Kum & Gone

[JP4CY]

I'm sure the Krause has many extra amenities and fixtures that a Drake/DM Schools stadium has. Maybe things that are required by the USL. Still a hefty price tag.

Yeah, I don't doubt it.
Looks like the seat cost at Drake was $4850 per for taxpayers.
Say Krause was the low end of "tens of millions" at $20 mil, after having received $30 mil, seat cost is $7692 per for taxpayers before getting into Krause's pocket book.

I think more of an explanation from the group is needed.

 

[KennyPratt42]

Maybe if he wasn’t losing millions on vanity projects in Italy he wouldn’t need as much help from taxpayers here to build a stadium.

 

[Mr.G.Spot]

View attachment 114500

Also, the city of St. Louis was awarded $790 million from SK/Rams because he screwed them. He didn't offer, but they had to sue to get their money.

 

[Urbandale2013]

I genuinely don't have any concept or context for soccer popularity and viability so genuine questions...

What are the typical season ticket prices for the level of team they'd bring to Des Moines?

Would this be a "lesser" league to whatever the big one is (MLS?)?

Not sure on season ticket prices. Here is the new St Louis team which would be a level higher.

They had 3 times as many requests for season tickets as their stadiums capacity.

From a quick search, the Drake/DMPS new soccer stadium was estimated at $19.5 mil for 4,000 seats total.

The new 6,500 K&G stadium has already been awarded $30 million and needs tens of millions more from taxpayers alone?

I'm not dismissing soccer, just the price tag.

That site is also much easier to deal with. It’s going to take significantly more to build this as you have to clean up the site too. Also I’d expect amenities for a high school stadium and a pro stadium to be different.

 

[JP4CY]

Also, the city of St. Louis was awarded $790 million from SK/Rams because he screwed them. He didn't offer, but they had to sue to get their money.

I'm no Kroenke backer and that really wasn't your point. All I did was link a statement showing he paid for a stadium.

 

[JP4CY]

That site is also much easier to deal with. It’s going to take significantly more to build this as you have to clean up the site too. Also I’d expect amenities for a high school stadium and a pro stadium to be different.

Yeah I don't doubt that. Honestly, you'd also think building material prices have fallen some from when the estimate was also done.
(Just assuming bricks for example are more available/slightly cheaper today than a year or two ago)

 

[CascadeClone]

If the city gets some value of having a toxic site cleaned up, then its worth putting some money into that. Whether that is cash up front, or future tax abatements or whatever. The dollar amount of that value is certainly arguable, but there is some value there.

If the developer wants more than that, well then the city should get a piece of the action. You want DSM to put up half the money beyond the brownfield cleanup? Well then DSM ought to get 50% ownership of the entity. That can still be risky, but at least you aren't just giving the money away.

It can still go wrong- iirc Cedar Rapids ended up eating a lot of the ice arena investment when the corporate partner went bankrupt and walked out on the lease. But at least they still owned an asset. I think they broke even, it just took a long time. And they have the RoughRiders which is a popular entertainment option.

What it really boils down to, is there is a not-too-fine line between spending money to benefit the CITY vs just giving the developer a handout so he can make more money. Unfortunately, its way to easy for city government folks to be financially unsavvy, emotionally influenced, or flat out corrupted.

 

[NWICY]

Obviously Krause should be paying for it. But also this seems like a once in a lifetime opportunity for a rich local guy to bring a locally owned professional team to Des Moines and the state of Iowa. Which we haven't had since?? I don't know when. Plus like said before the dico site would be cleaned up and that eyesore would be gone which is a big win.

Doesn't the state have like 2 billion in surplus that we keep bragging about? Throw some money on this while we're at it.

I just feel like an opportunity like this won't come again for a long long time. Get in on the rise of soccer while it's hot otherwise it'll be that much more expensive to bring a team of this level to Des Moines.

Imagine the city of Green Bay trying to bring an NFL team today. Not happening. They only exist because they've had a team since forever, and other special circumstances but mainly because the team was there since the beginning.

Meh got the Barnstormers for American FB.

