fact is we have to field a team for the most part with the leftovers from everyone else anyway. Some people hate to hear that but its the fact. We will always lag the 6 Texahoma schools for kids in Texas, and while its nice we get kids out of Florida we are getting kids that have been picked over for the most part.


Watching ISU football is kind of like understanding par in golf, if you don't understand what par is it really causes a lot of frustration as a fan. Maybe we should just be glad we are in a BCS conference so we have a BCS league for Hoiberg and basketball to compete in. I'm not down on Coach Rhoads either I think he is a good coach. Its very tough to win in this situation, and frankly most coaches wouldn't do any better, it probably takes a hall of fame coach like Snyder at KSU and how many of them would stick around after 2-3 yrs.

 

[CychoCyclone]

I think so... I'd really like to see that actually... but for as bad as our line has played they style of offense probably wouldn't matter a whole lot...

 

[oldwiseman]

I think we need an OC that understands how to run the spread. We need WR's that can get separation. We need a line that can protect. I think a lot of that is coaching. Those of you that love *'s on Rivals, look at Baylor's athletes that dominated yesterday. Primarily 3 stars. They aren't winning with 5 star athletes over there. TX has far more athletic ability than Baylor. Whining about our athletes is a mistake. The difference between ours and theirs aren't as big as many think. In the Walden era, HUGE difference. It was like High School players vs a college team. CPR just needs to get better coaches imo.

 

[rhillary]

I agree. However, with the spread as it stands we are not trying to be better offensively than Baylor, Texas, OSU, etc. I think we just need to at least get to average (i.e. 50th or so in the nation in most offensive statistical categories). We are almost constantly 90+. Think how many more wins we would have over Rhoad's tenure if we were just AVERAGE on offense.

I really don't care what style offense we run. Just get something that WORKS.

 

[ISUKyro]

Gotta get he o line taken care of first - until then you can try and run any offense you like, but not much will happen.

 

[CyBobby]

I don't know if we would do better under a Pro Style Offense but, I do know that it has won championships for both the U of Iowa and KState university.

I also know that the spread offense hasn't work very well since CPR arrived, we just cant score enough points to win consistently.

Lets Go State...............Beat the 'Pokes from Stillwater

 

[aeroclone]

Yes, a million times yes. We are trying to beat everyone else in this league at their own game, and they will always be recruiting better than us. We will never win consistently by following the crowd. We have to differentiate ourselves.

The way we will be able to win is to do something different. That way we aren't recruiting the same players as the big dogs, and we aren't going against defenses designed to stop what we are built to do. It makes it harder to prep for us in a week. I look at teams like Stanford as a great example of this. Or maybe Georgia Tech with the option, or Texas Tech with the air raid before it was so common.

 

[Win5002]

I agree 100% about the offensive line and was going to put that in the original post but I got typing and left that out. Going to that would require a new OC and hopefully someone that could correct that.

Yes, Baylor and OSU did not start out getting 4 star recruits but actually start looking at their commit list they are starting to get those kind of kids. OSU & Baylor each have 4 four star recruits. But its not only who has the most 4 star recruits, I bet we lose 90% of the time on the 3 star recruits to Texahoma schools for the kids in Texas.

 

[jdoggivjc]

People who think that switching from the spread to a pro style offense will automatically fix everything that is wrong with this offense are kidding themselves. The problems with this offense go WAY beyond what formation we use - play calling, blocking, and health are things that don't just get magically better by changing the formation.

People seem to forget that before McCarney was fired we utilized a pro style offense, and it was at times just as bad as what we're seeing now. Not only that, people cheered when Chizik dumped the pro style in favor of the spread.

I'm not saying I'm opposed to using the pro set, I'm saying what is wrong with this offense goes much deeper than whatever style of offense we run, and until we address those problems, it's not going to matter what formation we run the plays out of because it's going to continue to be a dumpster fire.

 

[Cyinthenorth]

It doesn't matter what type of offense we run, really. What matters is having an offensive coordinator, or offensive coach of any kind, on staff. There are 8, maybe 9 offensive coordinators and/or head coaches in the Big 12 with a better understanding of offense than Messingham. There are x amount of MAC teams that have better OC's than Iowa State does with Messingham. An offensive mind is needed. Not some guy who couldn't even cut the mustard at Upper Iowa University.

 

[joefrog]

Been saying it for years. We run the same offense as the rest of the conference, only not as good. You think conference teams have a hard time preparing for us? How hard is that to understand? We should run a pro style offense, and give kids a chance to play in a system that is widely used at the pro level. Differentiate ourselves. How hard is that to figure out?

Honestly we would be better off going to any sort of option offense at this time. Yes, I am serious.

 

[JUKEBOX]

Been saying it for years. We run the same offense as the rest of the conference, only not as good. You think conference teams have a hard time preparing for us? How hard is that to understand? We should run a pro style offense, and give kids a chance to play in a system that is widely used at the pro level. Differentiate ourselves. How hard is that to figure out?

Honestly we would be better off going to any sort of option offense at this time. Yes, I am serious.

