End of January Update Coach Prohm

[jsb]

Iowa State is still perceived as a good job in the college basketball landscape. It will attract interest from good coaches.

but there is no way that we will pay north of 3 million a year to fill the position with a “name” coach.

there are a lot of good mid major coaches out there that will take million dollar pay raise to come to Ames.

it’s all a moot point anyway. The first call will be to TJ. Unless he turns it down, there will not be a second call.

actually, it works out perfectly for him. Someone had to follow Fred. Now that has happened, and by a coach that has never been truly popular with the fan base, people will be even more patient than they would have before.

TJ and his friends should thank the good lord that he didn’t get the job after fred. Orherwise he’d be the one on the chopping block.

 

[RustShack]

TJ and his friends should thank the good lord that he didn’t get the job after fred. Orherwise he’d be the one on the chopping block.

Or he’d have Iowa State in a better position, and not have us in this situation lol. You realize that it’s coaches who do the recruiting and game planing, not the school right? lol

I don’t even want TJ to be the top target, but it’s pretty hard to imagine he would have been worse than Prohm at this point.

 

[buf87]

Haven’t read the whole thread, but what is the buyout & how long is his contract?

 

[jsb]

Or he’d have Iowa State in a better position, and not have us in this situation lol. You realize that it’s coaches who do the recruiting and game planing, not the school right? lol

I don’t even want TJ to be the top target, but it’s pretty hard to imagine he would have been worse than Prohm at this point.

I didn’t say he’d be worse but I guarantee people would dislike him as much.

Hoiberg goes to the sweet 16—he’s the best coach ever. Prohm goes to the sweet 16—who gives a ****? Hoiberg wins two big 12 tournaments—-we own KC. Prohm wins two—he should win 5.

I’m not saying that he shouldn’t be done now. He should but I don’t get the joy out of it that most on here do.

But the standard he was held to in the early years was ********. And had TJ gotten the job, the standard would have been ******** too. And I don’t even want him to get hired.

 

[alarson]

TJ and his friends should thank the good lord that he didn’t get the job after fred. Orherwise he’d be the one on the chopping block.

If TJ was on the chopping block it'd be because he failed based on his own performance. Just as Prohm is now on the chopping block because he has failed based on his own performance.

Finishing 9th\10th 3/4 years, winning 0 games in the tournament over 4 years, and the one non-disaster year being a big underperformance will get a coach just about anywhere fired. Especially when he's ticking off losses of the kind that will get him in the ISU record books for worst losses.

 

[alarson]

I didn’t say he’d be worse but I guarantee people would dislike him as much.

Hoiberg goes to the sweet 16—he’s the best coach ever. Prohm goes to the sweet 16—who gives a ****? Hoiberg wins two big 12 tournaments—-we own KC. Prohm wins two—he should win 5.

I’m not saying that he shouldn’t be done now. He should but I don’t get the joy out of it that most on here do.

But the standard he was held to in the early years was ********. And had TJ gotten the job, the standard would have been ******** too. And I don’t even want him to get hired.

Hoiberg built the program up from garbage. Prohm had some success largely with what Hoiberg left him (and even that success was mediocre relative to the talent) and its been downhill ever since. Context matters.

 

[RustShack]

I didn’t say he’d be worse but I guarantee people would dislike him as much.

Hoiberg goes to the sweet 16—he’s the best coach ever. Prohm goes to the sweet 16—who gives a ****? Hoiberg wins two big 12 tournaments—-we own KC. Prohm wins two—he should win 5.

I’m not saying that he shouldn’t be done now. He should but I don’t get the joy out of it that most on here do.

But the standard he was held to in the early years was ********. And had TJ gotten the job, the standard would have been ******** too. And I don’t even want him to get hired.

He underachieved with Fred’s team, and his own teams have been a disaster. Iowa State continues to get worse under him, not better.

 

[isucy86]

Iowa State is still perceived as a good job in the college basketball landscape. It will attract interest from good coaches.

but there is no way that we will pay north of 3 million a year to fill the position with a “name” coach.

there are a lot of good mid major coaches out there that will take million dollar pay raise to come to Ames.

it’s all a moot point anyway. The first call will be to TJ. Unless he turns it down, there will not be a second call.

actually, it works out perfectly for him. Someone had to follow Fred. Now that has happened, and by a coach that has never been truly popular with the fan base, people will be even more patient than they would have before.

ISU is a good job with a winning traditional and strong fan support. Those are positives that ISU can promote to a new coach.

IMO there are scenarios where ISU can attract a P5 coach and that would be:

• ISU is willing to pay the new coach between $3.5-$4.0M AND willing to pay the new coaches buyout.
• The current P5 coach views ISU as better job security than current job. For instance ISU is willing to provide a 4-5 year guaranteed contract and his current school is not eager to make a long-term commitment (aka just willing to do 1 year renewals).
• The coach views ISU as a better opportunity to win.
• Coach has been at his current school for an extended period of time, but winning has leveled off. Also the coaches appeal is starting to wane on the fan base. For example, during Roy Williams final years at KU, there were rumblings by the KU fanbase questioning his ability to get KU to Elite 8's and beyond.

