Pat Downey to 197lbs for post season
- Thread starter RossIAwrestle
- Start date
I'm happy for Dane as well and I hope he gets a trip to New York. But he isn't a threat to AA. With a lucky draw he could go 2-2, he can beat anybody outside the top 20 and could have a good match against a guy in the mid to low teens. But he could just as easily get a tough draw and go 0-2.
We haven't come close yet to seeing the 'real' Pat. If he wins the Big 12 at 197, remember where you first read it. Go Cyclones.
You know what they say about hindsight. If he hadn't been out since November and otherwise been able to gradually get down to 184, it probably would have worked. The lowest he's had to get to in two years has been 189.5, for Sr Freestyle events. Doing it so quickly just zapped all the energy from him...weak, dehydrated and cramping going into the Pfarr match. Nothing beats a try...Pat has the potential to go all the way to the top. Don't count him out just yet. Go Cyclones.
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These seem like decisions from a desperate coaching staff that is horrible at managing a D1 team. Again, we are going to mess with the minds of young men and make them question their ability and blow any confidence they may have left.
Like Judoka said, you can move the lineup around to possibly get another qualifier or two, but what good will it do you at Nats? You may as well not be there if you are going to go 0-2.
This is getting extremely old.
Like Judoka said, you can move the lineup around to possibly get another qualifier or two, but what good will it do you at Nats? You may as well not be there if you are going to go 0-2.
This is getting extremely old.
If I'm reading all of this correctly, it doesn't sound like there is much of a decision to make. It sounds like Downey can't/won't make weight at 184, therefore the only decision is whether you let him wrestle off at 197 (which it sounds like they did) or just sit him and burn the year.
I think the other way was worse. Downey at 184 and Dane out. KJ wants 10 guys out on the mat that will fight. Dane is one of them by far. 184 was suppose to be the weakest weight until Downey took the mat, it wasn't. We need 10 guys like Dane and I would be happy.
KJ corrected a wrong and I am good with that.
NCAA is a crap shoot. Downey (if he qualifies) could draw #1 seed right off the bat. Maybe he wins, maybe not.
This is nothing about Downey and everything about Dane.
Go get em DANE, you earned it.
KJ corrected a wrong and I am good with that.
NCAA is a crap shoot. Downey (if he qualifies) could draw #1 seed right off the bat. Maybe he wins, maybe not.
This is nothing about Downey and everything about Dane.
Go get em DANE, you earned it.
I'm good with correcting "wrongs" to. I just don't know why there have to be so many of them. If this was about Dane, then the decision to put Downey at 184 in the first place was a poor one. If it is about a possible Smith injury AND Downey can't make weight AND he beats Harrington, then I am okay with the moves. What I am not okay with is the constant lack of coaching and management from this staff. It seems they have NO PLAN that they actually follow through with.
Jackson said in his press conference yesterday that Smith bumped heads and got knocked out and started convulsing during warmups last Friday. And that he spent the night in the hospital and was still "under evaluation".
Agreed. In isolation, this rather significant late season 3-weight shifting might cause a cocked eyebrow but not set off major alarms. But it is not isolated.
I will agree the coaches had to be pulling their hair out trying to get the lineup on the mat.
125 - Waiting for Boston and only happened twice, I think
133 - Earl
141 - Meeks, then Dante, then injury to Dante, then outgrew 141, then Boston, who out grew 125
149 - Briceno for one meet, then Gabe, then injury to Gabe, then Briceno, then Dante and now not sure who
157 - Logan and Nardo (Logan is a fighter and Nardo is a little slicker), who do you want on the mat
165 - Tanner
174 - Lelund
184 - Dane (suppose to give up a lot of bonus points) fill in until Downey shows up, Downey is delayed with school degree and rib injury
197 - Forfeit, Egli and waited for Harrington to get back and took a lot longer than anyone was expecting. I really want to see Harrington for a full year, just never got in the groove this year.
Hwt - Quean most of year, Scanlan filled in nicely late. Now injuries and family issues with Quean. Creates more question marks.
The staff was constantly juggling this lineup and I do think it created our up and down season. It also had to be tough on the wrestlers not knowing week to week who would wrestle.
But I also feel if each guy fought hard and gave 100%, a lot would take care of itself. We did not get that from some weights.
I also think the staff could have done things better. Main one is Dante redshirt getting pulled after 1 dual.