We run a crappier version of the same schemes with crappier players... WHY AREN'T WE WINNING?

 

[Cyinthenorth]

I would simply love it if Iowa State could run the spread as well as other teams in the conference. The simple fact is though, they can't. I blame it on the o-line and the OC. Our position players have turned the corner, IMO.

 

[Cyclonepride]

First, a new coordinator. But yes, I think there is an advantage running something different when opposing defenses are being built around stopping one style.

So I would switch to......




Wait for it......




The triple option






Jimlad implied

 

[Wesley]

TEAM STATISTICS	ISU	OPP
SCORING	151	220
Points Per Game	25.2	36.7
FIRST DOWNS	108	157
Rushing	47	61
Passing	61	85
Penalty	0	11
RUSHING YARDAGE	791	1193
Yards gained rushing	957	1293
Yards lost rushing	166	100
Rushing Attempts	234	248
Average Per Rush	3.4	4.8
Average Per Game	131.8	198.8
TDs Rushing	7	15
PASSING YARDAGE	1320	1759
Comp-Att-Int	116-206-6	152-241-2
Average Per Pass	6.4	7.3
Average Per Catch	11.4	11.6
Average Per Game	220.0	293.2
TDs Passing	11	12
TOTAL OFFENSE	2111	2952
Total Plays	440	489
Average Per Play	4.8	6.0
Average Per Game	351.8	492.0
KICK RETURNS: #-Yards	26-592	15-361
PUNT RETURNS: #-Yards	11-143	9-72
INT RETURNS: #-Yards	2-16	6-57
KICK RETURN AVERAGE	22.8	24.1
PUNT RETURN AVERAGE	13.0	8.0
INT RETURN AVERAGE	8.0	9.5
FUMBLES-LOST	7-2	15-9
PENALTIES-Yards	31-291	22-167
Average Per Game	48.5	27.8
PUNTS-Yards	42-1860	33-1391
Average Per Punt	44.3	42.2
Net punt average	39.7	36.6
KICKOFFS-Yards	28-1781	39-2317
Average Per Kick	63.6	59.4
Net kick average	39.1	35.9
TIME OF POSSESSION/Game	30:30	29:30
3RD-DOWN Conversions	39/103	41/92
3rd-Down Pct	38%	45%
4TH-DOWN Conversions	7/11	8/10
4th-Down Pct	64%	80%
SACKS BY-Yards	10-52	23-136
MISC YARDS	0	0
TOUCHDOWNS SCORED	19	29
FIELD GOALS-ATTEMPTS	6-10	6-7
ON-SIDE KICKS	1-3	0-0
RED-ZONE SCORES	(17-18) 94%	(20-24) 83%
RED-ZONE TOUCHDOWNS	(13-18) 72%	(15-24) 63%
PAT-ATTEMPTS	(19-19) 100%	(28-29) 97%
ATTENDANCE	166362	124329
Games/Avg Per Game	3/55454	3/41443
Neutral Site Games		0/0

Score by quarters	1st	2nd	3rd	4th	Total
Iowa State	21	41	34	55	151
Opponents	48	75	35	62	220 Nothing needs to be said.......

---

 

[Aclone]

Doesn't matter what system we run, if all of the experienced offensive linemen are banged up.

 

[swarthmoreCY]

Doesn't matter what system we run, if all of the experienced offensive linemen are banged up.

Sure it does. This offense, particularly under Mess, is not sound enough to facilitate sufficient execution without having top-10 talent.

 

[kilroy]

I never like the spread under chizik, we've dumped every other piece of **** he drug in here lets dump the spread also and go back to I formation pro style please.

 

[AuH2O]

Yes, a million times yes. We are trying to beat everyone else in this league at their own game, and they will always be recruiting better than us. We will never win consistently by following the crowd. We have to differentiate ourselves.

The way we will be able to win is to do something different. That way we aren't recruiting the same players as the big dogs, and we aren't going against defenses designed to stop what we are built to do. It makes it harder to prep for us in a week. I look at teams like Stanford as a great example of this. Or maybe Georgia Tech with the option, or Texas Tech with the air raid before it was so common.

I'm not so concerned about the specific type of offense, but as I've been ranting on multiple threads, we need to be a change of pace from all the other teams. Randy Walker was successful in the big 10 with the spread with very little athletic talent. Every other team in the conference was running the pro-style (except maybe Indiana and Purdue), so that's what defenses were built to stop. Big slow LBs were not much good against the spread, and it was tough to prepare for in a week. The flip side was Stanford going to the power I when everybody was built to stop Oregon, using 230 DEs and 210 LBs.

Overall our offense needs to accomplish a couple goals. 1. minimize number of possessions. 2. Be a departure from the rest of the conference.

With that said, until the development and S&C of our OL improve, scheme will matter little.

 

[Clonefan94]

Doesn't matter what system we run, if all of the experienced offensive linemen are banged up.

Injuries are part of the game. Seems like every year under Rhoads I've heard excuses as to why the O-line isn't working. At this level, the O-line, even banged up should be serviceable. Hell UNI pushed them around like they were playing a Junior High team.