Here are some guys who might fit some of the above criteria:

• Bobby Hurley - ASU
• Thad Boyle - CU
• Wayne Trickle - Oregon St
• Chris Collins - Northwestern
• Mark Turgeon - Maryland
• Ben Howland - Miss St
• Frank Martin - So. Car

But as mentioned above, things can get complicated. They have to like the salary ISU is offering, ISU must be willing to pay any buyout, the coach has to be willing to uplift their family and they have to view ISU as a better long-term opportunity to win.

IMO it is much easier to hire a P5 assistant or a head coach from MVC, MWC, Big East or Mid American.

 

[cincinnaticyclone]

ISU is a good job with a winning traditional and strong fan support. Those are positives that ISU can promote to a new coach.

IMO there are scenarios where ISU can attract a P5 coach and that would be:

• ISU is willing to pay the new coach between $3.5-$4.0M AND willing to pay the new coaches buyout.
• The current P5 coach views ISU as better job security than current job. For instance ISU is willing to provide a 4-5 year guaranteed contract and his current school is not eager to make a long-term commitment (aka just willing to do 1 year renewals).
• The coach views ISU as a better opportunity to win.
• Coach has been at his current school for an extended period of time, but winning has leveled off. Also the coaches appeal is starting to wane on the fan base. For example, during Roy Williams final years at KU, there were rumblings by the KU fanbase questioning his ability to get KU to Elite 8's and beyond.

Here are some guys who might fit some of the above criteria:

• Bobby Hurley - ASU
• Thad Boyle - CU
• Wayne Trickle - Oregon St
• Chris Collins - Northwestern
• Mark Turgeon - Maryland
• Ben Howland - Miss St
• Frank Martin - So. Car

But as mentioned above things can get complicated. They have to like the salary ISU is offering, ISU must be willing to pay any buyout, the coach has to be willing to uplift their family and they have to view ISU as a better long-term opportunity to win.

IMO it is much easier to hire a P5 assistant or a head coach from MVC, MWC, Big East or Mid American.

Sorry but none of those coaches listed appeal to me in the slightest. The only one of these coaches with any tournament success was fluke Final Four run from Martin, and none of them have sustained consistent success.

 

[RustShack]

The Rockets have an assistant coach id take. He’s been a HC for two different NBA teams and had a nice little career playing for Iowa State.

Any idea on why him and Pollard don’t get along?

 

[thatguy]

The Rockets have an assistant coach id take. He’s been a HC for two different NBA teams and had a nice little career playing for Iowa State.

Any idea on why him and Pollard don’t get along?

Probably the same reason Pollard doesnt get along with anyone. EGO

 

[isucy86]

Sorry but none of those coaches listed appeal to me in the slightest. The only one of these coaches with any tournament success was fluke Final Four run from Martin, and none of them have sustained consistent success.

Exactly!!! It's not like a P5 coach with a lot of current success is going to come to ISU. The coach will have his warts. Jamie would have to be convinced the coach could do something at ISU that the coach couldn't do at his current job over the last couple years.

People tend to forget, when Johnny Orr came to ISU he was on the hotseat at Michigan after 2 straight sub .500 teams in Big 10 play.

 

[cyatheart]

The player turnover kills Prohm...when you can’t coach, you can’t afford to replace the entire roster every year..And then last year two freshmen leave before the year starts, horrible sign.

 

[NoCreativity]

The player turnover kills Prohm...when you can’t coach, you can’t afford to replace the entire roster every year..And then last year two freshmen leave before the year starts, horrible sign.

Those two freshman were huge recruiting misses and it was obvious once they started practicing is what people on this board were saying.

 

[cycloneworld]

ISU is a good job with a winning traditional and strong fan support. Those are positives that ISU can promote to a new coach.

IMO there are scenarios where ISU can attract a P5 coach and that would be:

• ISU is willing to pay the new coach between $3.5-$4.0M AND willing to pay the new coaches buyout.
• The current P5 coach views ISU as better job security than current job. For instance ISU is willing to provide a 4-5 year guaranteed contract and his current school is not eager to make a long-term commitment (aka just willing to do 1 year renewals).
• The coach views ISU as a better opportunity to win.
• Coach has been at his current school for an extended period of time, but winning has leveled off. Also the coaches appeal is starting to wane on the fan base. For example, during Roy Williams final years at KU, there were rumblings by the KU fanbase questioning his ability to get KU to Elite 8's and beyond.