I assume Dane was ****** after being pulled at 184 late in the season.
A lot of this is coaches getting educated and tough lessons to learn. I am sure they would handle a lot of these issues different if they had to do them over again.
125 - Waiting for Boston and only happened twice, I think
133 - Earl
141 - Meeks, then Dante, then injury to Dante, then outgrew 141, then Boston, who out grew 125
149 - Briceno for one meet, then Gabe, then injury to Gabe, then Briceno, then Dante and now not sure who
157 - Logan and Nardo (Logan is a fighter and Nardo is a little slicker), who do you want on the mat
165 - Tanner
174 - Lelund
184 - Dane (suppose to give up a lot of bonus points) fill in until Downey shows up, Downey is delayed with school degree and rib injury
197 - Forfeit, Egli and waited for Harrington to get back and took a lot longer than anyone was expecting. I really want to see Harrington for a full year, just never got in the groove this year.
Hwt - Quean most of year, Scanlan filled in nicely late. Now injuries and family issues with Quean. Creates more question marks.
The staff was constantly juggling this lineup and I do think it created our up and down season. It also had to be tough on the wrestlers not knowing week to week who would wrestle.
But I also feel if each guy fought hard and gave 100%, a lot would take care of itself. We did not get that from some weights.
I also think the staff could have done things better. Main one is Dante redshirt getting pulled after 1 dual.
I assume Dane was ****** after being pulled at 184 late in the season.
A lot of this is coaches getting educated and tough lessons to learn. I am sure they would handle a lot of these issues different if they had to do them over again.
Strength training, nutrition and weight management have been absent during this coaching tenure. We rarely get stronger, we rarely have better conditioning than our opponent and the guys that do make what seems to be an appropriate weight cut when comparing size of opponents seem to struggle mightily. This just seems to be more of the same IMO. It seems there is an endless stream of excuses each year but at this point the proof is in the pudding. I don't know any of my wrestling friends that appreciate the style, effort and energy that consists in the program.
Keep in mind Pestano is not a shoe in for an allocation. His ranking shouldn't drop but his RPI was borderline so if a half dozen people became eligible for an RPI in the past two weeks (which is likely given historical trends) his RPI could get knocked down enough to keep him out of Silver standard.
"This is nothing about Downey and everything about Dane." - except for the 11-3 wrestle-off.
"KJ knows his ****. That's who I am here to wrestle for and to be coached by." - a text received today by my son, an actual wrestler who has 'been around' (nearly two years at the OTC; 4x national champ; jr world finalist; and, world team trials qualifier). All of this criticism of KJ and his staff is very disheartening. If this is how Cyclone fans feel, I would hate to see their enemies. Go Cyclones.
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I am glad to hear that the wrestlers are standing by their coach. It would be even more disheartening if they weren't. You seem to be quite familiar with the sport of wrestling and I would guess in-tuned with the history of ISU wrestling. My question to you is, have you ever seen this program produce such poor results? Look at the final team results at NCAA's under KJ. How many individual All Americans have we had? How many guys would you say consistently improved under KJ's coaching over their career? On this years' team, I would say one. Dane Pestano. I think Earl's best year was his sophomore year. Tanner is the same he was his first two years. Last year was bad.
I want KJ to succeed, but it is impossible for me to ignore the facts. And the facts are the results are substandard. I really hope I am wrong, but I think we are going to do rather horribly at NCAA's. And I don't have much optimism for next year.
And PD2 - I hope you are proven correct and have the results to come back here and boast about Pat's success. But sometimes it is best for those closest to the wrestlers to either stay away from the boards or to at least not post. We have seen this before not only here, but on other boards. It normally doesn't work out too well and will create more vitriol for anonymous internet tough guys... my unsolicited advice.
To be honest with you, I have not tracked individual wrestlers' progressions under any D1 coach's tutelage. I do know that Iowa State has produced the most Olympic gold medalists of any program, KJ being one of them. Pat has been coached by several Olympic and World champions at the OTC, and knows what to look for in a coach. If Pat says he knows his ****, that's good enough for me. A coach can do only so much. You can't teach heart, grit, desire or dedication. They videotape matches and practice sessions and they review them...learning from mistakes and try to constantly improve. From what I've been told, KJ is a very dedicated and very knowledgeable coach, who has his wrestlers' and his program's best interest at heart. Lets see if the guys peak at tournament time. They just might surprise us at Big 12 and at NCAAs.
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