*** Official #3 IOWA STATE vs Arizona State Game(Day) Thread ***

CyberCy79

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I wanted to watch the last 10 minutes of the game, and for some reason it’s not listed in the NCAA man’s basketball on-demand section of ESPN+. Went to the search function and dictated Iowa State and it came up in case anyone else is looking for it.
 

BWRhasnoAC

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The defense was really so-so for the first 32 minutes of the game - and the switch flipped when they went small. They went to the Lipsey-Jones-Heise-Watson-Jefferson lineup after Gilbert picked up his fourth foul at the 8:24 mark. I'm fairly certain thats the first time that lineup has played together in a game this year, and it really made the difference in this game. They played the Watson-Jefferson front line for all but 23 seconds of the last 8:24 of the game - and they were spectacular during that stretch, combining for 9 points, 4 rebounds, 4 steals, 2 assists and a block.

TJ loves to go small down the stretch of games and Jefferson is probably the best "small ball 5" I've seen this side of Georges Niang - and he may be better than Georges because his defense is better.

Oh, and if it hasn't been mentioned - Curtis Jones pulled the first complete game of the season for the Cyclones. He didn't leave the floor. It is really amazing how this team morphed from the Lipsey-Gilbert team in the non-conference to the Jones-Jefferson team now. They are clearly the best players right now and they have the ball in their hands in the key possession (not taking anything away from Tamin and Keshon - they both made huge shots, and Gilbert's personal 7-0 run put the game away)
I like that small line up. Very athletic, good defense and length for their size.
 

MJ271

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From what I saw it looked like Gilbert was gathering himself because he was expecting to get nailed and the contact to the upper body never came. The defender kinda ole'd him and hip checked him, which was definitely a foul, but not sure about the flagrant part. For what it's worth John and Eric thought it wasn't a technical and they constantly complain about the refs screwing ISU.
I thought it looked like Gilbert was preparing for the defender to try to block the shot or give a hard foul on the left side of the basket, so Gilbert did the reverse he often does. But it turned out the defender was more or less going to concede the layup on the left side, which made for rough lower body contact as Gilbert reached over to the other side of the basket. Was it a flagrant? It wasn't a play on the ball, so I guess maybe it was. But to me the reason it wasn't a play on the ball was because the defender wasn't really trying to make any play, he just ended up being where Gilbert went.

Anyway, on the extra possession that Iowa State got due to the flagrant, Jefferson turned it over and ASU got a three in transition. So it didn't really hurt ASU at all.
 
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rosshm16

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Started with their previous AD thinking they were too good for the big 12 during realignment, even the Utah AD wasn't that brazenly douchey. From what I remember.
I recall some remarks that ASU’s “academics” were too strong for the Big 12 (lol).
 

madguy30

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I thought it looked like Gilbert was preparing for the defender to try to block the shot or give a hard foul on the left side of the basket, so Gilbert did the reverse he often does. But it turned out the defender was more or less going to concede the layup on the left side, which made for rough lower body contact as Gilbert reached over to the other side of the basket. Was it a flagrant? It wasn't a play on the ball, so I guess maybe it was. But to me the reason it wasn't a play on the ball was because the defender wasn't really trying to make any play, he just ended up being where Gilbert went.

Anyway, on the extra possession that Iowa State got due to the flagrant, Jefferson turned it over and ASU got a three in transition. So it didn't really hurt ASU at all.

ISU wasn't great but not terrible on turnovers yesterday (12) but man when they do turn it over it seems like it's always getting ISU out of position to get back and it's a run out or good look for the opponent.
 

cyfanbr

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I was shocked when the broadcast said how long Hurley had been at ASU. Mostly because his record is not great, so I would assume they would have chosen to move on by now.

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MJ271

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ISU wasn't great but not terrible on turnovers yesterday (12) but man when they do turn it over it seems like it's always getting ISU out of position to get back and it's a run out or good look for the opponent.
In non-conference, ISU's turnover rate was consistently fantastic, even against the better teams. In conference, it has regressed to just okay/average and as noted by @rosshm16, it feels like a lot of the turnovers have been unforced.

It seems to me like part of that is increased workload and pressure on the guards, especially since MM has been out. For instance, Jones has played 36, 36, 34, and 40 minutes in the last four games, and has 11 turnovers in those games to match his 11 in the entire season before that.
 