 

[deadeyededric]

I've long thought that 1) sports stadiums, arenas, etc should be privately funded and not subsidized by taxpayers, 2) cities and states should rarely be giving tax breaks to businesses that come in or expand - sometimes it's absolutely ridiculous.

Sports teams are a business and if fans want them in their city why shouldn't they at least pay for some of the stadium cost? 50/50 sounds right to me.

 

[Gunnerclone]

Sports teams are a business and if fans want them in their city why shouldn't they at least pay for some of the stadium cost? 50/50 sounds right to me.

Ya the whole point is a mutually beneficial situation.

 

[BigTurk]

Here is the thing and it separates this development from a normal sports stadium. The city and state should be doing everything they can to make this happen. This site is a toxic waste dump and this project rids our community of this.

I also think there are plenty who really underestimate how popular this could be. I’ve been to one pro soccer game and never played. I’m far from the stereotypical soccer fan. I would likely be a season ticket holder day 1. I expect this to be more successful than any of the existing teams and Des Moines is one of the most successful minor league sports towns.

I agree. It isn't like the site is primo farm land. It isn't. The City/State/County probably should sink more money into this site because it literally is a toxic dump site. Either way money will need to be spent to clean it, so why not clean it and develop it at the same time?

 

[Cyballzz]

Obviously Krause should be paying for it. But also this seems like a once in a lifetime opportunity for a rich local guy to bring a locally owned professional team to Des Moines and the state of Iowa. Which we haven't had since?? I don't know when. Plus like said before the dico site would be cleaned up and that eyesore would be gone which is a big win.

Doesn't the state have like 2 billion in surplus that we keep bragging about? Throw some money on this while we're at it.

I just feel like an opportunity like this won't come again for a long long time. Get in on the rise of soccer while it's hot otherwise it'll be that much more expensive to bring a team of this level to Des Moines.

Imagine the city of Green Bay trying to bring an NFL team today. Not happening. They only exist because they've had a team since forever, and other special circumstances but mainly because the team was there since the beginning.

You would have to go all the way back to 2021.

 

[FarminCy]

It’s actually the third tier league in soccer for the team he is bringing to Des Moines. It’s USSL 2.

Isn’t that what the Menace already play in?

 

[Nor'MidWester]

It’s actually the third tier league in soccer for the team he is bringing to Des Moines. It’s USSL 2.

The new team would be in the USL Championship which is right below MLS. Unless plans have changed.

The Menace are in USL2 which is like the 4th or 5th tier. The naming scheme is confusing intentionally I think, to make the USL amateur league sound higehr in the soccer pyramid than it actually is.

 

[jcisuclones]

It’s actually the third tier league in soccer for the team he is bringing to Des Moines. It’s USSL 2.

It would be the 2nd tier, the USL Championship, pending the league's vote on a pro/rel system.

 

[houjix]

I agree. It isn't like the site is primo farm land. It isn't. The City/State/County probably should sink more money into this site because it literally is a toxic dump site. Either way money will need to be spent to clean it, so why not clean it and develop it at the same time?

It was designated as an EPA Superfund site. Plus the city got money from a settlement with DICO/Titan Tire, so there is already money there to deal with aspects of the toxic nature of the site. Not sure how much Krause would even need to pay for on that front.

 

[JP4CY]

Looks like KC Current's new stadium is $117 mil for 11,500 seats. So, just over $10k per seat.
Which would make the $7692 seem worse, wouldn't it?

Yeah, I don't doubt it.
Looks like the seat cost at Drake was $4850 per for taxpayers.
Say Krause was the low end of "tens of millions" at $20 mil, after having received $30 mil, seat cost is $7692 per for taxpayers before getting into Krause's pocket book.

I think more of an explanation from the group is needed.

 

[CyDude16]

Isn’t that what the Menace already play in?

I stand corrected.

 

[CyDude16]

It would be the 2nd tier, the USL Championship, pending the league's vote on a pro/rel system.

You’re right.

 

[3TrueFans]

Pro Soccer in Des Moines LMAO

If there's a market to watch people drive in circles in the dirt, there's definitely a market for soccer.