Here are some guys who might fit some of the above criteria:

• Bobby Hurley - ASU
• Thad Boyle - CU
• Wayne Trickle - Oregon St
• Chris Collins - Northwestern
• Mark Turgeon - Maryland
• Ben Howland - Miss St
• Frank Martin - So. Car

But as mentioned above, things can get complicated. They have to like the salary ISU is offering, ISU must be willing to pay any buyout, the coach has to be willing to uplift their family and they have to view ISU as a better long-term opportunity to win.

IMO it is much easier to hire a P5 assistant or a head coach from MVC, MWC, Big East or Mid American.

Well thought out post. But 1) Pollard isn’t paying any basketball coach $3.5-$4.0 million, 2) especially for anyone on that list (except for maybe Hurley, 3) in every single one of Pollard’s FB/BB coaching hires, has an existing P5/P6 coach ever been on the final list of candidates?, and 4) he’s gone assistant or up and comer every single time and he’s proven he won’t open up the checkbook for any new hire.

 

[RustShack]

Well thought out post. But 1) Pollard isn’t paying any basketball coach $3.5-$4.0 million, 2) especially for anyone on that list (except for maybe Hurley, 3) in every single one of Pollard’s FB/BB coaching hires, has an existing P5/P6 coach ever been on the final list of candidates?, and 4) he’s gone assistant or up and comer every single time and he’s proven he won’t open up the checkbook for any new hire.

Well he pays a firm to give him the best candidates, so do they factor in P6 coaches? Or NBA assistants?

 

[Neptune78]

ISU is a good job with a winning traditional and strong fan support. Those are positives that ISU can promote to a new coach.

IMO there are scenarios where ISU can attract a P5 coach and that would be:

• ISU is willing to pay the new coach between $3.5-$4.0M AND willing to pay the new coaches buyout.
• The current P5 coach views ISU as better job security than current job. For instance ISU is willing to provide a 4-5 year guaranteed contract and his current school is not eager to make a long-term commitment (aka just willing to do 1 year renewals).
• The coach views ISU as a better opportunity to win.
• Coach has been at his current school for an extended period of time, but winning has leveled off. Also the coaches appeal is starting to wane on the fan base. For example, during Roy Williams final years at KU, there were rumblings by the KU fanbase questioning his ability to get KU to Elite 8's and beyond.

Here are some guys who might fit some of the above criteria:

• Bobby Hurley - ASU
• Thad Boyle - CU
• Wayne Trickle - Oregon St
• Chris Collins - Northwestern
• Mark Turgeon - Maryland
• Ben Howland - Miss St
• Frank Martin - So. Car

But as mentioned above, things can get complicated. They have to like the salary ISU is offering, ISU must be willing to pay any buyout, the coach has to be willing to uplift their family and they have to view ISU as a better long-term opportunity to win.

IMO it is much easier to hire a P5 assistant or a head coach from MVC, MWC, Big East or Mid American.

I think at this point it's a three horse race:

TJ-- the heavy favorite at 2:1
DeVries-- has a shot, but still 10:1
Matta-- a long shot who might not make it out of the gate 30:1

 

[Cat Stevens]

I think at this point it's a three horse race:

TJ-- the heavy favorite at 2:1
DeVries-- has a shot, but still 10:1
Matta-- a long shot who might not make it out of the gate 30:1

You added two too many horses.

the only way TJ is not the coach here next year, is if he turns it down.

if that were to happen, then I’m guessing it will be someone whose not on your list.

 

[Cat Stevens]

Well he pays a firm to give him the best candidates, so do they factor in P6 coaches? Or NBA assistants?

The only people that want to move back to Ames, Iowa less than Carol Hoiberg, are Jeff and Stacy Hornacek.

 

[mynameisjonas]

What you describe just doesn't happen very often. I posted earlier in this thread or another thread, but it is very uncommon for P5 coaches to change conferences.

• In the Big12 only Self (from Illinois), Huggins (K-State) and Dixon (Pitt)
• In the Big10 only Underwood (from Okie State) and Turgeon (Texas A&M)
• In the ACC only Roy Williams (from Kansas), Bennett (Wash St)
• In the SEC Cuonzo Martin (Cal), Frank Martin (K-State).
• In the Pac 12 - None

So there are only 9 current Power 5 head coaches who moved between Power 5 schools. And 3 of those guys: Huggins, Dixon and Williams went to their Alma Mater.

Other P5 coaches like Bruce Weber, Rick Barnes and Tom Crean were all fired by a P5 program and hired by a new P5 school. There are other guys who had gap periods like: Ben Howland and Bruce Pearl.

I just don't see ISU hiring a successful coach at another P5 school unless ISU is willing to pay a lot more than the coach is currently making. Your $1.2M isn't going to get it done as a lot of coaches already make more than Prohm.

The reality is ISU can hire a P5 assistant, a non-P5 head coach or former P5 head coach.

We got Johnny from Michigan.

I would rather have a solid assistant coach with p5 experience over the mid major crapshoot.