At 1:15:57 Brann begins to have a VISION of the wall and its destruction. I don't think it has actually happened.
Game of Thrones Season 7
- Thread starter srjclone
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I think he was watching through the eyes of the crows, and it did happen.
Can Bran see the future? Or is it just the past (weirwoods) and the present (warg into something).
So why can't the valonqar be the baby that kills her? Isn't that the name for little brother? So if she has another son that dies before birth while at the same time killing her, wouldn't this fulfill the prophecy?
Once again:
"And when your tears have drowned you, the valonqar shall wrap his hands about your pale white throat and choke the life from you."
I don't think a newborn can wrap his hands around her throat and choke the life from her.
In the prior seen Brandon tells Samwel Tarley he can see the past, the present, and now the future.
Actually, if you watched the Behind the Episode with the writers, they made it seem like Cersei was bluffing in order to sell Tyrion on the truce. Just before Cersei reveals that shes "pregnant" Tyrion goes out of his to mention how depressed he was after Myrcella and Tommen's deaths and how he feels responsible. Tyrion leaves the meeting believing that Cersei, not wanting her next child to suffer a terrible death by the Army of the Dead, will order the Lannister forces up North, but it's later revealed to Jaime that Cersei is going to hold back and wait for the Golden Company to wipe out what's left of Dany's army.
I don't recall hearing that and I was paying special attention to see if he did.
Same. I will have to rewatch the scene. I don't recall him ever saying future.
I don't think that was said in the show, was it? My theory was for the show, although mis-interpreted prophecies are a constant in this book series/show so is it that impossible to believe?
Greenseers are incredibly rare and can see the future and the past, along with seeing and hearing through the weirwood trees that have faces on them (like the tree that Bran was sitting in front of at the 1:15:57 mark) The people with Greensight, or the “Greenseers,” are the wise men of the Children of the Forest. Jojen Reed had this greensight, and helped Bran understand that he had the greensight too. That’s why Bran can dream of the future and the past. The Three-Eyed Raven was the last Greenseer.
Would they have a major character, the main villain, die in completely different ways and different motives in the show vs books? Do you think D&D and/or GRRM would have Cersei die in that method without some younger brother (Tyrion/Jaime/Euron/Hound/Jon/Arya wearing a face/etc) killing her? They're supposed to get to the same end points. There is no way Cercei will die in child birth (if she's even pregnant at all).
I disagree, I think there will be quite a few obvious differences from Books(if they finish) to the show. And for reasons like the one I pointed out, omitted portions of prophecies, or better for drama on screen, etc. etc.. Not that I am confident my theory would be right, but I don't think you should be so confident that everything will fall into place exactly like GRRM has roadmapped for his books.
No one will ever know since the final book will never be completed.
The show ending will be thee ending.GRRM was pretty good in roadmapping out his books. Everyone knows about the Maggy the Frog prophecy and expects the younger brother to choke her to death. I'm fairly confident (if the books come out) that Cersei will die this way, however the question is "which younger brother."
The show already had differences from the books, like no LSH/Vic/Arrienne/Aegon and a completely different Dorne plot, among other things. The difference is that what they changed is probably not a key to the major characters or absorbed into others. The overall arc will probably still be there. The show knows the major plot points, which I'm assuming Cersei's death is one of them. While they didn't touch on the valonquar in the show, if they know that Tyrion/Jaime/Euron/Jon/Hound/Arya with a face kills Cersei, do you think they'll pass up that drama to have her die in childbirth? Really?
Sorry to be harsh here, however it makes no sense for people to run with this childbirth death theory, as there are no facts or rumors supporting it, and honestly, supporting a different outcome. Not to mention there are actually rumors supporting that she's faking her childbirth to manipulate Jaime and Tyrion. Maggy the Frog's prophecy (book and show) stated Cersei would have three children (citing their gold locks). Could she be lying? Possibly. Could she miscarry? Possibly. Could she die in childbirth? Probably not, as that would be a fourth kid, even if it dies in childbirth.
So what makes more sense, what was previously roadmapped or wild speculation?
You can just disagree with my theory haha. For the longest time I have believed in the younger brother theory and gone between Jaime and the Hound on who it will be, but this is just something new I heard and thought I'd throw it out there as I'd never heard it before. Yes the books and show have different storylines completely, so that is my point in thinking this could be a storyline the showrunners Could do as someone stated before, like the Wire, it kinda came full circle. All of these storylines in the World of Ice and Fire have played out before just centuries before, so why is it hard to believe they keep the option of keeping the main spokes on the wheel in tact? This could be a way to keep the Lannister name alive, if for no other reason than that. To be Honest I would rather she be faking her child, but again, I was just stating a theory haha so that is all I really have to input about it
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http://mashable.com/2017/08/28/cers...season-8-baby-valonqar-prophecy/#wCc2STtpmaqG
Cersei always hated and tormented her "imp" of a brother for "killing" their mother in childbirth. If she dies in the same way — especially from giving birth to a child with dwarfism — it'll force her to recognize that what made Tyrion so "monstrous" in her eyes wasn't monstrous at all.