Dgilbertson

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Clear path is definitely not what they called
I believe it contributes to the ‘non-play’ of it. Hip check coming from behind on a break away.

Same contact isn’t Flagrant in a half court set with all 10 players in that vicinity.
 

fsanford

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So one thing I was thinking about watching the replay. The area where they miss Milan so much is when the other team hedges drives and our bigs on defense.

Milan has a very fast release on his shot.Maybe fastest on team. They do still try to hedge even when he is on the court but it's not as hard since there is less time to get back on the shot release.

Maybe this is a captain obvious comment and I am a bit slow. But it dawned on me watching the replay.

And yes Milan is a better shooter than guys coming off the bench. But still think that quick release has an impact too.
 
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rosshm16

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There were a lot of “tell’em your brother’s the best coach in the f*ckin’ sport!” heckles at poor Bobby yesterday.
 
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Die4Cy

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I've said it before, Self is "self aware" (sorry for thepun) and understands how to be a to coach and personality on the sidelines and in the media room in college basketball.

The Hurley antics get a lot of attention, but they aren't regarded the same way because they don't understand where the line is. The result being, people just roll their eyes at them, despite their coaching talents.
 
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madguy30

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I've said it before, Self is "self aware" (sorry for thepun) and understands how to be a to coach and personality on the sidelines and in the media room in college basketball.

The Hurley antics get a lot of attention, but they aren't regarded the same way because they don't understand where the line is. The result being, people just roll their eyes at them, despite their coaching talents.

Has Bobby been that good?
 

FerShizzle

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Watching Booby’s post game press and he is such a cry baby. Weird comments about fans, complaining about Keshon going laterally, can’t control, sorry that he fell hard? Weird…

Also Chris Spatula is just another ESPN pawn, but solid research to the extent of continually calling JJ “Josh”. At this point it’s pretty well documented that he goes by and prefers “Joshua”. Probably should start calling Chris “Christopher” or “Christine”. Little things and details CBS seems to clean up.

Road dogs baby.
It wasn’t just Spatula. The play by play guy was far worse with the ‘Josh’ instead of Joshua. It almost started to seem intentional. Plenty of other players just get called by their last names, but every time they had a chance it was ‘Josh Jefferson’ and not Jefferson.

Anyway. I’m nitpicking and generally like ESPN+ and respect it for what it is. I am suprised the ISU media reps haven’t gotten in their ear. Maybe they have.

Great road win. Go state.
 
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twincyties

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I thought it looked like Gilbert was preparing for the defender to try to block the shot or give a hard foul on the left side of the basket, so Gilbert did the reverse he often does. But it turned out the defender was more or less going to concede the layup on the left side, which made for rough lower body contact as Gilbert reached over to the other side of the basket. Was it a flagrant? It wasn't a play on the ball, so I guess maybe it was. But to me the reason it wasn't a play on the ball was because the defender wasn't really trying to make any play, he just ended up being where Gilbert went.

Anyway, on the extra possession that Iowa State got due to the flagrant, Jefferson turned it over and ASU got a three in transition. So it didn't really hurt ASU at all.
This is exactly what happened. Gilbert going for a reverse right there was almost certainly not expected by a defender and - frankly - didn’t make sense unless you’re just trying to draw a foul (which is, of course, fine).

The best shot he was going to get would have been on the left with his left.

The ref said it was unnecessary contact which i still think is debatable. If Gilbert doesn’t go to the floor after that foul I don’t think people are calling for a flagrant.

It definitely wasn’t a “clear path” violation as implied above.
 

throwittoblythe

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I've said it before, Self is "self aware" (sorry for thepun) and understands how to be a to coach and personality on the sidelines and in the media room in college basketball.

The Hurley antics get a lot of attention, but they aren't regarded the same way because they don't understand where the line is. The result being, people just roll their eyes at them, despite their coaching talents.
Just came here to say I'd much rather have a coach like TJ than a coach like Hurley. Hurley hails from the Mccaffery School of coaching: scream at everyone, blame everyone else, and draw all the attention to yourself.

TJ's demeanor is so rare and refreshing. I don't think I've ever seen him yell at an official or get in their face. He'll just calmly wait until the opportunity comes and bend their ear along the sideline.

The yelling and screaming coaches can be successful in getting what they want from the officials, but I'd much prefer someone like TJ representing ISU.
 

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