Aside from comeuppance for her cruelty, it'd serve as proof that Tyrion was, in fact, a true Lannister after all. Despite Cersei and Tywin disowning him as "no son of mine" for being a dwarf, the ultimate irony would be that dwarfism was as much a Lannister trait as having golden hair was.
This turn of events would even make good on Tyrion's promise that: “I wish I was the monster you think I am. I wish I had enough poison for the whole pack of you. I would gladly give my life to watch you all swallow it!"
If this theory is correct, Tyrion's supposed "monstrousness" will indeed be the poison that ends House Lannister. But it'll be a poison that Cersei herself brought into this world.
The Lannisters will finally fall from the monstrous poison of their own hatred for Tyrion.
Cersei always hated and tormented her "imp" of a brother for "killing" their mother in childbirth. If she dies in the same way — especially from giving birth to a child with dwarfism — it'll force her to recognize that what made Tyrion so "monstrous" in her eyes wasn't monstrous at all.
Aside from comeuppance for her cruelty, it'd serve as proof that Tyrion was, in fact, a true Lannister after all. Despite Cersei and Tywin disowning him as "no son of mine" for being a dwarf, the ultimate irony would be that dwarfism was as much a Lannister trait as having golden hair was.
This turn of events would even make good on Tyrion's promise that: “I wish I was the monster you think I am. I wish I had enough poison for the whole pack of you. I would gladly give my life to watch you all swallow it!"
If this theory is correct, Tyrion's supposed "monstrousness" will indeed be the poison that ends House Lannister. But it'll be a poison that Cersei herself brought into this world.
The Lannisters will finally fall from the monstrous poison of their own hatred for Tyrion.
I didn't like the Sansa-Arya conflict. But I can let it go as a way for them to build tension and then resolve it. The part I really struggled with was why Littlefinger would stick around Winterfell:
(1) He's a brilliant strategist
(2) He had eye-opening moments with the Stark kids
(a) seeing Arya's skills fighting Briane
(b) the "Chaos is a ladder" moment with Bran
(c) he had to realize the trauma Sansa went through with Ramsey Bolton because of him wouldn't be forgotten or forgiven - even with the aid in retaking Winterfell
He had to see the danger there, right? It would have made more sense to me if he had realized his situation and skipped town. Or, if you argue that he had no where to run to, he could have played it straight to try to be seen as useful. Then he could bide his time, and try for power again later.
It's weird being sad LF is gone. (I need to take a shower after writing that.) But I would have loved it if the battle between the living and the dead took out all of the heroes (maybe some noteable self-sacrifices to save the day along the way) and then all that was left was LF vs. Varys. I just think the story will be so much better overall if it doesn't have a traditional happy ending which it seems to be moving towards.
(1) He's a brilliant strategist
(2) He had eye-opening moments with the Stark kids
(a) seeing Arya's skills fighting Briane
(b) the "Chaos is a ladder" moment with Bran
(c) he had to realize the trauma Sansa went through with Ramsey Bolton because of him wouldn't be forgotten or forgiven - even with the aid in retaking Winterfell
He had to see the danger there, right? It would have made more sense to me if he had realized his situation and skipped town. Or, if you argue that he had no where to run to, he could have played it straight to try to be seen as useful. Then he could bide his time, and try for power again later.
It's weird being sad LF is gone. (I need to take a shower after writing that.) But I would have loved it if the battle between the living and the dead took out all of the heroes (maybe some noteable self-sacrifices to save the day along the way) and then all that was left was LF vs. Varys. I just think the story will be so much better overall if it doesn't have a traditional happy ending which it seems to be moving towards.
I think that kind of speaks to Sophie Turner's acting performance this season. LF was under the impression that he was still manipulating Sansa, she could have rallied the North behind her while Jon was in Dragonstone, she sent Brienne away per his suggestion, and she identified that Arya wanted to kill her to be lady of Winterfell. And all this time throughout the season Sansa kept telling us all these people she was effectively raised by: the Lannisters, the Boltons, Littlefinger, the Arryns - all are families that played the Game of Thrones to their advantage. I really think Sophie Turner had a very poor performance this season, where the audience was unable to discern her naivety or when she was making a calculated decision.
I wouldn't mind seeing the Night King win, wiping out Westeros. Maybe there are still Children living somewhere who can reclaim the land. But what is the Night King's motivation? What is his endgame? We don't know. Seems to be a rather common problem in fantasy, big evil, but no reasons or motivations to go along with big evil.
